Roofing / Scaffold Query!

Author
Discussion

mtrehy

Original Poster:

87 posts

146 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
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HI All,

I'm looking for some advice regarding a potential problem with an outbuilding extension.

One wall of the building (not gable end) is the boundary with neighbours garden. They are not keen on allowing access/scaffold on their property.

Is this a show-stopper? I would have thought it would be possible to somehow work front to back or cross over from the side with no access problems.

Any advice greatly appreciated.

I'm trying friendly negotiations!

Cheers

jgy6000

199 posts

169 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
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What’s their problem?

Ricky146a

307 posts

75 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
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Ask them politely if they would like to repair your wall for you then.

I believe you have a reasonable right of access to maintain your property - as you have the responsibility of ensuring their property is left in the state that you found it.

Little Lofty

3,275 posts

150 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
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You can usually build overhand which means building from your side only. Tell your neighbours that depending on the skill of the brickie they could end up looking at an eyesore as the finish may not be as good. It shouldn't really make much difference but if you make them think it's going to look a mess they may rethink.

Equus

16,770 posts

100 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
Ricky146a said:
I believe you have a reasonable right of access to maintain your property ...
You have a reasonable right of access to MAINTAIN your property (under the Access to Neighbouring Land Act), NOT to extend it.

If they don't want you're scaffolding on their property for the construction of the extension, they don't have to allow it. You can usually overcome this, at some inconvenience, by building entirely from within your own property (eg. brickwork can be built 'overhand', by the brickie working from what will be within the new building), but you should discuss this with your architect or architectural technologist, to ensure that they design to accommodate it.

mtrehy

Original Poster:

87 posts

146 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
Thanks all - the concern isn't the block work. Brickie has no issue. Concern has been raised about the difficulty of the roofing (pitched roof with slate).


CambsBill

1,909 posts

177 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
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Isn't this covered by the Party Wall Act?

CambsBill

1,909 posts

177 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
Just to expand - we had a neighbour quoting it when they wanted to put scaffolding on our land for a new build and my reading of it (on line) led me to conclude that he was entirely within his rights to do so. With certain responsibilities obviously.

Ricky146a

307 posts

75 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
Don't think this is a party wall.
This is a new wall being built on OP's boundary.

mtrehy

Original Poster:

87 posts

146 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
It's an existing outbuilding that is getting higher and longer. The existing wall of the building forms the boundary between their garden and my driveway. The new part of the wall will be about 6 inches my side of their fence which starts at the end of the existing wall - potentially they could discard the fence, allow me access to render and use the wall as the boundary in the same way as it is on the exiting structure.

I'm not really looking for help resolving a dispute (which doesn't exist), rather wondering from a roofers / scaffolders perspective whether it is realistically possible to do the roof without entering their property. They have indicated that they are not keen for me to put scaffolding on their side, so I would rather avoid pushing it further unless it is 100% necessary.







Edited by mtrehy on Sunday 18th February 15:48

wolfracesonic

6,941 posts

126 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
Building the wall over hand is no problem for a bricklayer, the difficulty will be the roof/gutter/facia/detailing. Is it just having the scaffold resting on their property that is the problem if so it may be possible to have the scaffold cantilever out at each end and then span between them with beams; or is it just an awkward neighbor?

mtrehy

Original Poster:

87 posts

146 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
It's a combination of things.

The new walls are built and are higher than the neighbour thought they would be and to be fair to them they look higher than I expected also. Everything has planning permission but I guess until things are physical it's hard to fully appreciate. This is certainly a factor in them not now being fully on side.

They are also having building work and it's gone on a while so I guess they are concerned about having scaffolding hanging around for ages.

The scaffolding would require a hedge of theirs to be cut back a bit and at the moment the hedge partially obscures the new build which is obviously a good thing for them.

It's obviously a bit of a catch 22 as the easier the access the quicker it will be over and the better job can be made of it etc.

Building is 11m front to back so a very long span to cantilever?



Eddieslofart

1,328 posts

82 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
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How long is the wall ? As said, a cantilevered beam scaffold can be used. It won’t stand on their land, but will be in their ‘airspace’

Roofing will require a working platform.

Equus

16,770 posts

100 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
Eddieslofart said:
It won’t stand on their land, but will be in their ‘airspace’
Which means that technically, you're still trespassing.

CambsBill

1,909 posts

177 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
Ricky146a said:
Don't think this is a party wall.
This is a new wall being built on OP's boundary.
Still applies afaik - OP, suggest you read up on the PWAct for yourself

Equus

16,770 posts

100 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
CambsBill said:
Ricky146a said:
Don't think this is a party wall.
This is a new wall being built on OP's boundary.
Still applies afaik - OP, suggest you read up on the PWAct for yourself
Yes, the Party Wall Act applies, but it is a right pain in the arse (and costly) if your neighbour chooses to be obstructive, and you only have rights to access that is reasonably necessary to undertake works that are notifiable within the Act, so if your neighbour can reasonably argue that the work can be done without access or scaffolding on their land, or that the reason you need the scaffolding is to undertake works that are not notifiable, the ruling may go against you.

Eddieslofart

1,328 posts

82 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
Equus said:
Eddieslofart said:
It won’t stand on their land, but will be in their ‘airspace’
Which means that technically, you're still trespassing.
Then they cannot do the work without breaking the law. Simple as that.

Equus

16,770 posts

100 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
Eddieslofart said:
Then they cannot do the work without breaking the law. Simple as that.
As said; Party Wall Act applies... which means that if you can prove that the access is required for the purposes of work notifiable under the act (and as I understand it, roofing is questionable), then you can be granted a licence to enter onto the neighbouring land to erect your scaffold. Be prepared to drop your trousers and bend over for the Party Wall Suveyor's fees, though.

jas xjr

11,309 posts

238 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
Could they not work off a scaffold tower which could be dismantled at the end of each day?

mtrehy

Original Poster:

87 posts

146 months

Sunday 18th February 2018
quotequote all
I asked the same thing about the scaffold tower. I think it's not such a question of what people can do it's more that there's a lot of work around and any project that is awkward is not top of peoples list....

I'm obviously not a roofer but the more I think about it I wonder whether it couldn't be done from inside the building.... Hear me out....

Building is empty, just 4 walls.

Install trusses - should be easy enough without going onto the neighbours garden.

Put up scaffold inside building and reach around outside to fit fascia, soffitt etc - awkward but not impossible? Neighbour would probably allow access on foot for this anyhow.

Standing on scaffold inside and install 1 row of 1 metre roofing membrane at bottom of roof, batten & slate that and work my way up the roof to the ridge. It's a raised tie trussed roof so lots of scaffold space inside...

My side can be done from inside or out.

Any roofers think this is realistic... It works in my head.