Ryanair Cancellations
Discussion
Robertj21a said:
Ha ha, no way !
I just get a bit fed up with biased comments, usually from people who have no first-hand knowledge, when I've used Ryanair so many times without any issues.
I use them a dozen or so times a year, and the only issues I've had is when they cancelled a flight because East Midlands was closed (not their fault), and when they texted me whilst I was at the airport, to tell me my flight was cancelled, except that it wasn't.I just get a bit fed up with biased comments, usually from people who have no first-hand knowledge, when I've used Ryanair so many times without any issues.
The fact that I've had very few problems doesn't mean I like or admire them. I dislike their approach to customer care, I am now learning that their approach to staff care is apparently little better. I dislike their pricing model, and I f
king hate their headache-inducing colour cheme, and constant adverts played at too high a volume throughout each flight.I use them because the alternative is less desirable, but I don't have to be happy about it, and it doesn't make me their ambassador
Speed 3 said:
So said:
Is it really reasonable to expect a budget airline to pay thousands in compensation, to passengers who paid tens of pounds, for circumstances beyond the airline's control?
This was entirely under the airlines control Doofus said:
I use them a dozen or so times a year, and the only issues I've had is when they cancelled a flight because East Midlands was closed (not their fault), and when they texted me whilst I was at the airport, to tell me my flight was cancelled, except that it wasn't.
The fact that I've had very few problems doesn't mean I like or admire them. I dislike their approach to customer care, I am now learning that their approach to staff care is apparently little better. I dislike their pricing model, and I fking hate their headache-inducing colour cheme, and constant adverts played at too high a volume throughout each flight.
I use them because the alternative is less desirable, but I don't have to be happy about it, and it doesn't make me their ambassador
I'd agree with all of that - factually correct (in my experience), rather than some biased view.The fact that I've had very few problems doesn't mean I like or admire them. I dislike their approach to customer care, I am now learning that their approach to staff care is apparently little better. I dislike their pricing model, and I f
king hate their headache-inducing colour cheme, and constant adverts played at too high a volume throughout each flight.I use them because the alternative is less desirable, but I don't have to be happy about it, and it doesn't make me their ambassador
So said:
Is it really reasonable to expect a budget airline to pay thousands in compensation, to passengers who paid tens of pounds, for circumstances beyond the airline's control?
Isn't this a hangover from when airlines were making massive margins?
When passengers are effetively paying for a cheap ticket on an airborne bus, surely they should assume some of the risk? Bus and coach companies aren't liable for compensation / accommodation costs when a natural disaster requires the cancellation of a flight.
As I understood it, the origins of EU261 were down to an incident or series of incidents where Ryanair had cancelled once-per-week flights to some Mediterranean islands & only offered refunds of a few £/€ to the affected passengers, basically abandoning them.Isn't this a hangover from when airlines were making massive margins?
When passengers are effetively paying for a cheap ticket on an airborne bus, surely they should assume some of the risk? Bus and coach companies aren't liable for compensation / accommodation costs when a natural disaster requires the cancellation of a flight.
The result of that was that the EU introduced a compensation scheme that deliberately avoided being based on the fare paid & did as much as it could to incentivise airlines to get passengers home if at all possible.
Anyway - not having a crew to operate a flight is a circumstance that is entirely within the airline's control, the same as a technical fault (yep, some airlines claimed technical faults were exceptional).
It's also worth saying that, in the UK at least, the rail companies ARE responsible for paying out for delays, regardless of cause, including weather & other causes outside their control. This includes accommodation if required.
Robertj21a said:
Gary C said:
Did you get payment for accommodation ?, sounds as if you just got your flights cancelled. However some people were stranded and RA tried to back out of their responsibility to look after them.
O'riely was on the news saying why should they pay for accommodation in the £1000's for people who payed for a £20 ticket. I don't think they actually managed to back out of any responsibility after they were taken to court and found liable.
It does show the attitude of RA's boss to his passengers.
Oh, and because it wasn't true for you, doesn't make it, as you seem to suggest, untrue.
I specifically said '....as far as I am concerned'. You are correct that just the flights were cancelled, I never mentioned accommodation as it wasn't relevant.O'riely was on the news saying why should they pay for accommodation in the £1000's for people who payed for a £20 ticket. I don't think they actually managed to back out of any responsibility after they were taken to court and found liable.
It does show the attitude of RA's boss to his passengers.
