Nano/Ceramic Coating on DB9 Volante
Discussion
I am considering treating myself to getting my DB9 professionally detailed, paint corrected and nano/ceramic treated however I’m a complete novice on this front and would welcome anyone’s advice/experience with doing this.
The main reason I’d like to do this is that, although the paint is in very good condition, it seems to be very susceptible to marking, swirls etc from washing (seems to take a lot of effort to keep it looking good) and I’m hoping once I’ve had it coated, it will be protected from this. Am I roughly correct here?!
Car is always garaged.
Many thanks in advance for any help!
The main reason I’d like to do this is that, although the paint is in very good condition, it seems to be very susceptible to marking, swirls etc from washing (seems to take a lot of effort to keep it looking good) and I’m hoping once I’ve had it coated, it will be protected from this. Am I roughly correct here?!
Car is always garaged.
Many thanks in advance for any help!
I would happily give you a quote for doing the work. I’m probably the most experienced Aston detailer in the country. I’ll try and be as helpful as I can.
This is what I wrote on the vantage Facebook forum the other day:
Ceramic coatings.
So, following on from my little post about PPF, we are now going to talk about ceramic coatings.
Firstly, you have to remember that it’s nothing like PPF. A coating won’t stop stone chips, ever. Aside from PPF, it is the best thing you can do in terms of protecting your car. Everything from the paint, wheels, glass and even the exhausts.
But, paint prep is even more important than with PPF, as the coatings hide very little. So, you need the paintwork looking as good as possible before it’s applied.
We might as well get it out of the way quickly, there is no such thing as a ceramic coating. It’s just a term that is used. 90% of coatings out there are silica based, with the rest being made up with inorganic and organic wizardry. Some are even starting to have graphine in them now.
Unlike PPF, where the film is very similar and it’s all down to the installer, ceramic coatings (we are going to call them sealants from here on in), are very different from each other and some detailers only have what they offer because they couldn’t get what they really wanted.
The price with sealants also varies too. They are expensive to apply and of course buy, well, the good ones are anyway. I’ve seen one self professed king of detailing, say he can ceramic coat a car for £10 (cost to him). Well, if that’s the case, then the sealant is rubbish. I spend more than that on the cloths I use to wipe the sealant off and throw away.
For a decent sealant , you’re going to be spending £150 on the low end for a single layer average coating and £250 or more for one of the better ones. Then even more for more layers, depending on what you go for. Let’s say you spend £450 on a dual layer top end sealant, which will be the best of what you can put on your car. For the same thing in the US, they are likely to charge you $2-3k for the same thing! And people pay it. Madness.
Anyway, you always want to make sure you know what’s going on your car. You should have a pro only sealant, so nothing that you yourself can buy in an online detailing store. Obviously this is more expensive, but there are reasons for this. Pro only coatings offer better longevity, better resistance again wash marring and light swirling and of course bird lime. Also, the water behaviour will be better for longer too.
One brand that people always get conned with is Gtechniq. This is because they have a number of different sealants available to the public and 1 that is pro only (crystal serum ultra). This is one brand where you need to know what you’re paying for, because the level of protection you will get varies massively.
So: C1-low end run of the mill coating anyone can buy
Crystal Serum lite (known as platinum in the dealerships) is a mid range coating that anyone can buy, but offers better protection than the C1
Crystal serum Ultra: this is the pro only coating that is Gtechniq flagship and will be way more expensive to apply than say C1, but it’s better in every way.
Exo: this is a top coat that only offers very high water beading levels. It won’t protect against much but is good to put on top of CSU. This is also known and CS Black.
Now, just to name and shame a few and also recommend some brand and names of coatings. Remember, while I am authorised by various companies, I will not be biased. If one is better than the other, then I will say it. So....
Pyramid car care: average sealants. Mid range in everything really.
Carbon collective: same as above.
Gyeon: fantastic overall brand, with great maintenance products. Mid level and slightly higher pro grade coatings though.
Carpro: same as above.
Gtechniq: good range of products, but Crystal Serum Ultra is the only one to go for. It’s not cheap though.
IGL coatings: their kenzo twin layer coating is good.
Kamikaze coatings: Very expensive as a range of products. Made me switch to actually using a sponge instead of a wash mitt for wash cars! Good overall range of coatings. Zipang is worth a look, but isn’t very hard, so suited to cars with harder paint. Their flagship Enrei twin layer coating is very good and has semi self healing (with very hot water) properties.
