Engine start bosch issues 280i
Discussion
Hi all,
Today, for the first time (driven it about 200 miles) the engine turned over but didn't start. AA man helped me identify it as the fuel injection system. We whipped the rubber top off and managed to get it started by gently depressing the plate.
Does anyone know what could have caused the issue or might cause it to occur again? I've noticed a slight crack in the rubber top tube (any recommended sealants appreciated), but it seems too small to be the issue...
EDIT: Also fuel pump (I think its the fuel pump, situated down under the passenger seat) is has just started whirring noisily. Connected?
Today, for the first time (driven it about 200 miles) the engine turned over but didn't start. AA man helped me identify it as the fuel injection system. We whipped the rubber top off and managed to get it started by gently depressing the plate.
Does anyone know what could have caused the issue or might cause it to occur again? I've noticed a slight crack in the rubber top tube (any recommended sealants appreciated), but it seems too small to be the issue...
EDIT: Also fuel pump (I think its the fuel pump, situated down under the passenger seat) is has just started whirring noisily. Connected?
Edited by IamWedgend on Sunday 6th October 17:05
Hi
The fuel accumulator is normally situated under the passenger side..normally green in colour, these can cause starting issues if they have failed, mainly when the car is up to temp, they hold fuel pressure to help with hot starting.
They can be blanked off.
Any air leak in the air intake boot will cause some running issues...Not sure about using a sealant, maybe some alloy foil tape over the opening on the top...I wouldn't use anything inside the cap....If there is an air leak then the plate might not be getting lifted enough.
I would seal any leaks etc before doing any more diagnostics...
Ziga
PS: If it is the pump making a noise then it could be cavitation which a failing accumulator can cause...it will kill the pump!
The fuel accumulator is normally situated under the passenger side..normally green in colour, these can cause starting issues if they have failed, mainly when the car is up to temp, they hold fuel pressure to help with hot starting.
They can be blanked off.
Any air leak in the air intake boot will cause some running issues...Not sure about using a sealant, maybe some alloy foil tape over the opening on the top...I wouldn't use anything inside the cap....If there is an air leak then the plate might not be getting lifted enough.
I would seal any leaks etc before doing any more diagnostics...
Ziga
PS: If it is the pump making a noise then it could be cavitation which a failing accumulator can cause...it will kill the pump!
Ah that sounds very much like my issue, Hot starting was the problem, was fine after it cooled down for 20 mins. Cheers ziga.
I'll send some pictures tomorrow to make sure and will try and get my hands on some foil tape (Am I mad to think a bike puncture patch might be another good option to seal it?).
If it is an accumulator, any ideas where the best place to get my hands on one might be?
Thanks for the help!
EDIT: I will also not be driving it in case it's the cavitation! Thanks for the warning
I'll send some pictures tomorrow to make sure and will try and get my hands on some foil tape (Am I mad to think a bike puncture patch might be another good option to seal it?).
If it is an accumulator, any ideas where the best place to get my hands on one might be?
Thanks for the help!
EDIT: I will also not be driving it in case it's the cavitation! Thanks for the warning
mrzigazaga said:
Hi
PS: If it is the pump making a noise then it could be cavitation which a failing accumulator can cause...it will kill the pump!
I've had another look and it is the pump making the noise. Looked up cavitation and the noise isn't quite the same as the rocky grinding you would expect from cavitation, more of a loud electronic buzzing or whirring, like a loud fan or a window winder stuck on. PS: If it is the pump making a noise then it could be cavitation which a failing accumulator can cause...it will kill the pump!
That gives me a bit of hope that it's not too late to save if I replace the alternator...
The pump should buzz..so sounds about right..Before you replace the accumulator it would be best to perform a test to ascertain what condition it is in...do you have a green plug on the screen side of the metering unit, should be under the air intake hose at the level of the rubber cap...?