Oh, and because it wasn't true for you, doesn't make it, as you seem to suggest, untrue.
Edited by Gary C on Wednesday 20th September 07:00
All I said was that it was handled very professionally, and quickly, by Ryanair. Some other airlines were not so efficient.
To be honest, you sound like someone who is determined to find fault in everything even though, it appears, that you have no first hand knowledge of the situation I described.
To be honest you seem to be someone who can't see that Ryanair don't actually care about their customers, only profit.
They enter an arena where the rules are set out, then attempt to play fast and loose with them. Like many companies trying to operate in the margins, they provide a service to many people but when things go wrong outside of their businesses model, they try to deny their responsibilities.
The EU court then intervened and forced them to pay up.
As o'leary stated at the time
"Somebody who has paid us fifty quid to travel to the Canaries, who may be stuck there for two weeks, two months, six months, will now sue the airlines and you will have airlines going out of business, and the ones who stay in business will be putting up the air fares to recover these crazy claims."
While you/we may have some sympathy with that view, it is the rules under which the airline is operating.
I objected slightly to the way you framed your comment as it appeared try to slant my post as not true or relevant. You second is odd. How do you know I have no first hand experience of Ryanair ?
Gary C said:
Oh, I know you said 'as far as I'm concerned'
To be honest you seem to be someone who can't see that Ryanair don't actually care about their customers, only profit.
They enter an arena where the rules are set out, then attempt to play fast and loose with them. Like many companies trying to operate in the margins, they provide a service to many people but when things go wrong outside of their businesses model, they try to deny their responsibilities.
The EU court then intervened and forced them to pay up.
As o'leary stated at the time
"Somebody who has paid us fifty quid to travel to the Canaries, who may be stuck there for two weeks, two months, six months, will now sue the airlines and you will have airlines going out of business, and the ones who stay in business will be putting up the air fares to recover these crazy claims."
While you/we may have some sympathy with that view, it is the rules under which the airline is operating.
I objected slightly to the way you framed your comment as it appeared try to slant my post as not true or relevant. You second is odd. How do you know I have no first hand experience of Ryanair ?
It's very difficult to respond to people who appear to have an ingrained view and don't read what has been written......To be honest you seem to be someone who can't see that Ryanair don't actually care about their customers, only profit.
They enter an arena where the rules are set out, then attempt to play fast and loose with them. Like many companies trying to operate in the margins, they provide a service to many people but when things go wrong outside of their businesses model, they try to deny their responsibilities.
The EU court then intervened and forced them to pay up.
As o'leary stated at the time
"Somebody who has paid us fifty quid to travel to the Canaries, who may be stuck there for two weeks, two months, six months, will now sue the airlines and you will have airlines going out of business, and the ones who stay in business will be putting up the air fares to recover these crazy claims."
While you/we may have some sympathy with that view, it is the rules under which the airline is operating.
I objected slightly to the way you framed your comment as it appeared try to slant my post as not true or relevant. You second is odd. How do you know I have no first hand experience of Ryanair ?
I consider O'Leary to be a smart, but slimy, character. I'm sure he'd sell his mother for €5 if he had the chance - where have I ever said otherwise ? I have no doubt whatsoever that he doesn't really care about his customers, only profit. In fact, I've little idea why you seem to want to suggest that my views are very different to your own.
He is a businessman capable of running a highly profitable company - I would have thought that even you might agree with such a simple statement ?
Regarding first hand knowledge, you may note that I said '....it appears that you......' - how on earth would I know for certain ?
Robertj21a said:
It's very difficult to respond to people who appear to have an ingrained view and don't read what has been written......
I consider O'Leary to be a smart, but slimy, character. I'm sure he'd sell his mother for €5 if he had the chance - where have I ever said otherwise ? I have no doubt whatsoever that he doesn't really care about his customers, only profit. In fact, I've little idea why you seem to want to suggest that my views are very different to your own.
He is a businessman capable of running a highly profitable company - I would have thought that even you might agree with such a simple statement ?
Regarding first hand knowledge, you may note that I said '....it appears that you......' - how on earth would I know for certain ?
Pot and kettle.I consider O'Leary to be a smart, but slimy, character. I'm sure he'd sell his mother for €5 if he had the chance - where have I ever said otherwise ? I have no doubt whatsoever that he doesn't really care about his customers, only profit. In fact, I've little idea why you seem to want to suggest that my views are very different to your own.
He is a businessman capable of running a highly profitable company - I would have thought that even you might agree with such a simple statement ?
