End of tether with our son
Discussion
jimPH said:
Can anyone else sense the irony of chastising him for excessive use of the PlayStation, while asking for advice on an internet forum, of which the advice is to "do an activity in the real world"
Sorry to hear about your issue with your son though, hope you can work it out.
I can Sorry to hear about your issue with your son though, hope you can work it out.
but everywhere real is closed on SundayOO Beckton said:
Sorry to hear that Croyde. I've got all this to look forward to(!)
Know its probably crossed your mind, and I don't mean to be unkind, but could your son's aggression/depression be primarily caused by you and your ex- not living together/ you not being in the family home?
I wouldn't have thought a 6"2 lad in an independent school was being bullied, nor that his history of bullying was still was upsetting him. I would guess your son's behaviour and mood is mostly being affected by:
- academic/social fears related to missing so much school
- addiction to online gaming
- smoking weed, drinking or other drugs
But that's all guess work. I'd suggest you sit down with him, and mum, and calmly tell him that you are taking away the games machine/smartphone midweek, and that if he's rude to his mother, he comes to live with you in your rented accommodation, where you can make him study/read of an evening and earn back his gaming/internet privileges. He'll rebel and hate it, but if you are consistent, it will definitely lead to long-term improvement,
Easy for me to give advice, not sure what I'd do. Best of luck mate.
I guess it doesn't have to a physical form of bullying, more the subtle psychological bullying by others who realise he has a weak spot they can play on - an angry guy/loner/gay/no girl friend etc ??.. Is this another case of someone who has few 'friends' on Facebook ?Know its probably crossed your mind, and I don't mean to be unkind, but could your son's aggression/depression be primarily caused by you and your ex- not living together/ you not being in the family home?
I wouldn't have thought a 6"2 lad in an independent school was being bullied, nor that his history of bullying was still was upsetting him. I would guess your son's behaviour and mood is mostly being affected by:
- academic/social fears related to missing so much school
- addiction to online gaming
- smoking weed, drinking or other drugs
But that's all guess work. I'd suggest you sit down with him, and mum, and calmly tell him that you are taking away the games machine/smartphone midweek, and that if he's rude to his mother, he comes to live with you in your rented accommodation, where you can make him study/read of an evening and earn back his gaming/internet privileges. He'll rebel and hate it, but if you are consistent, it will definitely lead to long-term improvement,
Easy for me to give advice, not sure what I'd do. Best of luck mate.
CrgT16 said:
Sorry to hear that, it’s a sad situation. Could be many things as stated before. Why was he bullied at school initially? Probably has a component of that maybe adding the split with your wife. Seems to me he is angry with everyone and life in general but he also has been through a lot himself at earlier formative years.
Frank talking at an equal level and neutral grounds would be my choice. Why not bring him up to the countryside one weekend and go for a walk and pub lunch just you and him? That could help him to actually speak out what he feels/thinks?
Going harsh and shouty might exacerbate the problem but you know your lad might be what he needs also. Best of luck.
Walking and talking is great because it's side by side. Direct confrontation face to face, even done gently, can often make it difficult for them to open up.Frank talking at an equal level and neutral grounds would be my choice. Why not bring him up to the countryside one weekend and go for a walk and pub lunch just you and him? That could help him to actually speak out what he feels/thinks?
Going harsh and shouty might exacerbate the problem but you know your lad might be what he needs also. Best of luck.
Lots of possible reasons given, depression, bullying, relationship split of parents, etc.
Could be, but could also be that he's just a self centred self entitled little s
t who just wants to do what he wants to do.
Went though something similar with an ex's son. He'd stay up all night till 3am on his computer and treated her with utter contempt (it never got physical whilst I was still involved, it wouldn't surprise me if that's changed since - I hope not).
He flunked out of his first year at university because he didn't get up and go to lectures, but his mum fixed it for him to retake that year as he said that's what he wanted.
Thing is, there were lots of 'reasons' put forward for his behaviour. He was depressed (evidence being things like he'd lost weight whilst at university but ignoring the fact that he ate like a horse when it was put in front of him - truth was he couldn't be bothered to look after himself). Also he apparently didn't get on with his housemates, a theory that rather fell out of bed when we went to see him once and were told by him that he couldn't see us until late afternoon as he was on a 24hr 'charity' games playing binge with these housemates he apparently didn't get on with...
