Staying safe on the commute?

Staying safe on the commute?

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Discussion

Birdster

Original Poster:

2,529 posts

142 months

Wednesday 4th December 2019
quotequote all
Hi All,

Just wondering if we have any sort of advice thread, or good links to cycling safely? I've been reading https://www.cyclescheme.co.uk/community/how-to/roa... this and I know a lot of it is common sense, but part of good driving and cycling also comes from experience. Driving an MX5 I'm used to drivers not seeing me coming and placement of blind spots etc. When cycling and approaching traffic lights where traffic hasn't just stopped I won't filter to the front in case traffic moves off and I stay directly behind the car in front to take the primary position behind them. I won't go down the inside even in a cycle lane if traffic is congested and too close to the parked cars, or likely to move over if emergency vehicles coming towards them etc. I like to think I try to keep safe. Some of the cycle lanes before I get to the CS3 are real pinch points.

Commuting home yesterday I'm out of the cycle lane and in the edge of the road (as cars parked close to, or in the cycle lane). I'm outside of the dooring zone and yet still a car parked to my left, but facing me starts to pull out and I stop in time and he stares at me, I wave him out and he apologies/says thanks. Essentially he was edging out to look if clear to pull out, but rather than do in small increments he stuck half of his front grill out in one go until he stopped when he saw me and I stopped. So I'm thinking should I be even further out more towards the middle of the road and more into the priority position. It's a wide road and traffic can safely pass me on this stretch as they'll move out to the middle of the road.. If I'd been further forward or a wider car (or the car more over to the left I'm sure even the two cars would have clipped each other and he's taken the 'any car coming will move over, or stop attitude.

In this photo I'd have been parallel to the Mercedes A Class and the empty space between the VW and Ford Transit would have had the car facing me, no sudden turning off wheel, flashing of flights, or indicator to tell me they're pulling out. In hindsight I'm thinking I should be taking more of a priority position even further away from the dooring zone and be taking up as much space as a car here? Although I feel I'd nearer to the centre white line and nearer to oncoming traffic for this drive to have seen me?




Marcellus

7,111 posts

218 months

Wednesday 4th December 2019
quotequote all
When I started to ride bikes in Central London one piece of advice I was given was to "ride as if every other road user is out to kill you".

I still take that approach when riding, it makes you question everything all the time... so in your instance seeing a road on the left I'd have been looking/thinking "might something be coming down that road?" Then when they do it's a not a surprise creating a panic reaction it's a yes they are so I will do this........ probably; already made 100% sure what was behind me, moved more into the centre of the road, looking for what's coming the other way, looking for is there a 2nd car following the 1st, covered the brakes opening up the options of; jumping on the brakes without risk of being hit from behind, moving into the opposite lane to go around the front of the car pulling out, sliding around the back of the car pulling out all whilst being ready to whisle very very loudly!!

jesusbuiltmycar

4,535 posts

253 months

Wednesday 4th December 2019
quotequote all
The main issue is being seen especially when it is dark. I have a a ProViz gillet which is highly reflective jacket and shows up more that any lights, the downside is that it is not very breathable.


SamR380

725 posts

119 months

Wednesday 4th December 2019
quotequote all
The ProViz stuff is impressive but expensive. I have a similarly reflective-all-over helmet from Planet X, cost about 30 quid I think.

Hopefully it makes me visible from beind cars as my lights might be obscured.

edit to add: Practice emergency stops too, its not something you ever do in day-to-day riding so it's good to have an idea of how to balance before you need to. Practicing will also highlight any deficiencies in your brakes, giving you time to adjust or repair them.

Edited by SamR380 on Wednesday 4th December 13:33

millen

688 posts

85 months

Wednesday 4th December 2019
quotequote all
I've got a batch of these on order https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/rydesafe-iron-o...
Bear in mind not every project on Indiegogo is eventually delivered, let alone on time!
Also it might be safer to glue or stitch on to some materials, rather than iron-on.
I expect there's similar products available elsewhere.

DS240

4,637 posts

217 months

Wednesday 4th December 2019
quotequote all
You can’t factor in sheer bad driving and you end up in an accident but there’s certainly factors which can help.

Being visible. Bright clothing and lights on all the time. Those proviz are great at night in headlights, but daylight on a dull misty day I think they almost act as camouflage, blending in more than showing out.

Awareness. It’s fine going along with an attitude of having ‘just as much right on the road’ and ‘it’s my right of way so you wait/stop’, but if it goes wrong vehicle Vs cycle doesn’t often result to a win for the cycle!

You have to treat all other road users with caution. It’s popular with motorcycle training to say ‘treat every car as if they want to kill you’.

Reading the road is essential, anticipate hazards. E.g. Seeing a car waiting to pull out. You could just keep the same speed and rely on them waiting, but if they pull out you’re knackered. So reading the hazard, positioning so they have a clear view of you, easing off and having a plan to brake or avoid if necessary.

The amount of videos you see where people just driving into the accident when it was so avoidable. Most the time through sheer stubbornness of being determined to enforce their right of way and surprise surprise, bang!

RizzoTheRat

25,085 posts

191 months

Wednesday 4th December 2019
quotequote all
I find a front light that flickers or pulses shows up a lot better than a solid light. Ones that just flash are not a good idea though, I find it really hard to judge how far away they are. Not 100% sure about the legality of pulsing lights though.

I bought a pair of dayglow yellow gloves that also have reflective bits on them so hopefully I show up when signalling.

As a motorcyclist I completely agree with the above comment about hazard perception. Some people seem to be oblivious to dangers, while others work on the theory that they're in the right...personally I work on the theory I don't care who's right, I care who's going to get injured.


But by far the biggest safety improvement I've had in my cycling, which I accept may be a little extreme for some to consider, was moving to the Netherlands biggrin

Edited by RizzoTheRat on Wednesday 4th December 13:48

bakerstreet

4,755 posts

164 months

Thursday 5th December 2019
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I've been commuting on bikes for about 8 years all in.

I'm of the view that you don't need the latest and greatest kit to stay safe on the road. I run Leyzyne lights front and back and they are about £60 for both and I run in flash mode for both. I agree with the statement that solid light isn't a good choice. You have more of a chance of people noticing a flash or strobe, but strobe isn't pleasant to ride with IMO.

I have looked at the ProViz stuff and quite frankly, I can't be bothered to spend that kind of money on a jacket and I commute every day year round.

Road positioning is key for commuting and also not riding like an idiot. Plain and simple. I tend to only move down the side of vehicles when they are stationary. Means a slower ride to the work, but I am fine with that.

I also ride with the attitude that I am an ambassador for cycling and cyclists. If this improves people's opinion of cyclists and they give them a bit of space to move out to pass a car, then that is all good. I also make sure I thank a motorist with a thumbs up or a wave. It costs nothing.

Clipped pedals. I use them and I am profficent at it. Don't venture into London's roads and mess about in the middle of the junction trying to clip in. You could well cause an accident.

On the Cycling superhighway, keep left and over take on the right and don't cycle with your mate two a breast and chat. It really doesn't work. Also make sure, that you look before over taking.

Pedestrians. They are a big problem with cycling in London. Because one crosses on a red, expect many others to follow. Like many I have had many a close call and its only because I back off at crossings that I missed a few. I will shout at anyone who walks on the red. Me and another guy had a pop at a couple doing it with a buggy the other day and the cyclist in front of me had to slam on the anchors. Maybe he should have been riding slower, but he was on the green and they were well passed the switch on the signals.

IME Uber drivers really do not care and they are the most likely to cut or carve you up. Buses have more CCTV than the Bank of England now, so everything they do is recorded and I genuinely believe that they behave better on the roads because of it. London Taxi drivers are a different breed.

You can wear a camera if you want, but I see much less of it now and I think that is because those people run the lights and behave like idiots and that will bite you if you have an accident. I had a pop at a cyclist with a GoPro the other day who ran a crossing with people on it. Whats the point of using a camera if you can obey the traffic laws and highway code your self.

Commuting by bike saves me a lot of cash, but its tiring, cold and wet and takes up a lot of my time. I'm also now suffering with lower back pain following 250 miles a month for two years and 120 miles a month for three years before that.

numtumfutunch

4,705 posts

137 months

Thursday 5th December 2019
quotequote all
Longstanding commuter here of many, many years

By far my best gizmo is an Exposure Joystick on a helmet mount

Theyre updated every year and I pay no more than £100 for the previous generation

Am currently on my second in over 12y after discovering them

In low light/dusk/dawn/night I set it to strobe

Unlike cheapo Chinese lights the beam is focussed and highly directional so you dont antagonise everyone coming towards you and can easily direct it at motorists you think havent seen you in side roads or pulling out of parking spaces as the OP described

In daylight when its off it looks like a helmet cam and Im pretty sure most other road users think it is and so I get more respect from them

It produces a lot of light in continuous and can be used off road and on unlit roads if needed
The battery is decent and lasts ages if on strobe, but a goodly time on continuous too

The narrow beam is a mixed bag, I use a low output bar light with a wide spread as well which doesnt dazzle to also announce my presence

Cheers - and stay safe







Edited by numtumfutunch on Thursday 5th December 23:39

shalmaneser

5,930 posts

194 months

Friday 6th December 2019
quotequote all
bakerstreet said:
I've been commuting on bikes for about 8 years all in.

