What are your unpopular opinions?

[captain_cynic]

SystemParanoia said:

lol, I'd have a VB script to dump the works outlook address book into the tax portal and submit a request for each person on the first day I had access.

the fact that they are all alerted to the fact that i've done that is the cherry on the cake for me <shameless>

VB script?

Why don't you fax it to them instead?

[SystemParanoia]

captain_cynic said:

VB script?

Why don't you fax it to them instead?

Minimum effort sleuthing

[Blown2CV]

SystemParanoia said:

The Selfish Gene said:

employers that take the piss?

you mean in that they pay one person what they can get away with?

I firmly believe you negotiate your own salary and it's part of the job........most places have bandings, if you know you're worth, say you want top of the banding and if you don't get it, go to somewhere that will pay you it........

unless of course you're a crap freeloader.........and just want to be paid more because the other guy is.......

In my game, it would shut down businesses - as the difference in 'salary' is sometimes 4 or 5 times more with people sitting along side each other

nobody's talking about freeloading, or getting an increase in pay for no reason, or anything like that.

Just access to information. then you can choose to keep working knowing what you know. or take your services elsewhere knowing that your employer thought you were worthless to them anyway.

unpopular with me. It strikes me that the only people who want to know this are the same people who want payrises without having to do anything or proving any value (and there are lots of these people). The thing you really should be concentrating on is that it should be absolutely clear and transparent what you need to do in your job, and what you need to do to get promoted. That's the thing to get stty with your boss about if it is absent. Just worry about yourself, what the fk does it matter about everyone else. You have zero visibility of what they've done to earn what they earn, and ultimately maybe they are just better at doing what they do than you are

[SystemParanoia]

Blown2CV said:

<snip> it should be absolutely clear and transparent what you need to do in your job, and what you need to do to get promoted. That's the thing to get stty with your boss about if it is absent.<snip>

Ding fking ding!!

nail head hit.. its sadly not crystal clear exactly what you need to get to that next rung on the ladder/pay scale.

having visibility of income means you can just ask the person on that next half step ahead of you instead of having to put up with BS management speak.

in your welcome pack/induction it should be

Job is this , this and that,
to get a promotion of £xx,xxx then you also need to do this, that and the other.

this will be revised quarterly at your 1-2-1 if and when these objectives are reached.


simple.. clear.. effective... nothing but a fantasy if you think it will ever happen.

[captain_cynic]

SystemParanoia said:

Minimum effort sleuthing

Knowing Bash/Powershell makes VB seem a little out of date to me

[SystemParanoia]

captain_cynic said:

SystemParanoia said:

Minimum effort sleuthing

Knowing Bash/Powershell makes VB seem a little out of date to me

every office ive worked in has had powershell and command prompt locked.

Yes there are workarounds, ( especially simple for powershell ) but that puts me in breach of I.T policy and back in the dole queue

VB is a safe bet

[The Selfish Gene]

SystemParanoia said:

Blown2CV said:

<snip> it should be absolutely clear and transparent what you need to do in your job, and what you need to do to get promoted. That's the thing to get stty with your boss about if it is absent.<snip>

Ding fking ding!!

nail head hit.. its sadly not crystal clear exactly what you need to get to that next rung on the ladder/pay scale.

having visibility of income means you can just ask the person on that next half step ahead of you instead of having to put up with BS management speak.

in your welcome pack/induction it should be

Job is this , this and that,
to get a promotion of £xx,xxx then you also need to do this, that and the other.

this will be revised quarterly at your 1-2-1 if and when these objectives are reached.


simple.. clear.. effective... nothing but a fantasy if you think it will ever happen.

I have worked in places like this - it's good - it works. If you meet the following criteria, at the end of year if we agree, your rank goes up and pay with it.

Unfortunately they are few and far between, and usually high end consultancy type places.

Normal Enterprise companies you get blocked by some wker that doesn't like you - but then the choice is yours to play frogger with your career - sometimes it's the only way.

unless you're unambitious or lazy.

I also think there should be engineering/technical path, and management path..........of equal pay and stature.

Too many socially inept retards get promoted to jobs they're st at because they want the next salary band.

it's bad for all concerned.

[IJB1959]

SystemParanoia said:

Blown2CV said:

<snip> it should be absolutely clear and transparent what you need to do in your job, and what you need to do to get promoted. That's the thing to get stty with your boss about if it is absent.<snip>

Ding fking ding!!

nail head hit.. its sadly not crystal clear exactly what you need to get to that next rung on the ladder/pay scale.

having visibility of income means you can just ask the person on that next half step ahead of you instead of having to put up with BS management speak.

in your welcome pack/induction it should be

Job is this , this and that,
to get a promotion of £xx,xxx then you also need to do this, that and the other.

this will be revised quarterly at your 1-2-1 if and when these objectives are reached.


simple.. clear.. effective... nothing but a fantasy if you think it will ever happen.