All the labels actually did was excuse his behaviour and allow him to carry on behaving exactly how he liked.
My point being, address his behaviour rather than being in a hurry to hang a label on it which will just facilitate his carrying on like it.
Could be, but could also be that he's just a self centred self entitled little s
t who just wants to do what he wants to do. Went though something similar with an ex's son. He'd stay up all night till 3am on his computer and treated her with utter contempt (it never got physical whilst I was still involved, it wouldn't surprise me if that's changed since - I hope not).
He flunked out of his first year at university because he didn't get up and go to lectures, but his mum fixed it for him to retake that year as he said that's what he wanted.
Thing is, there were lots of 'reasons' put forward for his behaviour. He was depressed (evidence being things like he'd lost weight whilst at university but ignoring the fact that he ate like a horse when it was put in front of him - truth was he couldn't be bothered to look after himself). Also he apparently didn't get on with his housemates, a theory that rather fell out of bed when we went to see him once and were told by him that he couldn't see us until late afternoon as he was on a 24hr 'charity' games playing binge with these housemates he apparently didn't get on with...
All the labels actually did was excuse his behaviour and allow him to carry on behaving exactly how he liked.
My point being, address his behaviour rather than being in a hurry to hang a label on it which will just facilitate his carrying on like it.
schmalex said:
Limiting time on devices is the key IMO. Our 14yo lad is gifted 2 hours playing time at the weekend. He can earn additional time in 15 minute chunks through good deeds / showing respect, but loses time in 30 minute chunks if he starts swearing at us / showing no respect etc. It seems to work for him as he has clear guidelines on how he can gain and lose time.
I was far from a model child, but the idea of a child swearing at his parents was completely unimaginable when I was a kid! If I had, losing 30 mins of playing games would have been the very least of my worries..! Times have changed.
Ari said:
I was far from a model child, but the idea of a child swearing at his parents was completely unimaginable when I was a kid! If I had, losing 30 mins of playing games would have been the very least of my worries..!
Times have changed.
I would've been dropped kicked over the fence!Times have changed.
mickk said:
Ari said:
I was far from a model child, but the idea of a child swearing at his parents was completely unimaginable when I was a kid! If I had, losing 30 mins of playing games would have been the very least of my worries..!
Times have changed.
I would've been dropped kicked over the fence!Times have changed.
Ari said:
schmalex said:
Limiting time on devices is the key IMO. Our 14yo lad is gifted 2 hours playing time at the weekend. He can earn additional time in 15 minute chunks through good deeds / showing respect, but loses time in 30 minute chunks if he starts swearing at us / showing no respect etc. It seems to work for him as he has clear guidelines on how he can gain and lose time.
I was far from a model child, but the idea of a child swearing at his parents was completely unimaginable when I was a kid! If I had, losing 30 mins of playing games would have been the very least of my worries..! Times have changed.
I promise, though, gaming machines / phones etc have a huge amount to answer for. More than a couple of hours on them at a time and kids turn into nasty, angry people.
The Mad Monk said:
Report him to the police for theft and follow through from there.
I don't know? Have you considered that?
If he stole more than once then yes, he needs to learn law and consequence. At the moment he has none.I don't know? Have you considered that?
Most children will go through a psychopathic stage (varying degrees), if they don't learn consequence when going through it, then they tend to become awful adults.
Good luck OP, your threads on here really can make sad reading, and I do hope it all ends up well for you one day soon.
Op this sounds like a massive pain, all the best with it.
The suggestion of a sporty, reasonably firm boarding school sounds good. I have had a little bit to do with boarding school through my work and it seems to me like a good way to sort this out.
If he's only got a couple of years of school left, could you talk to a someone about financing it somehow? Perhaps the school will let you spread the payments or could you borrow a bit?
All the best with it anyway.
The suggestion of a sporty, reasonably firm boarding school sounds good. I have had a little bit to do with boarding school through my work and it seems to me like a good way to sort this out.
If he's only got a couple of years of school left, could you talk to a someone about financing it somehow? Perhaps the school will let you spread the payments or could you borrow a bit?
All the best with it anyway.