If yes then unplug it, this will allow you to run the fuel pump on position 1 of the ignition, do this only to test the accumulator...so...there should be a small 9mm OD pipe coming off the back of the accumulator...remove it and cap it off..bolt & jubilee clip, now turn the key to position 1 on the ignition...do not start it...you should hear the pump buzzing, now look to see if any petrol is coming out of the rear of the accumulator, if yes then it has failed...The two hoses going into the front of it is the in and out which can be joined together so that you can use the car still, you may need a 1/4 throttle when starting from hot...If you wish to replace it then here:
http://www.kmipetrolinjection.co.uk/
Ask for Steve, you can say that I recommended you, he has probably forgotten me by now though
If you run the car without the accumulator then please ensure that the capped off and rejoined hoses are secure as they can be.
Hope this helps
Ziga
If yes then unplug it, this will allow you to run the fuel pump on position 1 of the ignition, do this only to test the accumulator...so...there should be a small 9mm OD pipe coming off the back of the accumulator...remove it and cap it off..bolt & jubilee clip, now turn the key to position 1 on the ignition...do not start it...you should hear the pump buzzing, now look to see if any petrol is coming out of the rear of the accumulator, if yes then it has failed...The two hoses going into the front of it is the in and out which can be joined together so that you can use the car still, you may need a 1/4 throttle when starting from hot...If you wish to replace it then here:
http://www.kmipetrolinjection.co.uk/
Ask for Steve, you can say that I recommended you, he has probably forgotten me by now though
If you run the car without the accumulator then please ensure that the capped off and rejoined hoses are secure as they can be.
Hope this helps
Ziga
Edited by mrzigazaga on Monday 7th October 21:15
Edited by mrzigazaga on Monday 7th October 21:16
Thanks again for all the help! I'll have a stab at the test tomorrow.
Glad to hear about the buzzing being normal - I was worried about the fact that it had gone from inaudible to so loud that I could hear it from the driver's seat. I've got alloy tape arriving tomorrow, so i'll patch the crack and any other possible leaky areas i find, then do your test and see if the pump sound changes.
I have to say it's one thing after the other at the moment, cables popped out of the alternator the other day after i'd just got it back from the shop for some broken springs. But I'll shoulder on! I see from your posts that almost every bad thing that could happen happened to your car and you've managed to get her into great shape.
Glad to hear about the buzzing being normal - I was worried about the fact that it had gone from inaudible to so loud that I could hear it from the driver's seat. I've got alloy tape arriving tomorrow, so i'll patch the crack and any other possible leaky areas i find, then do your test and see if the pump sound changes.
I have to say it's one thing after the other at the moment, cables popped out of the alternator the other day after i'd just got it back from the shop for some broken springs. But I'll shoulder on! I see from your posts that almost every bad thing that could happen happened to your car and you've managed to get her into great shape.
Yeah she was very trying at times, a lot of it could of been prevented if the previous owner had not started her up after being sat for 11 years...I guess I learnt the hard way, but hey it's still a lesson ...the V8, Poppy is a different beast again, I think if I had the space and some spare cash I would buy back Delilah, she was such a reliable car, in fact one of the most reliable I had ever owned....my ethos is that if you can get them to a good standard and keep them like it then its all good
Hopefully you will get yours sorted ...they were built to be enjoyed
...the V8, Poppy is a different beast again, I think if I had the space and some spare cash I would buy back Delilah, she was such a reliable car, in fact one of the most reliable I had ever owned....my ethos is that if you can get them to a good standard and keep them like it then its all good Hopefully you will get yours sorted ...they were built to be enjoyed
When it's on the road it's the best thing in the world. Looking forward to get it to one of the meets some experienced owners can have a look at her!
Speaking of which, I don't actually have any clamps I can use for the hose. Any DIY alternatives you know of? Thinking i could shove it in a potato (joking).
Speaking of which, I don't actually have any clamps I can use for the hose. Any DIY alternatives you know of? Thinking i could shove it in a potato (joking).
Update!
I've plugged the potentail leak. The hot starting issue still is present, though the fuel pump has blessedly stopped screaming. I'm going to do your test on the alternator soon with the help of a local garage. Let me know if there is anything else I should try first, otherwise i'll keep you posted.