If you don't like how the employment system works, go self employed......very transparent then and much more rewarding. I did and never looked back.

[TameRacingDriver]

SystemParanoia said:

Ding fking ding!!

nail head hit.. its sadly not crystal clear exactly what you need to get to that next rung on the ladder/pay scale.

having visibility of income means you can just ask the person on that next half step ahead of you instead of having to put up with BS management speak.

in your welcome pack/induction it should be

Job is this , this and that,
to get a promotion of £xx,xxx then you also need to do this, that and the other.

this will be revised quarterly at your 1-2-1 if and when these objectives are reached.


simple.. clear.. effective... nothing but a fantasy if you think it will ever happen.

That would be great, I fking hate playing stupid games at work (and ultimately always finishing second best).

Here's another unpopular opinion(?) - PH is every bit as good now as it was "back in the day", if not better.

[SystemParanoia]

IJB1959 said:

If you don't like how the employment system works, go self employed......very transparent then and much more rewarding. I did and never looked back.

I would love to. but I need experience in the industry i'd want to start a business in. to get that i first need to be employed for a little while at least.

started a business in an industry i cared nothing for before.. but that was st as i didn't have any passion for it

[mko9]

IJB1959 said:

Dr Jekyll said:

IJB1959 said:

Also, why on earth does anyone want, and is allowed to freely buy, automatic weapons such as an M16? Surly a simple handgun would suffice in self defence (which is why ordinary people buy guns apparently) but instead buy something to potentially kill a small community in one go.

They aren't allowed to buy fully automatic weapons.
Most people who buy guns buy them for target shooting or hunting, which is why they buy rifles. Only about 5% of US gun crime is committed with rifles, handguns are far more suited to criminality.

They are legal, but more restricted.........no more difficult to obtain than a UK shotgun licence.

Machine Guns Are Legal: A Practical Guide to Full Auto - The Firearm Blog
Here is what it takes to own a weapon capable of full auto
Pay a tax of $200, which in 1934 was worth over $3,500
Fill out a lengthy application to register your gun with the federal government
Submit photographs
Submit passport photos
Get your chief law enforcement official to sign your application
Wait for the results of your background check to come back
An assault rifle is fed by a box magazine, uses an intermediate round and is capable of full auto and /or burst fire as well as semi automatic so they are treated like machine guns. If you have an AK or AR that is semiauto only it is not an assault rifle.

That's true as far as it goes, but actually finding an automatic weapon to buy can be challenging. They haven't been legal to produce or import for private use since 1968, so there is a limited supply. And they generally cost $10-20,000 depending on type, etc.

[Blown2CV]

SystemParanoia said:

Blown2CV said:

<snip> it should be absolutely clear and transparent what you need to do in your job, and what you need to do to get promoted. That's the thing to get stty with your boss about if it is absent.<snip>

Ding fking ding!!

nail head hit.. its sadly not crystal clear exactly what you need to get to that next rung on the ladder/pay scale.

having visibility of income means you can just ask the person on that next half step ahead of you instead of having to put up with BS management speak.

in your welcome pack/induction it should be

Job is this , this and that,
to get a promotion of £xx,xxx then you also need to do this, that and the other.

this will be revised quarterly at your 1-2-1 if and when these objectives are reached.


simple.. clear.. effective... nothing but a fantasy if you think it will ever happen.

nah that's horsest. If it's not clear what you need to do, it's your manager's and the company's fault, NOT your fellow employees. Other people shouldn't have to divulge private information to you just because you want them to. You are using 'help me figure out what i need to do to get promoted' as a proxy for 'whinge whinge i knew it, look boss i see that fred earns more than me i want a pay rise NOW wah wah'.

I work for a global company and it IS clear what attributes i need to demonstrate, what qualities i need to have, what experience i need to have, but the core concepts need to be translated from the job grade to the job role, and as each person is variously excellent or deficient in a variety of areas it HAS to be bespoke for each person. There is a relatively fixed increment for grade promotions. There are no 'pay rises' because that st should NOT exist - you should earn what you have demonstrated you are worth, and if you want more you have to demonstrate more. There should be no concept of a rise, just because. Ultimately the standard grade promotion increments are small compared with leaving and going to work elsewhere. Maybe ALL the people in your department did that. So, why don't you do that too.

If you suspect other people earn more than you then they probably do. Maybe turn the lens on yourself, because if everyone earns more than you, then it's not those people who are the problem element there.

You're basically saying we should all be forced to go around naked because some people have nicer clothes than other people. Ridiculous communist wk!!

[IJB1959]

SystemParanoia said:

IJB1959 said:

If you don't like how the employment system works, go self employed......very transparent then and much more rewarding. I did and never looked back.

I would love to. but I need experience in the industry i'd want to start a business in. to get that i first need to be employed for a little while at least.

started a business in an industry i cared nothing for before.. but that was st as i didn't have any passion for it

I worked in IT for a well known corporate doing CAT5 cabling in stores all over the country. It was great at first until the company rapidly grew it's franchises and a new clueless IT director was bought in as my boss earning 150k which was 5 x mine (he was a golfing mate of the CEO with no experience ) then I hated every moment of it especially as he was asking me how to do things more productively, then implementing them and reporting back to the board as his ideas to make him look good.

So fed up I resigned and went self employed fitting bathrooms (something I knew about at least) as I was a keen and competent in plumbing & tiling and did lots at home. Started doing small jobs, then bigger ones as confidence grew and customers were happy. Now turn over 4m with a showroom as well, and have also have supplied & installed some well known faces.

It's a very daunting prospect at first and requires lots of time, effort, commitment, and sacrifice, especially with bills, kids, and a mortgage, but the end result is well worth it IMO.

[TameRacingDriver]

Blown2CV said:

I work for a global company and it IS clear what attributes i need to demonstrate, what qualities i need to have, what experience i need to have, but the core concepts need to be translated from the job grade to the job role, and as each person is variously excellent or deficient in a variety of areas it HAS to be bespoke for each person.

Yes, we have those criteria as well, but the fact is, there are some unwritten variables that often seem to get some people ahead of others whether they are better at their job or not, and that has been the case in every place I've worked. Generally, a certain amount of brown-nosing, by and large. Some call it "playing the game". I dare say in most organisations, you could do your job perfectly, and still be overlooked by someone who is better at "playing a game", or whatever you want to label it as. There are lots of people who get where they are, not through competence, but because they have their tongues lodged where the sun don't shine, or are excessively shouty, or add any number of possible reasons that don't involve doing your actual core roles to a high standard.

I would love to see a fairer system based on proven criteria alone rather than just bias which unfortunately is rampant everywhere. I mean, I have personally witnessed people getting promoted because they play golf with the boss, yet they are absolutely dire at their job. How is that fair? (I know, lifes a bh, get on with it, yada yada).

I'm obviously happy that this is not the case where you work though

[The Selfish Gene]

"playing the game" - or - maybe, just not being a fking dick head.

I hire on personality a lot. The CV and me checking tells if the person can do the job.

I want to know that person won't upset the team and will be part of it.

Some could say that's brown nosing, but in my experience it rarely is.

People hire people like themselves..............if you don't fit in, don't blame the other guy for being better at communication and social awareness etc

[Blown2CV]

every company tries to take subjectivity out of the process completely, and some get kind of close. However it is impossible to do completely, because the people recommending you have to know you. They either know you and like you, know you and think you are a cock, or worse still... don't really know you well enough either way. As much as you might try and prove your case, someone has to sell you based upon it, because you will be up against other people, most of whom will be decent at their job (you'd expect). Many companies are doing away with formal performance management processes anyway, so there is a move back to "he's a good guy". People who don't know how to network or manage upward refer to it as "brown nosing" because they assume it's all about laughing at your boss's jokes etc. It isn't. You need to make them look good in their job against their objectives.

[V8mate]

The Selfish Gene said:

People hire people like themselves..............

A notable reason underlying the UK's poor productivity.

[The Selfish Gene]

V8mate said:

The Selfish Gene said:

People hire people like themselves..............

A notable reason underlying the UK's poor productivity.

I think it can go both ways..................I like having a team of people that get along.

The problem is, interviewing..........I guess I've done maybe 1500 (roughly two per working week for 20 years)

So, I know, that I'm as inclusive as I can be. However, should I not be - I always always have two other people in the interview. I change them regularly.

I can imagine though - how easy it is for people to ignore their bias..........and hire people that maybe not best for the job, based on non-inclusive criteria.

[TameRacingDriver]

The Selfish Gene said:

"playing the game" - or - maybe, just not being a fking dick head.

I hire on personality a lot. The CV and me checking tells if the person can do the job.

I want to know that person won't upset the team and will be part of it.

Some could say that's brown nosing, but in my experience it rarely is.

People hire people like themselves..............if you don't fit in, don't blame the other guy for being better at communication and social awareness etc

I would absolutely love a boss like you (seriously).

My current boss does seem to like me, so we'll see...

I have worked for some absolute, utter s over the years, luckily not recently, touch wood. I stand by what I said there, but I grant you, there are exceptions.

[The Selfish Gene]

oh yeah I know for sure - I can't say much on a forum as it's too easy to be tracked down........

but recently I've had experience of the absolute worst I've seen anywhere in 20 years.

This person is actively (subtly) trying to bully someone into leaving because they are not of a demographic they particularly want, and the salary they were offered (this boss inherited this person when teams merged) has a direct impact on the new boss's bonus - as that person is incentivised to save money.

It's literally an absolute disgrace.

I've seen it before, but never this bad.

I'm helping though in my own way, and the person (who is fabulous at their job) will be going to a better paid job somewhere else quite soon. Seems a shame to let the new boss win, but.........what's best for the employee is best for the employee - and the current toxic environment is not best.

(PS thanks for compliment)