OP, sorry to hear of your problems.
To understand this story you'll need to remember who Harry Enfield's 'Kevin the Teenager' was:
Back in the 1990's, I had a colleague Alison, who was married with 4 daughters; the youngest Grace, about three or Four, the oldest Emma about 14. Once she became a teenager Emma became 'difficult' -mood swings, snapping a parents etc etc (seemingly nothing too bad). Then she introduced them to her first 'boyfriend'. The family were concerned with the age gap because, although he went to the same school, he had (just) turned 16. On the principal of 'keeping your daughter close and your daughter's boyfriends even closer' the family took him with them on holiday. A couple of weeks later Alison returned home to see an package from Truprint containing photos (this was before digital photos) - she opened them without realising they were addressed to Emma. In amongst the 'normal' holiday snaps were some of Emma artistically posing 'topless' - obviously the sh*t hit the fan....... boyfriend threatened with police etc etc. Emma became even more problematical so, in order to make her feel more 'grown up' the family agreed that rather than her Mum take her shopping for clothes she would be given a clothing allowance.
First months clothing allowance & she went into town on her own to buy a school uniform skirt - the obvious happened: skirt being too short / slit up the side etc. Major row: Mum demands that she accompanies Emma back to shop for her to change it. When Alison took her to the shop she (Alison) later admitted she made the mistake of not saying, to the assistant - and in front of Emma, simply that the skirt didn't fit but that it made her little girl look like a tart. Emma blows up in front of everyone in the shop "you are so unfair, you hate me, treat me like a child etc" This is a Saturday afternoon and so, in addition to her Mum, Dad, three siblings and the assistant there must have been 50 customers and staff within earshot to witness a screaming teenage tantrum. Obviously all those present stepped back out of the way of Emma's screaming, swearing and hand waving so Emma found herself alone in the centre of a shocked circle of family and shoppers. Just then she must have run out of breath (or insults) so she fell silent - as was the whole shop. You could have heard a pin drop..... only for little Grace (3 or 4 years old) to say to gathered masses, in a really solemn voice "Ooooh, I must apologise on behalf of my sister: she sounds just like 'Kevin the Teenager".
Of course the whole shop burst into laughter (at Emma's expense) but what made it even funnier was the look on Grace's face - she wasn't trying to be funny - contrasting with the look on Emma's apoplectic face. Emma was just mouth breathing and seething with anger trying to think of something to say........ until she had a little twitch at the side of her mouth .... seeing, for the first time, just what a fool she had made of herself in front of the nobility and gentry and she burst out laughing. The assembled crowd spontaneously burst into applause for Grace, for her moral compass, and Emma for having the good grace (if you'll pardon the pun) for seeing the funny side of the situation.
The moral is that Emma's teenage tantrums pretty much ended there and then - if she ever (or later her younger sisters) started 'showing off' the the family would all cry out "KEVIN"- the'd all start laughing at the memory of the shop ......... and the 'issue', whatever it was would seem small and insignificant.
So my advice to the OP; be wary of rushing into any particular course of action suggested on PH. Next time your ex tells you of a major blow-up go and visit your son. Tell him you are coming - he'll be expecting a major boll0cking, but resist the temptation....... then surprise him by taking him to a pub (you might want one with a beer garden, just in case!) and buy two drinks, one pint for you, one pint for him. Sit down man to man (not angry father to petulant teenage boy) and try and discuss what the issues are. Remember his bad behaviour is a symptom - (don't be judgemental) you might get him to open up about the cause. Even if you can't get him to do so perhaps your fatherly role as a 'Dutch uncle' might make him feel less alone - because, deep inside, he knows you might be able to help sort out any issues that he has. But perhaps, best of all, he might feel less alone and see you and your relationship in a new light. He might, just might, be able to talk not about his behaviour but what has been causing it.
Remember being a teenager (hormones/ school / friends/ girls) has always been pretty hard - probably harder now (bl00dy social media etc) than it was in our day.
