CAN Bus & Electronics - a nightmare story for you.
Discussion
Prompted by this https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
What is it with vehicle technology that leads to a situation like this?
Reliability and user serviceability of modern day car electronics (bulbs in this case) makes it impossible to actually fix problems.
Especially French wiring looms and super 'intelligent' CAN buses monitoring everything.
It has been dumbed up to such a high level now that you haven't got a chance mate.
A mate of mine had a headlight bulb blow in his Ford Transit Connect van. The rear tail light failed at the same time.
We replaced all the bulbs and just could not get it working. WTAF? - dash display claimed short detected in near side lighting circuit.
A few hours poking around and I gave up.
He had to take it to a Ford technician (fortunately not a main dealer but a lad we know) to get the BCM reset and it all started working again.
The only conclusion is that when the filament broke a short was detected by the BCM and it shut down that circuit and would not turn it back on again with out guidance from a laptop wielding Ford knowledgeable tech.
It's utter nuts. £x amount trying bulb after bulb, inspecting wiring, testing bulbs, dicking about, making calls, how much time?
Eventually F-Tech lad wanted £50 for the time sorting this, then you add on the cost of fuel to get to him, the number of hours spent looking at it your self and then the number of hours that van was not working.
It's a disgrace.
Dipped beam bulb blew on one of my taxis, a new (68 plate) Auris Hybrid.
Okidoki, I'll take a look....hmmm that looks like it might be a gas discharge/good night Sooty type shock coming up. I'll check the handbook. Bulbs, bulbs, ahh here we are page 104..."There are many different types of bulbs used on your Auris. We strongly recommend taking your car to your nearest Toyota dealer for replacement"
Nope, it was a standard (ish) halogen bulb that my local garage supplied for the princely sum of £38.00. They fitted it for free. To put this into perspective, when something needs a H7 that I don't have in the office, they charge me £7.88 fitted.
I feel your pain OP.
Okidoki, I'll take a look....hmmm that looks like it might be a gas discharge/good night Sooty type shock coming up. I'll check the handbook. Bulbs, bulbs, ahh here we are page 104..."There are many different types of bulbs used on your Auris. We strongly recommend taking your car to your nearest Toyota dealer for replacement"
Nope, it was a standard (ish) halogen bulb that my local garage supplied for the princely sum of £38.00. They fitted it for free. To put this into perspective, when something needs a H7 that I don't have in the office, they charge me £7.88 fitted.
I feel your pain OP.
Tyre Smoke said:
Dipped beam bulb blew on one of my taxis, a new (68 plate) Auris Hybrid.
Okidoki, I'll take a look....hmmm that looks like it might be a gas discharge/good night Sooty type shock coming up. I'll check the handbook. Bulbs, bulbs, ahh here we are page 104..."There are many different types of bulbs used on your Auris. We strongly recommend taking your car to your nearest Toyota dealer for replacement"
Nope, it was a standard (ish) halogen bulb that my local garage supplied for the princely sum of £38.00. They fitted it for free. To put this into perspective, when something needs a H7 that I don't have in the office, they charge me £7.88 fitted.
I feel your pain OP.
38 pounds? Hope you had a free shoe polishOkidoki, I'll take a look....hmmm that looks like it might be a gas discharge/good night Sooty type shock coming up. I'll check the handbook. Bulbs, bulbs, ahh here we are page 104..."There are many different types of bulbs used on your Auris. We strongly recommend taking your car to your nearest Toyota dealer for replacement"
Nope, it was a standard (ish) halogen bulb that my local garage supplied for the princely sum of £38.00. They fitted it for free. To put this into perspective, when something needs a H7 that I don't have in the office, they charge me £7.88 fitted.
I feel your pain OP.
^ Correct. - Sorry BCM is Body Control Module - it monitors all the lights (and likely anything anything else like boot opening control or a mechanised soft top roof).
It's an impossible situation.
(Long story)
On another post I related a story about a SEAT (of some version or other) where the ECU had given up. The car had been sat with a main dealer for weeks with no resolution so eventually it was trailered back to my mates yard.
It belonged to a family member of my friend who runs the yard (we generally work on plant kit not cars), the vehicle was sat on the yard for months before we found someone (a VW specialist???) that knew what was likely wrong & would take look at it.
Turns out there was/is a common fault on these vehicles where the water temp sensor leaks and after time the coolant creeps up via capillary action along the wires and in to the ECU connector and corrodes it beyond belief.
So this lad turns up, spends a few hours changing over the plug and starts it on the first turn of the key - I couldn't believe it.
Then he whips out his Snap-On super dooper ODBII device and with in a few minutes he's cleared all the error codes and they vehicle is perfectly happy and ready to go.
I asked him how much did that Snap-On device cost you? 'It's a couple of grand mate but I just bring it home from work for the weekend'.
'And the updates for the software, how much is that?'
'About 900 a year mate'.
Holy f
k, no wonder these lads are out on the road at the weekend using borrowed dealer level kit and earning a few extra quid.
No home mechanic can compete with that when it comes to trivial matters like a bulb has blown.