Regarding first hand knowledge, you may note that I said '....it appears that you......' - how on earth would I know for certain ?
So it rumbles on. Pilots have rejected the 'bonus' being offered and their representatives say that the reason for this issue is that there is a shortage of crew because they're leaving faster than they can be replaced.
They've demanded better terms of employment and are waiting for Ryanair to respond.
'Which' have condemned Ryanair's treatment of the customers they've let down; they've illegally tried to mislead customers about their rights and Italian regulators are investigating them because:
The cancellations may have been "largely due to foreseen organisational and management reasons... not random, external causes outside of (the company's) control", said the Italian Competition and Market Authority.
It would appear that most of what O'Leary said on Monday fell short in truth and clarity. No surprise there.
They've demanded better terms of employment and are waiting for Ryanair to respond.
'Which' have condemned Ryanair's treatment of the customers they've let down; they've illegally tried to mislead customers about their rights and Italian regulators are investigating them because:
The cancellations may have been "largely due to foreseen organisational and management reasons... not random, external causes outside of (the company's) control", said the Italian Competition and Market Authority.
It would appear that most of what O'Leary said on Monday fell short in truth and clarity. No surprise there.
gregs656 said:
I wouldn't want to be front line staff for Ryanair. For every passenger who plays the game there must be two who get irate about some policy or another. The recent one on seat allocation I imagine caused a lot of hassle for the staff.
All customer facing airline staff are sadists so this is manna from Heaven for them.gregs656 said:
I wouldn't want to be front line staff for Ryanair. For every passenger who plays the game there must be two who get irate about some policy or another. The recent one on seat allocation I imagine caused a lot of hassle for the staff.
They did seem a bit weary than the norm on the last flight we took with tnem the other week.Wouldnt be suprised if the splitting-up-travellers policy isnt increasing boarding times a little too, as people realise their kindle/ipod/whatever is in someone elses luggage halfway up the plane.
MOL spoiling for a fight, can't see this ending peacefully...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-41344653
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-41344653
Speed 3 said:
MOL spoiling for a fight, can't see this ending peacefully...
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-41344653
He really is a terrible boss and leader. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-41344653
First loads of pilots leave (more than usual) because he’s such a bad employer, then he makes it sound like the remaining ones are somehow at fault for not excepting his kind offer of money for their holidays and other conditions.
They’re simply cancelling flights because they’ve not got enough pilots because more are leaving than they can replace, it’s entirely his own fault.
The only answer is of course to improve their employment conditions. It’s not going to end soon either. Ryanair management can’t expect to treat employees so badly and then expect them to bail them out when they mess up.
Things are so toxic there that pilots are happy to see the company cancel flights and damage the company. There is clearly no goodwill whatsoever.
Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 21st September 13:16
loafer123 said:
According to the news, he is going to recruit 125 pilots in the next two weeks.
Let’s see how he gets on...
Sounds like the right thing to do. Would anyone know how easy it is for a pilot to simply turn up and fly another plane, I would have thought with needs some verification.Let’s see how he gets on...
AndStilliRise said:
loafer123 said:
According to the news, he is going to recruit 125 pilots in the next two weeks.
Let’s see how he gets on...
Sounds like the right thing to do. Would anyone know how easy it is for a pilot to simply turn up and fly another plane, I would have thought with needs some verification.Let’s see how he gets on...
Anyone qualified on a B737 will already be in a better job.
New pilots fresh out of flying school will have to be recruited, then put through a 737 type rating (few weeks ground school and then some simulator sessions) which will take almost a month they then will have to make some more training captains to train them as some of them have no doubt left also.
These Boeing 737 courses and simulator slots will all have to be found and booked, which will also be difficult. There’s no quick fix for this situation really,
Airlines have obviously employed some bloke that has experience elsewhere of reducing staff numbers and
getting whats left to cover the shortfall with overtime.
No doubt this works in the greedy and outsourced world of IT due to the sheer number of imported staff
eager for a heart attack and early death.
Will we be as eager to fill the skys with cheap pilots from the east doing a 100hr week?
Wont be drunk so maybe that compensates lol.
getting whats left to cover the shortfall with overtime.
No doubt this works in the greedy and outsourced world of IT due to the sheer number of imported staff
eager for a heart attack and early death.
Will we be as eager to fill the skys with cheap pilots from the east doing a 100hr week?
Wont be drunk so maybe that compensates lol.
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