Being told " I don't love you anymore"

[CharlesdeGaulle]

trackdemon said:

mr_spock said:

This. Sounds like BPD brought on partly by PTSD. You can't fix this. She will only get help if she realises there's a problem, and you just taking it like a punch bag just makes it look like you.

Not sure I agree, PP said this goes back 15years. I know we live in woke times where every behaviour has a label, a cause, a reason (which absolves the person of responsibility).... but sometimes we just have to accept that some people are horrible narcissistic arses. And if that's the case here PP needs to get the hell out forthwith, she's not going to transform from that list to a loving accepting partner overnight (or, let's face it, ever).

They're both pretty mature age-wise I think, late 50s.

I just don't see how you can leave someone so soon after bereavement. That well never end well.

[trackdemon]

CharlesdeGaulle said:

trackdemon said:

mr_spock said:

This. Sounds like BPD brought on partly by PTSD. You can't fix this. She will only get help if she realises there's a problem, and you just taking it like a punch bag just makes it look like you.

Not sure I agree, PP said this goes back 15years. I know we live in woke times where every behaviour has a label, a cause, a reason (which absolves the person of responsibility).... but sometimes we just have to accept that some people are horrible narcissistic arses. And if that's the case here PP needs to get the hell out forthwith, she's not going to transform from that list to a loving accepting partner overnight (or, let's face it, ever).

They're both pretty mature age-wise I think, late 50s.

I just don't see how you can leave someone so soon after bereavement. That well never end well.

PP has expressed how well intentioned his staying is, but he's done it several times before and is still being subjected to what can only be described as domestic abuse. If the roles were reversed and this was mumsnet, she'd be getting advice to leave sharpish. How long is the right amount of time anyway? 2 weeks, 2 months, 2 years? There's never a 'right' time, except when you're being abused daily in which case it's right now.

[Pommy]

trackdemon said:

CharlesdeGaulle said:

trackdemon said:

mr_spock said:

This. Sounds like BPD brought on partly by PTSD. You can't fix this. She will only get help if she realises there's a problem, and you just taking it like a punch bag just makes it look like you.

Not sure I agree, PP said this goes back 15years. I know we live in woke times where every behaviour has a label, a cause, a reason (which absolves the person of responsibility).... but sometimes we just have to accept that some people are horrible narcissistic arses. And if that's the case here PP needs to get the hell out forthwith, she's not going to transform from that list to a loving accepting partner overnight (or, let's face it, ever).

They're both pretty mature age-wise I think, late 50s.

I just don't see how you can leave someone so soon after bereavement. That well never end well.

PP has expressed how well intentioned his staying is, but he's done it several times before and is still being subjected to what can only be described as domestic abuse. If the roles were reversed and this was mumsnet, she'd be getting advice to leave sharpish. How long is the right amount of time anyway? 2 weeks, 2 months, 2 years? There's never a 'right' time, except when you're being abused daily in which case it's right now.

Have to agree.

Stick around so he doesn't appear horrible, or seem mean?

She already hates him, sticking around isn't going to redeem him. He's already a POS to her.

Grieving takes months to years to never to get over. What's he gonna do? Wait to she's not gone crazy. And then what - wait for the next issue.

bks to that. Go and go now.

[throt]

PP,

Start collecting evidence, evidence as to why you have left.

Use your phone to record her and obviously do not poke/provoke her, just let it happen the way it is.

Record many instances and have you in the recording too.

Best to get as much as possible.

[Alltrack]

Pit Pony said:

That's what I'm struggling with.