I'm of the view that you don't need the latest and greatest kit to stay safe on the road. I run Leyzyne lights front and back and they are about £60 for both and I run in flash mode for both. I agree with the statement that solid light isn't a good choice. You have more of a chance of people noticing a flash or strobe, but strobe isn't pleasant to ride with IMO.

I have looked at the ProViz stuff and quite frankly, I can't be bothered to spend that kind of money on a jacket and I commute every day year round.

Road positioning is key for commuting and also not riding like an idiot. Plain and simple. I tend to only move down the side of vehicles when they are stationary. Means a slower ride to the work, but I am fine with that.

I also ride with the attitude that I am an ambassador for cycling and cyclists. If this improves people's opinion of cyclists and they give them a bit of space to move out to pass a car, then that is all good. I also make sure I thank a motorist with a thumbs up or a wave. It costs nothing.

Clipped pedals. I use them and I am profficent at it. Don't venture into London's roads and mess about in the middle of the junction trying to clip in. You could well cause an accident.

On the Cycling superhighway, keep left and over take on the right and don't cycle with your mate two a breast and chat. It really doesn't work. Also make sure, that you look before over taking.

Pedestrians. They are a big problem with cycling in London. Because one crosses on a red, expect many others to follow. Like many I have had many a close call and its only because I back off at crossings that I missed a few. I will shout at anyone who walks on the red. Me and another guy had a pop at a couple doing it with a buggy the other day and the cyclist in front of me had to slam on the anchors. Maybe he should have been riding slower, but he was on the green and they were well passed the switch on the signals.

IME Uber drivers really do not care and they are the most likely to cut or carve you up. Buses have more CCTV than the Bank of England now, so everything they do is recorded and I genuinely believe that they behave better on the roads because of it. London Taxi drivers are a different breed.

You can wear a camera if you want, but I see much less of it now and I think that is because those people run the lights and behave like idiots and that will bite you if you have an accident. I had a pop at a cyclist with a GoPro the other day who ran a crossing with people on it. Whats the point of using a camera if you can obey the traffic laws and highway code your self.

Commuting by bike saves me a lot of cash, but its tiring, cold and wet and takes up a lot of my time. I'm also now suffering with lower back pain following 250 miles a month for two years and 120 miles a month for three years before that.
I've been commuting in London for 8 years now and agree with all of this apart from the last paragraph!

Excellent advice.

funinhounslow

1,600 posts

141 months

Saturday 7th December 2019
quotequote all
Birdster said:
Hi All,

Just wondering if we have any sort of advice thread, or good links to cycling safely? I've been reading https://www.cyclescheme.co.uk/community/how-to/roa... this and I know a lot of it is common sense
To be honest I think you've found the best source of sensible advice for commuting cyclists. I think if more car drivers read its contents it would explain to them why cyclists sometimes behave the way they do ie to stay safe, not to annoy them

Birdster said:
Hi All,
So I'm thinking should I be even further out more towards the middle of the road and more into the priority position. It's a wide road and traffic can safely pass me on this stretch as they'll move out to the middle of the road.priority position even further away from the dooring zone and be taking up as much space as a car here?
It's your lane and you should take as much of it as you need to feel safe and visible. Even if you were cycling in the door zone a car would have to straddle the central lines to overtake you safely so you are't inconveniencing them more by poisoning yourself further to the centre of the road.

In my experience car drivers in this situation can see what you're doing and why and will generally hold back. And, as the article notes, if you get hooted at, at least you know they've seen you.

I will move over to the left when I can (but clear of the gutter) but this is a courtesy to other road users. Approaching a hazard or overtaking a parked car I will take as much of my lane as I need. I think it's another Cyclescheme article that says if you act like traffic you will get treated like traffic - hugging the kerb just encourages dodgy overtaking.

I have a Proviz jacket - amazing when headlights hit it at night but I do poach myself in it - I think they now make gillets which may be more suitable.

I also have lights on all the time - even on the brightest sunniest day - steady at the back and flashing at the front to distinguish myself from the car DRL arms race that seems to be going on...

Some articles will stress the importance of making eye contact with drivers. That can work, but drivers are often looking for other cars and have the ability to "see through" bikes. Try and make eye contact by all means but keep an eye on a car's front wheels for an early indication of what a car's up to...

GOATever

2,651 posts

66 months

Saturday 7th December 2019
quotequote all
Decent lights, at this time of year, strategically placed high reflect kit ( on the feet, and on the hands are my preferred choices ) and slow down. Make sure your bike’s in good order ( brakes and tyres in particular). Be aware of your surroundings, and position yourself to give other road users the best view of you.