No joy there then take him to a GP and press (go privately if necessary) for an appointment with a child psychiatrist. But do try & do something sooner than later.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_the_Teenager
To understand this story you'll need to remember who Harry Enfield's 'Kevin the Teenager' was:
Back in the 1990's, I had a colleague Alison, who was married with 4 daughters; the youngest Grace, about three or Four, the oldest Emma about 14. Once she became a teenager Emma became 'difficult' -mood swings, snapping a parents etc etc (seemingly nothing too bad). Then she introduced them to her first 'boyfriend'. The family were concerned with the age gap because, although he went to the same school, he had (just) turned 16. On the principal of 'keeping your daughter close and your daughter's boyfriends even closer' the family took him with them on holiday. A couple of weeks later Alison returned home to see an package from Truprint containing photos (this was before digital photos) - she opened them without realising they were addressed to Emma. In amongst the 'normal' holiday snaps were some of Emma artistically posing 'topless' - obviously the sh*t hit the fan....... boyfriend threatened with police etc etc. Emma became even more problematical so, in order to make her feel more 'grown up' the family agreed that rather than her Mum take her shopping for clothes she would be given a clothing allowance.
First months clothing allowance & she went into town on her own to buy a school uniform skirt - the obvious happened: skirt being too short / slit up the side etc. Major row: Mum demands that she accompanies Emma back to shop for her to change it. When Alison took her to the shop she (Alison) later admitted she made the mistake of not saying, to the assistant - and in front of Emma, simply that the skirt didn't fit but that it made her little girl look like a tart. Emma blows up in front of everyone in the shop "you are so unfair, you hate me, treat me like a child etc" This is a Saturday afternoon and so, in addition to her Mum, Dad, three siblings and the assistant there must have been 50 customers and staff within earshot to witness a screaming teenage tantrum. Obviously all those present stepped back out of the way of Emma's screaming, swearing and hand waving so Emma found herself alone in the centre of a shocked circle of family and shoppers. Just then she must have run out of breath (or insults) so she fell silent - as was the whole shop. You could have heard a pin drop..... only for little Grace (3 or 4 years old) to say to gathered masses, in a really solemn voice "Ooooh, I must apologise on behalf of my sister: she sounds just like 'Kevin the Teenager".
Of course the whole shop burst into laughter (at Emma's expense) but what made it even funnier was the look on Grace's face - she wasn't trying to be funny - contrasting with the look on Emma's apoplectic face. Emma was just mouth breathing and seething with anger trying to think of something to say........ until she had a little twitch at the side of her mouth .... seeing, for the first time, just what a fool she had made of herself in front of the nobility and gentry and she burst out laughing. The assembled crowd spontaneously burst into applause for Grace, for her moral compass, and Emma for having the good grace (if you'll pardon the pun) for seeing the funny side of the situation.
The moral is that Emma's teenage tantrums pretty much ended there and then - if she ever (or later her younger sisters) started 'showing off' the the family would all cry out "KEVIN"- the'd all start laughing at the memory of the shop ......... and the 'issue', whatever it was would seem small and insignificant.
So my advice to the OP; be wary of rushing into any particular course of action suggested on PH. Next time your ex tells you of a major blow-up go and visit your son. Tell him you are coming - he'll be expecting a major boll0cking, but resist the temptation....... then surprise him by taking him to a pub (you might want one with a beer garden, just in case!) and buy two drinks, one pint for you, one pint for him. Sit down man to man (not angry father to petulant teenage boy) and try and discuss what the issues are. Remember his bad behaviour is a symptom - (don't be judgemental) you might get him to open up about the cause. Even if you can't get him to do so perhaps your fatherly role as a 'Dutch uncle' might make him feel less alone - because, deep inside, he knows you might be able to help sort out any issues that he has. But perhaps, best of all, he might feel less alone and see you and your relationship in a new light. He might, just might, be able to talk not about his behaviour but what has been causing it.
Remember being a teenager (hormones/ school / friends/ girls) has always been pretty hard - probably harder now (bl00dy social media etc) than it was in our day.
No joy there then take him to a GP and press (go privately if necessary) for an appointment with a child psychiatrist. But do try & do something sooner than later.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_the_Teenager
Ari said:
I was far from a model child, but the idea of a child swearing at his parents was completely unimaginable when I was a kid! If I had, losing 30 mins of playing games would have been the very least of my worries..!
Times have changed.
My Mum reaching for a wooden spoon was enough to scare meTimes have changed.
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