Summer Holidays 2021

[PF62]

Pete102 said:

Being realistic, the vaccine passports are coming in at some point. I don't think that there will be a scheme in place full stop by the summer, and certainly not across Europe.

How would a vaccine passport work?

The UK has no ID card system, so you would have to link existing passports to the NHS database, and give access to that information to all the border forces which the scheme was part of. And you need to do it before May. And it needs to be secure. And who is going to pay for it. And it isn’t going to be needed next year. And you have the discrimination issues.

And don’t mention QR codes on a smartphone which is just some tech company’s wet dream - look at the ‘track and trace’ app..

[Shnozz]

Gazzas86 said:

Well then I guess the Spanish tourism minister must be telling porkies then, because the link below says different, if I/you want to go to the canaries it looks like we will need one, no?

https://www.majorcadailybulletin.com/news/internat...

To be fair, Spain have issued pretty conflicting statements regarding tourism, not least to perhaps appease a huge tranche of hospitality and tourism reliant industries from lending support to rival political parties. PM Sanchez issued a statement a month prior suggesting Spain wouldn't be having any tourists in before 70% of the population held immunity to the virus, which even at the (then optimistic as it turns out) timescale of vaccination put the doors opening beyond summer so a second year "lost".

This issue of whether the vaccine does anything to prevent onward transmission seems to be a key factor and one that doesn't seemingly appear to be in the news despite its importance. If the vaccine does FA to prevent transmission, only protect the vaccinated individual, then why would a vaccination passport be of any use or any interest? It allows the alien to walk without fear into foreign territories but unless those in that territory have protection, it doesn't help their own people.

I can see in a football stadium, or a concert, how vaccine passports could have a bearing; all present and entering have a vaccination and thus even if the virus roams freely the risk is diminished by those present. To countries that haven't got a degree of immunity either by herd process or vaccinations, until they can decide if the vaccine diminishes transmission, I cannot see what bearing it has.

[Pete102]

PF62 said:

How would a vaccine passport work?

The UK has no ID card system, so you would have to link existing passports to the NHS database, and give access to that information to all the border forces which the scheme was part of. And you need to do it before May. And it needs to be secure. And who is going to pay for it. And it isn’t going to be needed next year. And you have the discrimination issues.

And don’t mention QR codes on a smartphone which is just some tech company’s wet dream - look at the ‘track and trace’ app..

Honestly, I have no idea, possibly use of a certificate for the time being? Swap vaccination cards for a formal card? I'm not sure, but you can bet that something will be needed for travel, either driven from the UK, or driven internationally.

[Pete102]

Shnozz said:

To be fair, Spain have issued pretty conflicting statements regarding tourism, not least to perhaps appease a huge tranche of hospitality and tourism reliant industries from lending support to rival political parties. PM Sanchez issued a statement a month prior suggesting Spain wouldn't be having any tourists in before 70% of the population held immunity to the virus, which even at the (then optimistic as it turns out) timescale of vaccination put the doors opening beyond summer so a second year "lost".

This issue of whether the vaccine does anything to prevent onward transmission seems to be a key factor and one that doesn't seemingly appear to be in the news despite its importance. If the vaccine does FA to prevent transmission, only protect the vaccinated individual, then why would a vaccination passport be of any use or any interest? It allows the alien to walk without fear into foreign territories but unless those in that territory have protection, it doesn't help their own people.

I can see in a football stadium, or a concert, how vaccine passports could have a bearing; all present and entering have a vaccination and thus even if the virus roams freely the risk is diminished by those present. To countries that haven't got a degree of immunity either by herd process or vaccinations, until they can decide if the vaccine diminishes transmission, I cannot see what bearing it has.

Both Pfizer and AZ vaccines are showing data that they reduce transmission. AZ is up to 70% I believe, Pfizer over 90%, Israel have the dubious honour of being the live experiment set for that one.

Couple of links, if you're struggling to sleep

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-00450-z
https://www.astrazeneca.com/media-centre/press-rel...
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/covid-va...

[Phil.]

Ryanair cancelled my 20th April flights to Spain today and there are no flights being offered on my route until May at the earliest.

[PF62]

Pete102 said:

PF62 said:

How would a vaccine passport work?

The UK has no ID card system, so you would have to link existing passports to the NHS database, and give access to that information to all the border forces which the scheme was part of. And you need to do it before May. And it needs to be secure. And who is going to pay for it. And it isn’t going to be needed next year. And you have the discrimination issues.

And don’t mention QR codes on a smartphone which is just some tech company’s wet dream - look at the ‘track and trace’ app..

Honestly, I have no idea, possibly use of a certificate for the time being? Swap vaccination cards for a formal card? I'm not sure, but you can bet that something will be needed for travel, either driven from the UK, or driven internationally.

And how do you intend to produce these secure paper certificates which need to be linked to a government ID document so only the holder can use it - anything which is not secure and gives a benefit will be sold/swapped/forged before you can blink, thus rendering the whole thing pointless.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/thousands-reportedly...

[Shnozz]

Pete102 said:

Both Pfizer and AZ vaccines are showing data that they reduce transmission. AZ is up to 70% I believe, Pfizer over 90%, Israel have the dubious honour of being the live experiment set for that one.

Couple of links, if you're struggling to sleep

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-00450-z
https://www.astrazeneca.com/media-centre/press-rel...
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/covid-va...