Cheers again,
J
I've plugged the potentail leak. The hot starting issue still is present, though the fuel pump has blessedly stopped screaming. I'm going to do your test on the alternator soon with the help of a local garage. Let me know if there is anything else I should try first, otherwise i'll keep you posted.
Cheers again,
J
Sorry Freudian slip, wires are also slipping out of the alternator so it was on my mind. ACCUMULATOR.
Took it out again it its not sounding good, missing/not catching when accelerating which makes me think it's almost definitely a fuel pump issue. Guy I bought it from literally replaced less than a month ago so maybe something else is ruining them.
Does seem to have the green plug, so i'll also check the accum
Took it out again it its not sounding good, missing/not catching when accelerating which makes me think it's almost definitely a fuel pump issue. Guy I bought it from literally replaced less than a month ago so maybe something else is ruining them.
Does seem to have the green plug, so i'll also check the accum
Hi mate
I hope this is not the case but my ole girl sat for 11 years and then the guy who was selling on behalf of decided to put some fuel in and go for a drive...
It returned on the back of a truck as all the contaminated and rust ridden fuel destroyed the whole system...from pump to injectors, cost me £1,000 to put right!
When was the fuel hoses last changed?..the amount of ethanol has steadily increased over the years, it is now up to E5 which is 5%...next year it will be E10 and then E15..hoses on classic cars will start melting and causing some serious damage if not death!...you may have some inner hose melting and becoming a problem...or the system is contaminated with shyte fuel, one thing the K-Jetronic does not like is cruddy fuel.
I hope this is not the case but my ole girl sat for 11 years and then the guy who was selling on behalf of decided to put some fuel in and go for a drive...
It returned on the back of a truck as all the contaminated and rust ridden fuel destroyed the whole system...from pump to injectors, cost me £1,000 to put right!
When was the fuel hoses last changed?..the amount of ethanol has steadily increased over the years, it is now up to E5 which is 5%...next year it will be E10 and then E15..hoses on classic cars will start melting and causing some serious damage if not death!...you may have some inner hose melting and becoming a problem...or the system is contaminated with shyte fuel, one thing the K-Jetronic does not like is cruddy fuel.
mrzigazaga said:
Hi mate
It returned on the back of a truck as all the contaminated and rust ridden fuel destroyed the whole system...from pump to injectors, cost me £1,000 to put right!
Oh mate i REALLY hope that's not the case. I have driven it about 300 miles by now and gone through a few tanks of fuel before the issue started though, so I'd hope that sIt returned on the back of a truck as all the contaminated and rust ridden fuel destroyed the whole system...from pump to injectors, cost me £1,000 to put right!
t fuel will have got through the system beforehand. I never let it get below a half tank before refilling though, so I could have just been diluting and extending the duration of the st...Some of the hoses were replaced recently along with the fuel pump, but i'll check the others too, that's a good point.
Cheers!
I would get the garage to drain some fuel and just have a look , ..it's not only the tanks that can rust but also when the metering head is not used it will become gummed up or worst case the fine mesh filter will also rust..sorry to scare you but it cannot be ruled out...I hope its not this and is the accumulator.
Hey Guys, update!
The good news is that the issue isn't the pump or accumulator, it's the hose, which is a bit old and kinked, reducing flow.
The bad news is that I also need a new Throttle Body/Housing, and a new bracket, as apparently the one I have is bodged on from something else and is messing with the arm movement.
I'm getting a new set of hoses and a new filter, just in case - BUT does anyone have a clue how I would get a new throttle body?
The good news is that the issue isn't the pump or accumulator, it's the hose, which is a bit old and kinked, reducing flow.
The bad news is that I also need a new Throttle Body/Housing, and a new bracket, as apparently the one I have is bodged on from something else and is messing with the arm movement.
I'm getting a new set of hoses and a new filter, just in case - BUT does anyone have a clue how I would get a new throttle body?
Adrian@ said:
Might be able to help on the body...I swapped mine, and wanted to do it all in one day, so bought one to prepare before hand. A@
Hero, how much would you want for it? Also would you be happy to part with the bracket as well?If you would rather not part with it I think i've found one in germany off an old Capri
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