Lift buttons and jews

[RichB]

bhstewie said:

To a point I agree, but you can see family and exchange gifts whenever you choose to so why use a "sky fairy" as an excuse to do so on or around December 25th?

The "sky fairy" has nothing to do with it. It's mid-winter, it's dark and cold and generally a great time to lift one's spirits with a big feast and a party. In january the evenings start getting lighter and spring is on the way. Nothing to do with religion but just being human.

[964Cup]

Ayahuasca said:

Got any evidence for that rather sweeping statement?

Take the case of Pacific Islanders - cannibalism, infanticide and murder was the norm until they were converted in the 19th century by Christian missionaries. Where was their morality?

Morality = agreed rules of social behaviour. There's no fixed set (unless you're an ontological moralist, which broadly means you're religious). So I will hazard that they had (probably) a quite complex moral code, just one that permitted the acts you list. For example, I suspect they had marriage customs, rules of property, coming-of-age rituals, rules governing who was and who was not permitted as food, when you could and could not kill a child, and so on.

Nothing is objectively right or wrong - even Locke figured that out, more than 400 years ago. It comes down to what rules any given society chooses, and those rules (and the act of choosing them) define what a society is in the first place.

After all, all three of your selected immoral actions are in fact permitted in some circumstances:

Cannibalism = see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uruguayan_Air_Force_...
Murder = pick any war of your choice with which you agreed (or see endless threads on here suggesting that one or other person or class of people of whom the poster disapproves should be shot)
Infanticide = well, abortion, for instance, if you're Jacob Rees-Mogg. Otherwise, Charlie Gard.

[Einion Yrth]

Ayahuasca said:

Mothersruin said:

Morality existed long before the recent (in human terms) religions decided to write them down.

Got any evidence for that rather sweeping statement?

Take the case of Pacific Islanders - cannibalism, infanticide and murder was the norm until they were converted in the 19th century by Christian missionaries. Where was their morality?

Got any evidence for that rather sweeping statement?

[J4CKO]

Jewish Daleks must really be in a pickle on the Sabbath.

[kowalski655]

RichB said:

bhstewie said:

To a point I agree, but you can see family and exchange gifts whenever you choose to so why use a "sky fairy" as an excuse to do so on or around December 25th?

The "sky fairy" has nothing to do with it. It's mid-winter, it's dark and cold and generally a great time to lift one's spirits with a big feast and a party. In january the evenings start getting lighter and spring is on the way. Nothing to do with religion but just being human.

Thats why the christians took over the pagan festival at that time.
in our house its an excuse to get pressies,eat & drink loads and watch some decent TV...no mention at all of the baby cheeses

[RichB]

kowalski655 said:

RichB said:

bhstewie said:

To a point I agree, but you can see family and exchange gifts whenever you choose to so why use a "sky fairy" as an excuse to do so on or around December 25th?

The "sky fairy" has nothing to do with it. It's mid-winter, it's dark and cold and generally a great time to lift one's spirits with a big feast and a party. In january the evenings start getting lighter and spring is on the way. Nothing to do with religion but just being human.

Thats why the christians took over the pagan festival at that time.
in our house its an excuse to get pressies,eat & drink loads and watch some decent TV...no mention at all of the baby cheeses

Of course, didn't think it worth saying.

[Troubleatmill]

Countdown said:

But, by taking part in it, are you not encouraging your kids to believe that there's a big fat red bloke who goes around giving out presents based on how good they've been? Even if you leave Jesus and Mary out of it the notion of "good behaviour = deferred Reward" is the very core of most religions.

Any PH atheists who refuse to celebrate xmas or buy any presents for their kids because they want to abolish extremism and fundamentalism ? Or does that "righteous crusade" only apply when mocking Jews in lifts?

So why are millions of Christians celebrating JC’s birthday on some pagan festival day???

JC (if he did exist) was born in the spring / summer. They just stole the very popular pagan festival day to encourage new recruits.

[Alex_225]

Religion is a strange old thing, personally it doesn't offend me if someone chooses to be very devout as wacky as some of these things are.

If I was in the lift in the first post, I'd have just asked which floor they wanted. Not exactly exerting much energy even if it's a bit of a weird one.

I have a very strict Muslim chap on my team at work. He's a really nice guy and I've asked him various things about his religion as I'm intrigued. He wouldn't go into pub or bar due to it serving alcohol but he's not damning of the rest of the team who drink. We had a really interesting chat where he asked me what beer tastes like etc.

I'm not religious at all and fairly strong views as to why but unless someone is condemning me or affecting me with their religious beliefs, I couldn't care less.

[Troubleatmill]

Ayahuasca said:

Mothersruin said:

Morality existed long before the recent (in human terms) religions decided to write them down.

Got any evidence for that rather sweeping statement?

Take the case of Pacific Islanders - cannibalism, infanticide and murder was the norm until they were converted in the 19th century by Christian missionaries. Where was their morality?

Christian God has a body count of over 30 million give or take in the holy books. A lot of it young children and babies. He is fking awesome.

Oh no wait. He is an evil sinister f@@@@r.

But - he has morals. And it taught us morals.

Religion is arse gravy bks.

[Efbe]

Being brought up in west yorkshire, this thread is certainly illuminating.