Might pass on those tonight ta, but welcome news. Vaccine passport or not, whatever it takes to get back to travel I would gladly take a jab anywhere for..

[Pete102]

PF62 said:

And how do you intend to produce these secure paper certificates which need to be linked to a government ID document so only the holder can use it - anything which is not secure and gives a benefit will be sold/swapped/forged before you can blink, thus rendering the whole thing pointless.

Honestly, I have no idea! I'm not even for the idea lol but I've resigned myself to the fact its happening, somehow.

Remember the early days of requiring a negative test to travel? Majority complied, some forged them, that will probably happen again in the early days. Its a matter of risk reduction, travel has to open up at some point and an element of risk from people playing the systems in the early days will be tolerated until a more robust protocol is implemented.

[Pete102]

Shnozz said:

Might pass on those tonight ta, but welcome news. Vaccine passport or not, whatever it takes to get back to travel I would gladly take a jab anywhere for..

This is exactly my thinking. I travel ALOT (even other weekend usually) and I'll take the jab just to get moving again.

[MXRod]

normalbloke said:

Tyre Smoke said:

No, but driving around Devon I'm seeing a lot of discarded bottles of yellow liquid in laybys.

That’s trucker Tizer, or perhaps Scania scotch.....

You see that a lot on the sides of Auroroutes in France , took me a while to twig what the bottles were , they appear to fill the bottles on the run .

We gave up on the idea of France this year , deciding to book a UK holiday straight after our French trip last year ,booking a caravan pitch in the CMC site in Cheddar . I do keep an eye on their web site booking area for additional trips later in the year , and in essence the club is fully booked throughout the year , where ever you look .So we did the right thing booking early
Also we have a booking in a National Trust cottage in Cornwall just after Christmas , which was transferred from this year , again looking , that same cottage is also fully booked throughout the year and past Christmas . Anyone thinking staycation this year better move quickly .

Edited by MXRod on Wednesday 24th February 08:08

[anonymous-user]

Pete102 said:

PF62 said:

And how do you intend to produce these secure paper certificates which need to be linked to a government ID document so only the holder can use it - anything which is not secure and gives a benefit will be sold/swapped/forged before you can blink, thus rendering the whole thing pointless.

Honestly, I have no idea! I'm not even for the idea lol but I've resigned myself to the fact its happening, somehow.

Remember the early days of requiring a negative test to travel? Majority complied, some forged them, that will probably happen again in the early days. Its a matter of risk reduction, travel has to open up at some point and an element of risk from people playing the systems in the early days will be tolerated until a more robust protocol is implemented.

More likely to be an electronic database if it happens rather than producing certificates imho.

Also forging test results or vaccinations etc is likely be viewed very dimly by the law in most countries. Not sure many will be willing to do that just for a holiday.

[Welshbeef]

Phil. said:

Ryanair cancelled my 20th April flights to Spain today and there are no flights being offered on my route until May at the earliest.

Given it’s illegal to go on holidays overseas until after a further update in mid May kind of makes sense doesn’t it

[Chris Type R]

We placed a deposit yesterday on a trip to Gran Canaria for late Jul/Aug (apartment in Puerto Mogan) with Jet2. Given their economy relies on tourism they might follow different rules to mainland Europe/Balearics. By that time both my wife and I should have received the vaccine with only our 9 year old unvaccinated.

If it's cancelled then so be it - it's something to look forward to - the anticipation is almost equivalent to the effect of a holiday. I've paid for insurance which I believe covers cancellation - and the full payment is only due in May.

Plan B: my work partner is in the process of buying a large place in Folkestone, so we should have access to that. Plan C: possibly we can 'holiday' with family near Dungeness.

[croyde]

I looked at the scruffy place in a scruffy town that I booked last early July for a week of cold, fog and rain, sideways fuggin rain in Cornwall last year.

It was £700 last year, £1800 this year

[Welshbeef]

croyde said:

I looked at the scruffy place in a scruffy town that I booked last early July for a week of cold, fog and rain, sideways fuggin rain in Cornwall last year.

It was £700 last year, £1800 this year

Once overseas doesn’t really happen then this will keep escalating.

Great for U.K. economy - consumers likely still less than overseas package deals

[rdjohn]

Perhaps another thing worth considering is that the Euro exchange rate was €1.10 just after Brexit on 1st January, and it is €1.165 today.

You may get more for your money, if you wait, rather than contracting now.

[PushedDover]

Shout if anyone wants a lovely cottage on the edge of the Yorkshire moors in the village of Swainby
Just bought one to do up and AirBnB by the time the UK opens up and PH rates do-able I am sure

Walking, cycl'ing, Eating etc etc

[Welshbeef]

Anyone considering house swaps for a vacation?

Zero charge to both parties.

[Phil.]

Welshbeef said:

Phil. said:

Ryanair cancelled my 20th April flights to Spain today and there are no flights being offered on my route until May at the earliest.

Given it’s illegal to go on holidays overseas until after a further update in mid May kind of makes sense doesn’t it

Ryanair still offering various other routes in to Spain throughout April.

[Welshbeef]

Phil. said:

Ryanair still offering various other routes in to Spain throughout April.

Well as Boris keeps saying as an answer to any media about overseas holidays he states now it is illegal only business tourism is not permitted.

I guess if you do then you’ve 10days at Marriott costing thousands so if your willing for a bit of Benidorm at that massive extra expense and inconvenience fill her boots.