Titan: they only make coatings and spray sealants. Very good range and most people of any note have started using them. Their Zeus coating is good and gives good gloss levels. Their Vulcan coating is good too and offers semi self healing too. They also do a PX10 coating that acts as a base layer and actually adds thickness to the paint. Followed by something like Vulcan. More layers are better with the Titan range, but this can be expensive and time consuming. Worth it though.
Modesta: good range of products, but not many detailers offer them. Only available to unit based detailers, as they need to be cured by heat lamps. Very good coating range though.
Max protect: their unc-r rubber membrane coating (like Titan Vulcan) is very good, but tricky to apply.
Angelwax: Their Genesis Enigma coating is one of the best single layer coatings you can buy. One of the few that are made in the UK and binds very strongly to your car. They are also someone I have just been accredited with today. There is also a new coating coming out soon that is even better.
Ceramic Pro: overpriced. Not a bad coating, but others are better for half the price.
Autoglym: Rubbish. Ok for low level protection and making the car look a bit shinier with their srp polish.
Auto finesse: enthusiast range of products. Good overall, but no real sealant to rival the others.
Just to be clear on this, I am Gtechniq, Titan, kamikaze and Angelwax authorised. I only affiliate myself with companies I feel confident that can do the job I want. And in those ranges, I only use and will only offer the best coatings they have. None of the lower end range.
As with most things, you still have to look after the car properly once it has been coated. This means decent shampoo that won’t dull the effectiveness of the coatings. Not harsh TFR (trafic film remover) that will strip the coating. A spray sealant top up is always a good idea with every few washes.
A water spot remover is a good idea too. Kamikaze make the best one. Not only will it remove water spots, but it will unclog the pores of the sealants, making the water behaviour improve. Especially on the back end and lower areas.
In summary, yes ceramic coatings (sealants) are worth it, but you have to make sure you are buying a good one and once it’s on the car, make sure you look after the car properly. Safe washes with two buckets and blow drying the car where possible. Decent shampoo, like carpro reset and a spray sealant and water spot remover once a month or so.
It’s also worth mentioning that you shouldn’t pay any attention to the claims of up to 9 years on some of these coatings. You really want to be looking at no more than 2-3 before you have a freshen up and re apply a coating, dependant on mileage. This is because no matter how careful you are, swirl marks will creep in over time and things will get stuck to the car which will need it clay barring, so it will always be worth remembering this. You still want to go for the best coating you can budget for though, as it pays for itself in ease of washing etc.
If you’re still awake, let me know if you have any questions.
And for those that don’t know who I am, I’m Francis, otherwise known as Paddy328 on PH. I’m probably the most experienced detailer of gaydon era cars. My company is called emerald detailing.
I’ve gained my reputation as much for helping people as I have for the work I do, so please don’t feel this post is a plug for my business. It is mearly a post to try and help people out.
This is what I wrote on the vantage Facebook forum the other day:
Ceramic coatings.
So, following on from my little post about PPF, we are now going to talk about ceramic coatings.
Firstly, you have to remember that it’s nothing like PPF. A coating won’t stop stone chips, ever. Aside from PPF, it is the best thing you can do in terms of protecting your car. Everything from the paint, wheels, glass and even the exhausts.
But, paint prep is even more important than with PPF, as the coatings hide very little. So, you need the paintwork looking as good as possible before it’s applied.
We might as well get it out of the way quickly, there is no such thing as a ceramic coating. It’s just a term that is used. 90% of coatings out there are silica based, with the rest being made up with inorganic and organic wizardry. Some are even starting to have graphine in them now.
Unlike PPF, where the film is very similar and it’s all down to the installer, ceramic coatings (we are going to call them sealants from here on in), are very different from each other and some detailers only have what they offer because they couldn’t get what they really wanted.
The price with sealants also varies too. They are expensive to apply and of course buy, well, the good ones are anyway. I’ve seen one self professed king of detailing, say he can ceramic coat a car for £10 (cost to him). Well, if that’s the case, then the sealant is rubbish. I spend more than that on the cloths I use to wipe the sealant off and throw away.
For a decent sealant , you’re going to be spending £150 on the low end for a single layer average coating and £250 or more for one of the better ones. Then even more for more layers, depending on what you go for. Let’s say you spend £450 on a dual layer top end sealant, which will be the best of what you can put on your car. For the same thing in the US, they are likely to charge you $2-3k for the same thing! And people pay it. Madness.
Anyway, you always want to make sure you know what’s going on your car. You should have a pro only sealant, so nothing that you yourself can buy in an online detailing store. Obviously this is more expensive, but there are reasons for this. Pro only coatings offer better longevity, better resistance again wash marring and light swirling and of course bird lime. Also, the water behaviour will be better for longer too.
One brand that people always get conned with is Gtechniq. This is because they have a number of different sealants available to the public and 1 that is pro only (crystal serum ultra). This is one brand where you need to know what you’re paying for, because the level of protection you will get varies massively.
So: C1-low end run of the mill coating anyone can buy
Crystal Serum lite (known as platinum in the dealerships) is a mid range coating that anyone can buy, but offers better protection than the C1
Crystal serum Ultra: this is the pro only coating that is Gtechniq flagship and will be way more expensive to apply than say C1, but it’s better in every way.
Exo: this is a top coat that only offers very high water beading levels. It won’t protect against much but is good to put on top of CSU. This is also known and CS Black.
Now, just to name and shame a few and also recommend some brand and names of coatings. Remember, while I am authorised by various companies, I will not be biased. If one is better than the other, then I will say it. So....
Pyramid car care: average sealants. Mid range in everything really.
Carbon collective: same as above.
Gyeon: fantastic overall brand, with great maintenance products. Mid level and slightly higher pro grade coatings though.
Carpro: same as above.
Gtechniq: good range of products, but Crystal Serum Ultra is the only one to go for. It’s not cheap though.
IGL coatings: their kenzo twin layer coating is good.
Kamikaze coatings: Very expensive as a range of products. Made me switch to actually using a sponge instead of a wash mitt for wash cars! Good overall range of coatings. Zipang is worth a look, but isn’t very hard, so suited to cars with harder paint. Their flagship Enrei twin layer coating is very good and has semi self healing (with very hot water) properties.
Titan: they only make coatings and spray sealants. Very good range and most people of any note have started using them. Their Zeus coating is good and gives good gloss levels. Their Vulcan coating is good too and offers semi self healing too. They also do a PX10 coating that acts as a base layer and actually adds thickness to the paint. Followed by something like Vulcan. More layers are better with the Titan range, but this can be expensive and time consuming. Worth it though.
Modesta: good range of products, but not many detailers offer them. Only available to unit based detailers, as they need to be cured by heat lamps. Very good coating range though.
Max protect: their unc-r rubber membrane coating (like Titan Vulcan) is very good, but tricky to apply.
Angelwax: Their Genesis Enigma coating is one of the best single layer coatings you can buy. One of the few that are made in the UK and binds very strongly to your car. They are also someone I have just been accredited with today. There is also a new coating coming out soon that is even better.
Ceramic Pro: overpriced. Not a bad coating, but others are better for half the price.
Autoglym: Rubbish. Ok for low level protection and making the car look a bit shinier with their srp polish.
Auto finesse: enthusiast range of products. Good overall, but no real sealant to rival the others.
Just to be clear on this, I am Gtechniq, Titan, kamikaze and Angelwax authorised. I only affiliate myself with companies I feel confident that can do the job I want. And in those ranges, I only use and will only offer the best coatings they have. None of the lower end range.
As with most things, you still have to look after the car properly once it has been coated. This means decent shampoo that won’t dull the effectiveness of the coatings. Not harsh TFR (trafic film remover) that will strip the coating. A spray sealant top up is always a good idea with every few washes.
A water spot remover is a good idea too. Kamikaze make the best one. Not only will it remove water spots, but it will unclog the pores of the sealants, making the water behaviour improve. Especially on the back end and lower areas.
In summary, yes ceramic coatings (sealants) are worth it, but you have to make sure you are buying a good one and once it’s on the car, make sure you look after the car properly. Safe washes with two buckets and blow drying the car where possible. Decent shampoo, like carpro reset and a spray sealant and water spot remover once a month or so.
It’s also worth mentioning that you shouldn’t pay any attention to the claims of up to 9 years on some of these coatings. You really want to be looking at no more than 2-3 before you have a freshen up and re apply a coating, dependant on mileage. This is because no matter how careful you are, swirl marks will creep in over time and things will get stuck to the car which will need it clay barring, so it will always be worth remembering this. You still want to go for the best coating you can budget for though, as it pays for itself in ease of washing etc.
If you’re still awake, let me know if you have any questions.
And for those that don’t know who I am, I’m Francis, otherwise known as Paddy328 on PH. I’m probably the most experienced detailer of gaydon era cars. My company is called emerald detailing.
I’ve gained my reputation as much for helping people as I have for the work I do, so please don’t feel this post is a plug for my business. It is mearly a post to try and help people out.
Aston’s are hard to keep looking good due to the soft paintwork, but provided you have the correct wash technique (two buckets, wash in straight lines etc) you should be ok. My new Renault van has soft paint and I applied Titan Vulcan to it 5 months ago and have washed it many times since and there isn’t a single swirl mark on it, which is awesome. My wash routine goes as follows:
Clean wheels first. (This is important, as if you do it the other way around, the car will either dry out or get wet again. Plus there is a strong chance of it getting a misting with wheel cleaner, so you’re just wasting your time)
Snow foam and rinse
Two bucket wash with either two mitts or two sponges. One for the top of the car and the other for the lower part, such as the sills and bumpers. I have only washed my van with a sponge (kamikaze sponge from ultimate finish) this was always thought of as a big no no, but rinse the car off properly before hand and use two buckets and the right sponge and you’re fine.
Rinse with the pressure washer to remove all the suds and then flood the car with water. If you have a water filter, then great, but there are a couple of ways of doing this. Either take the end of the pressure washer off and use that or even the hose to sheet the water off. Or even use a couple of watering cans. The idea of this is to make the water run off the car in one go and not have the pressure washer spray water on the car and other areas get wet from the water bouncing back after hitting the panel. Go from top to bottom too and go in the direction of the lines. For example, pour the water from the top of the bonnet to the bottom, as if you do it the other way around, you will just cause the water to splash.
Now, drying the car is the most important bit to get right. Firstly, you want to blow the books and crannies out with a blower. Something like the metro blaster sidekick. So this is badges, tail lights, rear reflectors, panel gaps, door handles and grill. If you’re lucky, you can dry the whole car like this and maybe wipe any excess of with a soft cloth.
If not, then you can pat dry or even wipe the excess water off. Now, this is where the swirls are likely to come in. I keep big drying towels for the glass and use a few kamikaze Russian microfibre cloths to wipe off the rest. Anything other than something that feels super soft will put swirls in the paint. And always do it in straight lines. So, if you don’t have a water filter where you can just blow and leave, I would use a couple of big drying towels for the glass, grill, front bumper, sills and around the back bumper and then super fluffy cloths for the rest. But, the less you touch the car the better.
You can even use the step after blowing the car out to add some more protection in the form of a spray sealant. Spray it on the cloth, wipe on and buff off and do this a panel at a time. But again, make sure they are super soft. And I do mean soft.
How you look after your cloths is very important too. Keep them separate in a clean box with a lid and when you feel that they aren’t as soft as they were when you first bought them, swap them over for some new ones and then use the old ones for interior jobs or something else. Also, wash them with non bio washing liquid (not powder) and don’t use fabric softener, as this will stop them from being absorbent. And be careful where you put them when you are using them. Putting the cloth in any surface in your garage or outside has the potential to pick up dirt and scratch your car. If nothing is to hand that’s safe, just put them on the windscreen.
Clean wheels first. (This is important, as if you do it the other way around, the car will either dry out or get wet again. Plus there is a strong chance of it getting a misting with wheel cleaner, so you’re just wasting your time)
Snow foam and rinse
Two bucket wash with either two mitts or two sponges. One for the top of the car and the other for the lower part, such as the sills and bumpers. I have only washed my van with a sponge (kamikaze sponge from ultimate finish) this was always thought of as a big no no, but rinse the car off properly before hand and use two buckets and the right sponge and you’re fine.
Rinse with the pressure washer to remove all the suds and then flood the car with water. If you have a water filter, then great, but there are a couple of ways of doing this. Either take the end of the pressure washer off and use that or even the hose to sheet the water off. Or even use a couple of watering cans. The idea of this is to make the water run off the car in one go and not have the pressure washer spray water on the car and other areas get wet from the water bouncing back after hitting the panel. Go from top to bottom too and go in the direction of the lines. For example, pour the water from the top of the bonnet to the bottom, as if you do it the other way around, you will just cause the water to splash.
Now, drying the car is the most important bit to get right. Firstly, you want to blow the books and crannies out with a blower. Something like the metro blaster sidekick. So this is badges, tail lights, rear reflectors, panel gaps, door handles and grill. If you’re lucky, you can dry the whole car like this and maybe wipe any excess of with a soft cloth.
If not, then you can pat dry or even wipe the excess water off. Now, this is where the swirls are likely to come in. I keep big drying towels for the glass and use a few kamikaze Russian microfibre cloths to wipe off the rest. Anything other than something that feels super soft will put swirls in the paint. And always do it in straight lines. So, if you don’t have a water filter where you can just blow and leave, I would use a couple of big drying towels for the glass, grill, front bumper, sills and around the back bumper and then super fluffy cloths for the rest. But, the less you touch the car the better.
You can even use the step after blowing the car out to add some more protection in the form of a spray sealant. Spray it on the cloth, wipe on and buff off and do this a panel at a time. But again, make sure they are super soft. And I do mean soft.
How you look after your cloths is very important too. Keep them separate in a clean box with a lid and when you feel that they aren’t as soft as they were when you first bought them, swap them over for some new ones and then use the old ones for interior jobs or something else. Also, wash them with non bio washing liquid (not powder) and don’t use fabric softener, as this will stop them from being absorbent. And be careful where you put them when you are using them. Putting the cloth in any surface in your garage or outside has the potential to pick up dirt and scratch your car. If nothing is to hand that’s safe, just put them on the windscreen.
Edited by paddy328 on Sunday 7th March 11:28
Francis
Many thanks for this - am excellent summary. I’ve read it all and understand most of it.
I live near the Wiltshire/Hampshire border - is this an area you cover?
Can you give me a rough cost estimate for detailing and application (at my home) of a mid-range sealant?
Many thanks!
Many thanks for this - am excellent summary. I’ve read it all and understand most of it.
I live near the Wiltshire/Hampshire border - is this an area you cover?
Can you give me a rough cost estimate for detailing and application (at my home) of a mid-range sealant?
Many thanks!
Fantastic info above.
I do the 2 bucket method, but dont have an air dryer so i use large microfiber cloths to dry the panels, after reading your post should i now use kamikaze Russian microfibre cloths ?
My method is autoglyn shampoo then maguiars ultimate wax, Does that sound good,? but ive noticed it could do with a clay bar to smooth it occasionally.
I've done some detailing paint correction on my wife's mini using a polishing machine with 3M 6000/3000 grit and menzerna polishing pads and grades of polish. The car came up a treat but would be nervious doing that on the Aston!!
I do the 2 bucket method, but dont have an air dryer so i use large microfiber cloths to dry the panels, after reading your post should i now use kamikaze Russian microfibre cloths ?
My method is autoglyn shampoo then maguiars ultimate wax, Does that sound good,? but ive noticed it could do with a clay bar to smooth it occasionally.
I've done some detailing paint correction on my wife's mini using a polishing machine with 3M 6000/3000 grit and menzerna polishing pads and grades of polish. The car came up a treat but would be nervious doing that on the Aston!!
Edited by paulrog1 on Sunday 7th March 17:08
Edited by paulrog1 on Sunday 7th March 17:09
PPF information.
I thought I would write a separate post about the above instead of it getting lost on another thread. This is aimed at those not so much in the know and just want to know more about it.
So, for those are unsure between the ceramic coatings and PPF. PPF is designed to protect the car with a clear layer of plastic stuck on the paintwork. The PPF will prevent stone chips, scratches, swirl marks etc. The lighter swirl marks and wash marring can be “healed” with heat, but anything too deep and the film will need to be replaced on that panel. The PPF isn’t bulletproof, but will stop the majority of average speed stone chips.
The film does have some texture to it, but is almost invisible on most colours.
You will on average be looking at around £1500+vat for the front end (bonnet,wings,bumper,wing mirrors) £4500+vat for the whole car.
That’s the average price for the bigger guys like Topaz etc. You can probably get it cheaper, but I would be wary of places that are much cheaper.
Not all installers or film are the same.
There are various makes of film, but the two big boys are Expel and SunTek. You will most likely find more people using Expel, mainly because their network is bigger.
Not always for the better, as to become an authorised installer, you had to complete a 3 day course and to be any good at it, you have to be doing it for a very long time. With that in mind, it’s always worth checking how long the installer has been doing PPF on cars and how many they do a month.
You have to bare in mind that you are not just buying a product, like you would a washing machine or tv, where you get the exact same thing and only the price may change, depending on who you buy it from.
You are buying x amount of square ft of plastic film and the knowledge that the person installing it is good at what they do and can fit the film correctly and with no issues with fit and lifting.
I used to do any detailing work for Paintshield in peterborough, before they were bought out by Expel U.K and they were one of the only people I would send my clients too, as I know they could do a great job. The one thing they didn’t do very often, which is much more common now, is wrapping the edges of the film around the panel. During my years working along side then, I got to see all sorts of horror show installs and it taught me that not all installations are the same. Some of which had come from the likes of Reep and you wonder how they got out of the door!
I know work with a company called Lionshields near burton on Trent, who I believe are one of the best on the country. You know someone is good if you have to go hunting to find an edge, just to tell it’s even got PPF on there. But that doesn’t matter, this isn’t an advert about me.
Beware of cutting on the car. The cheaper outfits will “bulk” fit the film on panels because they don’t have a plotter or the database of patterns to work off. Or even be able to design themselves. They just fit film using one big sheet and then cut around the edges. In some cases, such as the bonnet, it’s not that bad, but if you’re doing the roof or wing mirrors, you really don’t want to be taking a knife to it. Pre cut patterns stop that and the risk of a blade going through your paint. Most “custom” PPF job you see advertised are usually just another word for bulking the panel and cutting around it.
Just because someone can detail, doesn’t mean they can install film to a high level. To be good at PPF, you need to be doing it a lot and be prepared to lose a lot of money in the early days. Guys that mainly detail and do the odd film job here and there will never be as good as those doing it day in day out.
Film has moved on. It used to be that film was horrible stuff and went yellow over time and got old really quick. The new technology these days makes it so much better, with less orange peel and much more clarity. The bit of film on the side of your cars are not the same btw. They are cheap and should be replaced.
So, is PPF worth it? Yes, if you can afford it and justify it. Is it bomb proof? No, if you’re doing 100mph and a big stone smacks into the front, changes are, it might go through, but will most likely save you painting the panel and getting a chip.
Not all installers are the same. Avoid cheap places and of course Reep group. I’ve seen too many examples of their bad work.
It’s worth getting the car polished before hand too. I know the film does hide some sins, but the car needs to be free of all contamination and you want it as swirl free as possible before the film goes on. Some guys offer for the car to be polished before the film goes on, so I would ask what you are paying for. If they bundle it together, chances are they are just going to give it a quick once over. Always ask for the paint to be properly corrected before the film goes on.
As for coatings on the film. They aren’t that necessary, but they will help with water repellency and bug staining.
I’ll post some bad examples in the comments below.
I thought I would write a separate post about the above instead of it getting lost on another thread. This is aimed at those not so much in the know and just want to know more about it.
So, for those are unsure between the ceramic coatings and PPF. PPF is designed to protect the car with a clear layer of plastic stuck on the paintwork. The PPF will prevent stone chips, scratches, swirl marks etc. The lighter swirl marks and wash marring can be “healed” with heat, but anything too deep and the film will need to be replaced on that panel. The PPF isn’t bulletproof, but will stop the majority of average speed stone chips.
The film does have some texture to it, but is almost invisible on most colours.
You will on average be looking at around £1500+vat for the front end (bonnet,wings,bumper,wing mirrors) £4500+vat for the whole car.
That’s the average price for the bigger guys like Topaz etc. You can probably get it cheaper, but I would be wary of places that are much cheaper.
Not all installers or film are the same.
There are various makes of film, but the two big boys are Expel and SunTek. You will most likely find more people using Expel, mainly because their network is bigger.
Not always for the better, as to become an authorised installer, you had to complete a 3 day course and to be any good at it, you have to be doing it for a very long time. With that in mind, it’s always worth checking how long the installer has been doing PPF on cars and how many they do a month.
You have to bare in mind that you are not just buying a product, like you would a washing machine or tv, where you get the exact same thing and only the price may change, depending on who you buy it from.
You are buying x amount of square ft of plastic film and the knowledge that the person installing it is good at what they do and can fit the film correctly and with no issues with fit and lifting.
I used to do any detailing work for Paintshield in peterborough, before they were bought out by Expel U.K and they were one of the only people I would send my clients too, as I know they could do a great job. The one thing they didn’t do very often, which is much more common now, is wrapping the edges of the film around the panel. During my years working along side then, I got to see all sorts of horror show installs and it taught me that not all installations are the same. Some of which had come from the likes of Reep and you wonder how they got out of the door!
I know work with a company called Lionshields near burton on Trent, who I believe are one of the best on the country. You know someone is good if you have to go hunting to find an edge, just to tell it’s even got PPF on there. But that doesn’t matter, this isn’t an advert about me.
Beware of cutting on the car. The cheaper outfits will “bulk” fit the film on panels because they don’t have a plotter or the database of patterns to work off. Or even be able to design themselves. They just fit film using one big sheet and then cut around the edges. In some cases, such as the bonnet, it’s not that bad, but if you’re doing the roof or wing mirrors, you really don’t want to be taking a knife to it. Pre cut patterns stop that and the risk of a blade going through your paint. Most “custom” PPF job you see advertised are usually just another word for bulking the panel and cutting around it.
Just because someone can detail, doesn’t mean they can install film to a high level. To be good at PPF, you need to be doing it a lot and be prepared to lose a lot of money in the early days. Guys that mainly detail and do the odd film job here and there will never be as good as those doing it day in day out.
Film has moved on. It used to be that film was horrible stuff and went yellow over time and got old really quick. The new technology these days makes it so much better, with less orange peel and much more clarity. The bit of film on the side of your cars are not the same btw. They are cheap and should be replaced.
So, is PPF worth it? Yes, if you can afford it and justify it. Is it bomb proof? No, if you’re doing 100mph and a big stone smacks into the front, changes are, it might go through, but will most likely save you painting the panel and getting a chip.
Not all installers are the same. Avoid cheap places and of course Reep group. I’ve seen too many examples of their bad work.
It’s worth getting the car polished before hand too. I know the film does hide some sins, but the car needs to be free of all contamination and you want it as swirl free as possible before the film goes on. Some guys offer for the car to be polished before the film goes on, so I would ask what you are paying for. If they bundle it together, chances are they are just going to give it a quick once over. Always ask for the paint to be properly corrected before the film goes on.
As for coatings on the film. They aren’t that necessary, but they will help with water repellency and bug staining.
I’ll post some bad examples in the comments below.
paddy328 said:
Some really useful stuff
As a side note, I like cleaning/ detailing my cars (sad I know) up until now I have used wax, like Chemical Guys - Pete's 53 Paste Wax.What are the real benefits of these "new ceramic" sealants? it all seems a bit snake oil.
Would be good to get your opinion
Well, firstly, you should like cleaning your car and standing back and admiring how pretty it is. Or even getting out from the house to do something productive on your pride and joy.
Well, it’s really not snake oil. If it was, I wouldn’t offer it and do myself out of regular repeat business. Quite simply, a coating will offer better protection and much much longer protection than a wax does. This means I see cars every 2 years or so instead of ever 6 months for a “top up”.
Coating companies will claim 5 years plus for the life of their coatings, but while the protection might still be there, over time, cars tend to need a bit of love again, so will need to be clay barred and polished to add some more depth back into the paint and remove some swirl marks. But it really is the best thing you can put on your car.
Well, it’s really not snake oil. If it was, I wouldn’t offer it and do myself out of regular repeat business. Quite simply, a coating will offer better protection and much much longer protection than a wax does. This means I see cars every 2 years or so instead of ever 6 months for a “top up”.
Coating companies will claim 5 years plus for the life of their coatings, but while the protection might still be there, over time, cars tend to need a bit of love again, so will need to be clay barred and polished to add some more depth back into the paint and remove some swirl marks. But it really is the best thing you can put on your car.
Well, I would only suggest a car to have a coating applied after it has been detailed. By that, I mean that it has been clay barred, decontaminated and machine polished to remove the imperfections and swirl marks in the paint. Then, you can apply a coating. A ceramic coating works best when it can bond to a perfectly clean surface. I would never coat a clients unless I was sure the paint was free of everything.
Until you get that done, I would either stick with waxes. Swissvax are my favourite and it would be best to use a paint cleaner, such as their cleaner fluid before hand.
On the flip side. The ultimate finish now do a spray sealant which is very good, similar to wet coat in that you spray it on and then pressure wash it off.
Until you get that done, I would either stick with waxes. Swissvax are my favourite and it would be best to use a paint cleaner, such as their cleaner fluid before hand.
On the flip side. The ultimate finish now do a spray sealant which is very good, similar to wet coat in that you spray it on and then pressure wash it off.
Thank you Paddy -
I fully agree with your assessment that the PPF installer must be very experienced (and have pride in their work) for the best possible results. When I looked for PPF installers near me I was not satisfied that they would meet my standards. One PPF installer had a reputation for good work but did not offer paint correction. I eventually chose a full service detailer (25 years in business) that did proper (and time consuming) preparation, paint correction, and finally a stellar PPF install with no edges showing. And as you mentioned, no razor blades allowed near the vehicle.
I had to drive 90 miles (180 round trip) and rent a car for a week but the final results were worth it.
I fully agree with your assessment that the PPF installer must be very experienced (and have pride in their work) for the best possible results. When I looked for PPF installers near me I was not satisfied that they would meet my standards. One PPF installer had a reputation for good work but did not offer paint correction. I eventually chose a full service detailer (25 years in business) that did proper (and time consuming) preparation, paint correction, and finally a stellar PPF install with no edges showing. And as you mentioned, no razor blades allowed near the vehicle.
I had to drive 90 miles (180 round trip) and rent a car for a week but the final results were worth it.
Hello everyone
I use Griot's products and do my own paint correction and coatings.
It is not hard just have to put in the time.
The G9 is a great buffer and it is hard to hurt your paint. Easy to learn and lots of videos on YouTube.
YOU CAN DO IT!
I have 30+ hours into detailing my Rapide. Just about to the point of starting the paint on it.
Interior, wheel wells, wheels and engine bay have been finished.
Cleaned and treated all the leather and so on. Just time. But they say "If you want it done right, do it yourself."
Good luck on your decision.
I use Griot's products and do my own paint correction and coatings.
It is not hard just have to put in the time.
The G9 is a great buffer and it is hard to hurt your paint. Easy to learn and lots of videos on YouTube.
YOU CAN DO IT!
I have 30+ hours into detailing my Rapide. Just about to the point of starting the paint on it.
Interior, wheel wells, wheels and engine bay have been finished.
Cleaned and treated all the leather and so on. Just time. But they say "If you want it done right, do it yourself."
Good luck on your decision.
On a silver car I wouldn't go too extreme as the results are diminishing. Silver is my favoured car colour due to ease of maintenance and therefore have tested many products on these colours. Having owned and maintained several black cars it comes as a welcome relief!
Definitely use a PPF. Suntek would be my choice currently.
For the ceramic coat I can recommend 22PLE. Great gloss and durability with reasonably easy application. I maintain it with Ultima WW+ Acrylic used as a quick detailer.
HOWEVER, the big game changer for me was Turtle Wax Hybrid Ceramic Spray. I have recently bought into the hype and tested this product on a brand new car in January....instead of using a ceramic coat....and let me tell you it impressed me and continues to do so.
So easy to use (2 sprays per panel!)...use on glass, wheels etc. The results are outstanding.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baUpmyGn9eQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GK5aExA07ys&t=...
Definitely use a PPF. Suntek would be my choice currently.
For the ceramic coat I can recommend 22PLE. Great gloss and durability with reasonably easy application. I maintain it with Ultima WW+ Acrylic used as a quick detailer.
HOWEVER, the big game changer for me was Turtle Wax Hybrid Ceramic Spray. I have recently bought into the hype and tested this product on a brand new car in January....instead of using a ceramic coat....and let me tell you it impressed me and continues to do so.
So easy to use (2 sprays per panel!)...use on glass, wheels etc. The results are outstanding.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=baUpmyGn9eQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GK5aExA07ys&t=...
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