First there was 6 years of ME chronic fatigue.
Then there was empty nest syndrome.
Then she had a cancer scare
Then the menopause
Then she was just fking horrible
Then Covid.
Then her dad dying (and her providing nursing care 24/7 whilst he died at home over a 2 week period)
Then her mum being unable to cope and moving in with us for 8 weeks, then January lockdown and her mum.moving back home
Then finding her mother had a heart problem, and trying to get her seen by the appropriate specialists.
Then.her mum being taken in an ambulance to hospital and her mum being in hospital confused and neglected.
Then her mum being brought back home in an ambulance, my wife fighting tooth and nail to get her the care package in place and finally nursing her 24/7 and being with her when she died.
Then arranging the funeral, and now having to start sorting through all the stuff that nobody really has space for.
Each time, rather than rely on me she's made it clear that I'm the worst husband in the world, so.ive watched her fight against me for 15 years. Every little stress, she blames me for. Every big problem, I'm told that I'm a bd who does not care enough.
She can manipulate any conversation into something that proves I don't care about her. If I do something kind. That's just me saying "look at me aren't I good" and if I do sometging that she decides she doesn't like that's proof "you don't care enough and are lazy. Selfish, mean, nasty"
I almost left today. She makes me cry every day.
I'm staying because the right thing is to be loyal and kind and try to help her through this.
But eventually this will end. I will just go.

Health scares, illness and bereavement happen to everyone as they get older.
Based on what you’ve said it looks like she has no respect for you and uses any excuse to unload.
The fact that you aren’t willing to confront her or leave implies a deeply dysfunctional relationship with at least one of you having some sort of diagnosable personality disorder.

[spookly]

trackdemon said:

Not sure I agree, PP said this goes back 15years. I know we live in woke times where every behaviour has a label, a cause, a reason (which absolves the person of responsibility).... but sometimes we just have to accept that some people are horrible narcissistic arses. And if that's the case here PP needs to get the hell out forthwith, she's not going to transform from that list to a loving accepting partner overnight (or, let's face it, ever).

My ex got labelled with BPD after seeing a psychologist. She wouldn't accept it.
When we went to family counselling, after we'd separated, she still wouldn't accept any fault. I explained that in my mind there were two options. She either had a mental condition or was the worlds biggest .

I don't think a mental condition excuses any behaviours. It just reduces the likelihood of fixing anything.

[Drawweight]

You say this goes back at least 15 years and at no point in the list you gave have you mentioned a time where you were happy.

Were you happy before then and have stayed magically hoping to wind the clock back to those times?

If so I’m afraid you’re deluding yourself.

Her personality appears to have changed permanently and only the trigger points are different.

I think you’re going to have to accept that the person you once loved has gone never to return and basically you are living with a different person. A person who doesn’t love or even respect you and will never revert back.

The only sensible course of action is to leave and not look back. Her problems are hers alone. She hasn’t treated you well enough over the years to deserve you trying to make allowances for her latest problems be it health problems or the loss of her mother.

To repeat you owe her nothing.

Leave now.

[mr_spock]

spookly said:

trackdemon said:

Not sure I agree, PP said this goes back 15years. I know we live in woke times where every behaviour has a label, a cause, a reason (which absolves the person of responsibility).... but sometimes we just have to accept that some people are horrible narcissistic arses. And if that's the case here PP needs to get the hell out forthwith, she's not going to transform from that list to a loving accepting partner overnight (or, let's face it, ever).

My ex got labelled with BPD after seeing a psychologist. She wouldn't accept it.
When we went to family counselling, after we'd separated, she still wouldn't accept any fault. I explained that in my mind there were two options. She either had a mental condition or was the worlds biggest .

I don't think a mental condition excuses any behaviours. It just reduces the likelihood of fixing anything.

Since we don't know her childhood, who knows, maybe there's something there. Maybe her mother acted like that. Whatever. Your last sentence is the key - a mental health condition is not an excuse, she has to take responsibility. Sadly, people who act like this can only blame others. I echo what's been said above, you can't fix this, you'll just break yourself on the wheel, your kids will ultimately be better off when you get out. The big issue is that they're seeing her modelling this behaviour, so your responsibility is to get out, build a better life and show them her way of acting is not the way to be.

[anonymous-user]

Woman’s perspective here. Have you considered marriage counselling? Is she open to that?

[TorqueDirty]

Super_G said:

Woman’s perspective here. Have you considered marriage counselling? Is she open to that?

It is a fair point - but the bigger question might be if PP has any desire to go through this after all the st he has had to put up with.

Never been through it but can marriage counselling properly fix this or is it a patch that holds together a broken relationship?

Not sure I'd be that keen on signing up based on what PP has described.

But, as I say, it is a fair point and if nothing else might at least shine an objective light on things.

[throt]

TorqueDirty said:

It is a fair point - but the bigger question might be if PP has any desire to go through this after all the st he has had to put up with.

Never been through it but can marriage counselling properly fix this or is it a patch that holds together a broken relationship?

Not sure I'd be that keen on signing up based on what PP has described.

But, as I say, it is a fair point and if nothing else might at least shine an objective light on things.

I think if a relationship is done then it’s done. We should all know that as adults. Breaking up is the hard bit, specially if you live with someone with mental problems, some could get dangerous

Counselling is for people in relationships that can’t grasp basic people skills, IMO, that’s all.

[trackdemon]

mr_spock said:

spookly said:

trackdemon said:

Not sure I agree, PP said this goes back 15years. I know we live in woke times where every behaviour has a label, a cause, a reason (which absolves the person of responsibility).... but sometimes we just have to accept that some people are horrible narcissistic arses. And if that's the case here PP needs to get the hell out forthwith, she's not going to transform from that list to a loving accepting partner overnight (or, let's face it, ever).

My ex got labelled with BPD after seeing a psychologist. She wouldn't accept it.
When we went to family counselling, after we'd separated, she still wouldn't accept any fault. I explained that in my mind there were two options. She either had a mental condition or was the worlds biggest .

I don't think a mental condition excuses any behaviours. It just reduces the likelihood of fixing anything.

Since we don't know her childhood, who knows, maybe there's something there. Maybe her mother acted like that. Whatever. Your last sentence is the key - a mental health condition is not an excuse, she has to take responsibility. Sadly, people who act like this can only blame others. I echo what's been said above, you can't fix this, you'll just break yourself on the wheel, your kids will ultimately be better off when you get out. The big issue is that they're seeing her modelling this behaviour, so your responsibility is to get out, build a better life and show them her way of acting is not the way to be.

I know plenty people (including myself) who had fairly imperfect upbringings without it making them complete arses, quite the opposite, also have met some folks who (seemed) to have had terrific starts in life but were total dheads. Some folks are self aware, some aren't a believe the world should dance to their tune. The only person who can 'fix' their personality is themselves, but just like an addict, if you can't/won't admit to yourself you have a problem there's no hope imho. And I'm afraid it sounds like Mrs PP is definitely in the latter camp; the only logical thing to do is get the hell away before you are permanently damaged by exposure to their behaviour, time to think about yourself and your potential future happiness.

[MB140]

TorqueDirty said:

Super_G said:

Woman’s perspective here. Have you considered marriage counselling? Is she open to that?

It is a fair point - but the bigger question might be if PP has any desire to go through this after all the st he has had to put up with.

Never been through it but can marriage counselling properly fix this or is it a patch that holds together a broken relationship?

Not sure I'd be that keen on signing up based on what PP has described.

But, as I say, it is a fair point and if nothing else might at least shine an objective light on things.

I went through marriage counselling with my first marriage. Complete waste of time. It will only work if she acknowledges that part of the problem may be down to her. In my 1st wife’s mind everything was my fault. It was my fault she was shagging someone else because I was in the military and ordered to go away for months in end (she knew before we got married that I was serving) and she was lonely (twice).

If your parter (as PPs partner sounds like) can’t accept it’s their fault in any way your wasting your breath. My only regret was it took her cheating twice in two years for me to say fk this I’m off.

[thatdude]

Well, it's happened. My wife told me in a very honest and calm conversation that she is not in love with me any more. I asked her what she meant. She said maybe it's just for now, maybe she'll feel it again in the future. She;s felt like it for a while, few months at least. She says she still cares about me and feels love for me, just not in love with me.

So I dont know what to do really. Just...be very close friends I suppose and make whatever we can out of it to be a happy sort of life in its own way. I dont want to separate, the little one needs his mum and dad together. Me and her work well as a team for him (even if I am bking everything up by not completing 15 million tasks to absolute perfection every day). Yesterday she said she'd like another child. With me? I can;t see that happening. She seems repulsed by anything more than holding a hand.

I turn 35 next month. Just another 35 years or so to go. What a lonely life to lead.

At least I have my little boy. And my motorbike.

[MYOB]

You have my sympathy, sorry to hear this.

Two things you said that you need to change your mindset.

Your little boy doesn't necessarily need his mum and dad together. It's quite damaging for kids brought up in a loveless marriage, and it's not fair on you and your wife.

Your wife and you work well as a team for him. Maybe, but it sounds like you need to move on from this and think you will both continue to work well as a team, albeit whilst apart.

You will need to let go. Move on. Your wife is doing this.

[Muzzer79]

thatdude said:

So I dont know what to do really. Just...be very close friends I suppose and make whatever we can out of it to be a happy sort of life in its own way. I dont want to separate, the little one needs his mum and dad together. Me and her work well as a team for him (even if I am bking everything up by not completing 15 million tasks to absolute perfection every day).

Is your wife up for this arrangement?

Because it will be hell for both of you. Your son does not need his mum and dad together. Plenty of kids thrive with seperated parents.

thatdude said:

I turn 35 next month. Just another 35 years or so to go. What a lonely life to lead.

Burn this in your mind. You're 35. You probably have another 50-60 years left in you. Do not waste any of them.

If your wife doesn't love you, seperate. It's a daunting prospect and a mountain to climb mentally, but you will be better off for it.

[TorqueDirty]

Really sorry to hear this mate but I will say one thing - from the perspective of someone just north of 50.....

35 (and onwards) is a great age to be. Don't throw it away by sacrificing yourself to a woman who does not love you.

Professionally you will be getting there, from a maturity stand point you will know what you do and don't want from life (well more than you did at 20), and you will probably have to courage to trust yourself rather than just believing what every other bullstting sod tells you.

The above gives you great freedom to live life as you want, and say no to stuff you don't want.

You earn these things over the hard early years. Life does not necessarily get any easier - but it does get more interesting if you allow it to.

Voluntarily giving up all of that to be with someone who does not really want you around is not worth it - even if the process of separating is very hard. And even if she does want you around - it is only on her terms, and those terms are frankly not good enough.

[Gargamel]

thatdude said:

Well, it's happened. My wife told me in a very honest and calm conversation that she is not in love with me any more. I asked her what she meant. She said maybe it's just for now, maybe she'll feel it again in the future. She;s felt like it for a while, few months at least. She says she still cares about me and feels love for me, just not in love with me.

So I dont know what to do really. Just...be very close friends I suppose and make whatever we can out of it to be a happy sort of life in its own way. I dont want to separate, the little one needs his mum and dad together. Me and her work well as a team for him (even if I am bking everything up by not completing 15 million tasks to absolute perfection every day). Yesterday she said she'd like another child. With me? I can;t see that happening. She seems repulsed by anything more than holding a hand.

I turn 35 next month. Just another 35 years or so to go. What a lonely life to lead.

At least I have my little boy. And my motorbike.

A bit of perspective. I was 45, three kids living in Surrey when she 'checked out' of the marriage.

Now I live in the Netherlands, with my eldest and have a new partner - in four years.

At 35 you have plenty of time to get a least two or three more decent relationships in.

[TwigtheWonderkid]

thatdude said:

I turn 35 next month. Just another 35 years or so to go.

Don't worry, it'll fly by

[alock]

thatdude said:

I turn 35 next month. Just another 35 years or so to go. What a lonely life to lead.

I went through similar 3 years ago when I was 41.

Concentrate on yourself. Put yourself first, often before what you think is best for the kids. I say this because what is best for them is for their parent to be happy.

The last 3 years have been the happiest and best years of my life.