Jewish sabbath is Friday, news to be.
Jews can't do certain things on the sabbath, more news to me.
Pushing a lift button is classed as work, even more news to me!

I don't seem to ever remember learning about Judaism at school, though religious studies is not exactly a subject anyone cares about.
maybe I should expand my knowledge a little here!

[djc206]

Efbe said:

Being brought up in west yorkshire, this thread is certainly illuminating.

Jewish sabbath is Friday, news to be.
Jews can't do certain things on the sabbath, more news to me.
Pushing a lift button is classed as work, even more news to me!

I don't seem to ever remember learning about Judaism at school, though religious studies is not exactly a subject anyone cares about.
maybe I should expand my knowledge a little here!

I seem to recall religious studies at school mostly involving watching the first hour of Gandhi over and over again. Oh and once we tried to meditate, I fell asleep.

[Efbe]

djc206 said:

Efbe said:

Being brought up in west yorkshire, this thread is certainly illuminating.

Jewish sabbath is Friday, news to be.
Jews can't do certain things on the sabbath, more news to me.
Pushing a lift button is classed as work, even more news to me!

I don't seem to ever remember learning about Judaism at school, though religious studies is not exactly a subject anyone cares about.
maybe I should expand my knowledge a little here!

I seem to recall religious studies at school mostly involving watching the first hour of Gandhi over and over again. Oh and once we tried to meditate, I fell asleep.

haha, tbh I really cannot remember a single lesson of it. There is a 95% probability I skived these lessons though.

[Mothersruin]

Efbe said:

djc206 said:

Efbe said:

Being brought up in west yorkshire, this thread is certainly illuminating.

Jewish sabbath is Friday, news to be.
Jews can't do certain things on the sabbath, more news to me.
Pushing a lift button is classed as work, even more news to me!

I don't seem to ever remember learning about Judaism at school, though religious studies is not exactly a subject anyone cares about.
maybe I should expand my knowledge a little here!

I seem to recall religious studies at school mostly involving watching the first hour of Gandhi over and over again. Oh and once we tried to meditate, I fell asleep.

haha, tbh I really cannot remember a single lesson of it. There is a 95% probability I skived these lessons though.

We got told off for 'boxing' in one of our RE lessons after a mini riot broke out.

[Efbe]

Mothersruin said:

Efbe said:

djc206 said:

Efbe said:

Being brought up in west yorkshire, this thread is certainly illuminating.

Jewish sabbath is Friday, news to be.
Jews can't do certain things on the sabbath, more news to me.
Pushing a lift button is classed as work, even more news to me!

I don't seem to ever remember learning about Judaism at school, though religious studies is not exactly a subject anyone cares about.
maybe I should expand my knowledge a little here!

I seem to recall religious studies at school mostly involving watching the first hour of Gandhi over and over again. Oh and once we tried to meditate, I fell asleep.

haha, tbh I really cannot remember a single lesson of it. There is a 95% probability I skived these lessons though.

We got told off for 'boxing' in one of our RE lessons after a mini riot broke out.

see, I would have turned up to a lesson like that!

[OldGermanHeaps]

I loved religious studies at school, the teacher was a really tidy blonde with mesmerising tits, it was the one class the neds didn't play up in.

[underwhelmist]

SlimJim16v said:

CAPP0 said:

Upon reflection, I ask myself (and I honestly don't know) whether one can be Jewish and non-religious. In other words, is Judaism a religion, a race, or both?

I don't think you can be Jewish but not religious. Jewish is not a race, as Muslim is not a race.

David Baddiel is a very famous example (I'm sure there are others) of a prominent Jewish atheist.

[elanfan]

Alex_225 said:

I have a very strict Muslim chap on my team at work. He's a really nice guy and I've asked him various things about his religion as I'm intrigued. He wouldn't go into pub or bar due to it serving alcohol but he's not damning of the rest of the team who drink. We had a really interesting chat where he asked me what beer tastes like etc.

Pop into your nearest Sainsburys and buy him a bottle of Bavaria (they do lager and wheat beer) both are zero alcohol. I'm not teetotal but prefer not to drink as it gives me palpitations so I have some of these now and then. Refreshing and though I'm no connoisseur I reckon many wouldn't know it was alcohol free.

[baldy1926]

About 20 years ago one of my staff would regularly disappear during the day. It turned out he was going off to pray and had hidden his pray mat as he was worried what people would say!
Fat forward a few years 2 Muslim guys i worked with. They used to pray on a Friday until some one told them they could have time off to pray. Then it was 5 times a day and never when they were on a break, piss takers.
I now live on the edge of an ultra Orthodox Jewish area, at least Saturdays are slightly safer driving days. I have never seen so many dents on cars and they dont seem to move until they are on the phone.
They have all these small synagogues as some of the groups are tiny - perhaps just attended by residents of 1 block of flats as they dont mix within tiny fractions.

[zygalski]

Mothersruin said:

Take the religion out of it and it's even more bizarre. It needs mocking and destroying, not pandering to.

How does this work in your everyday life?
Do you harass the old folk by picketing the local church, start arguments with work colleagues & attempt to impose your atheist, materialist jihad, or are your actions confined to banging away at a keyboard & posting on a car owners website forum?

[zygalski]

On a further note, I'd just push the button.
I guess we're all brought up differently.