TLDR; make friends with a Polish lad, or a main dealer tech who does work on the side & has the kit to look into these electrical problems. The days of fixing these issues with a multimeter and a bit of common sense are long gone.
It's an impossible situation.
(Long story)
On another post I related a story about a SEAT (of some version or other) where the ECU had given up. The car had been sat with a main dealer for weeks with no resolution so eventually it was trailered back to my mates yard.
It belonged to a family member of my friend who runs the yard (we generally work on plant kit not cars), the vehicle was sat on the yard for months before we found someone (a VW specialist???) that knew what was likely wrong & would take look at it.
Turns out there was/is a common fault on these vehicles where the water temp sensor leaks and after time the coolant creeps up via capillary action along the wires and in to the ECU connector and corrodes it beyond belief.
So this lad turns up, spends a few hours changing over the plug and starts it on the first turn of the key - I couldn't believe it.
Then he whips out his Snap-On super dooper ODBII device and with in a few minutes he's cleared all the error codes and they vehicle is perfectly happy and ready to go.
I asked him how much did that Snap-On device cost you? 'It's a couple of grand mate but I just bring it home from work for the weekend'.
'And the updates for the software, how much is that?'
'About 900 a year mate'.
Holy f
k, no wonder these lads are out on the road at the weekend using borrowed dealer level kit and earning a few extra quid.No home mechanic can compete with that when it comes to trivial matters like a bulb has blown.
TLDR; make friends with a Polish lad, or a main dealer tech who does work on the side & has the kit to look into these electrical problems. The days of fixing these issues with a multimeter and a bit of common sense are long gone.
Sheepshanks said:
Penelope Stopit said:
38 pounds? Hope you had a free shoe polish
That's not bad from a garage - it's a HIR2 bulb.Tyre Smoke said:
Nope, it was a standard (ish) halogen bulb that my local garage supplied for the princely sum of £38.00
Ah ok thenThought standardish bulb meant sort of cheapish standardish
JustALooseScrew said:
Turns out there was/is a common fault on these vehicles where the water temp sensor leaks and after time the coolant creeps up via capillary action along the wires and in to the ECU connector and corrodes it beyond belief
You mean you didn't know about the infamous SEAT temp sensor cable acting as a drain pipe?It's common knowledge here
Smile
Penelope Stopit said:
While on the subject of water
Some may appreciate this Canems installation, apparently carried out by a professional, image shows the main relay and ECU
Floor of car is below ECU
You couldn't make this up yet it happened
Don't even get me started on the genius designer at renault who thought it would be smart cool and clever to mount the Clio's air bag ecm directly underneath the coffee cup holder Some may appreciate this Canems installation, apparently carried out by a professional, image shows the main relay and ECU
Floor of car is below ECU
You couldn't make this up yet it happened
- do they do this st on purpose?JustALooseScrew said:
on't even get me started on the genius designer at renault who thought it would be smart cool and clever to mount the Clio's air bag ecm directly underneath the coffee cup holder - do they do this st on purpose?
That's clever - do they do this st on purpose?What has happened over the years is that more and more people go to university, get their degree or whatever and are then employed by a motor manufacturer
Not many manufacturers seem to take into consideration that these people from university have no knowledge of what can go wrong if...................
Seen it first hand many times, frightening really, can't name and shame though
Penelope Stopit said:
While on the subject of water
Some may appreciate this Canems installation, apparently carried out by a professional, image shows the main relay and ECU
Floor of car is below ECU
You couldn't make this up yet it happened
Who did this for you Penny? Name and shame them.Some may appreciate this Canems installation, apparently carried out by a professional, image shows the main relay and ECU
Floor of car is below ECU
You couldn't make this up yet it happened
Looks like a TVR but which model have you got?
Tyre Smoke said:
That looks like the passenger footwell of my old Chimaera. And any other Chimaera I've ever looked into the passenger footwell of.
Well spotted, it is a ChimaeraBlue Peter Badge is in the post
Why would anyone fit then wire an ECU to such a low point in a vehicle and add another bodge to the bodge job by fitting the ECU upside down to ensure that any water running inside any cables will enter it
The mind boggles
Edited by Penelope Stopit on Tuesday 28th January 09:59
JustALooseScrew said:
on't even get me started on the genius designer at renault who thought it would be smart cool and clever to mount the Clio's air bag ecm directly underneath the coffee cup holder - do they do this st on purpose?
Megane. Have a blown headlight so changed bulb outside, in the dark while raining which requires the bumper to come off. No worky. No voltage either. Apparently the fuse (there are two one for each dipped bulb) is located in the fuse box in the engine bay which is simply accessed by removing a load of trim, the battery (which I hate doing as everything then needs resetting), the battery tray which is held in with some rust, unplugging a load of stuff, removing the ECU and dropping it in a puddle and forcing the fuse box out of it's little plastic hutch. - do they do this st on purpose?There's another fuse board in the car which takes seconds to open but trivial stuff like headlights, wipers, ABS and the radiator fan is relegated to the one in the engine bay. It's probably an hour or two to change a 10A fuse and it definitely wont fix it and it'll turn out to be a broken wire necessitating removal of the loom. Which means taking the bumper off again.
Gassing Station | Home Mechanics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff