Obesity, is it really an illness or a lifestyle choice?
Discussion
BBC article suggests it is genetic, biological and 'how we live today'.
I'm a little sceptical.
Living with obesity: 'My genes mean I’m hard-wired to store fat' https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57419041
I'm a little sceptical.
Living with obesity: 'My genes mean I’m hard-wired to store fat' https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57419041
eldar said:
BBC article suggests it is genetic, biological
When the allies got to the concentration camps in 1945, it would strangely appear that none of those people had those genes or biology. I don't recall seeing a single person coming out of the camps with a big pot belly saying "been here for 3 years, worked like a slave for hardly any food, but I'm still 20st, I just can't shift it".They were all thin.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
eldar said:
BBC article suggests it is genetic, biological
When the allies got to the concentration camps in 1945, it would strangely appear that none of those people had those genes or biology. I don't recall seeing a single person coming out of the camps with a big pot belly saying "been here for 3 years, worked like a slave for hardly any food, but I'm still 20st, I just can't shift it".They were all thin.
It’s easy to say “no fatties in Belsen were there” but it’s also uninformed.
Are you advocating fat camps then? Feed them gruel and/or force them to do star jumps?
The problem is humans are programmed to stuff their faces with lard and sugar and sit on their arses all day because prior to the last few decades the opportunities to do so were few and far between. Eating less food than your body needs to maintain its weight goes against instincts honed through 50,000 years of evolution. No wonder we have an obesity epidemic when even the lowliest minimum wage worker can buy 5-packof donuts and a Greggs with 15 minutes' wages and most people's jobs involve sitting in a chair or standing around pressing buttons all day.
Anyway, to me it’s often mental issues not an illness as such.
Poor relationship with food.
Comfort eating.
Bad habits becoming ingrained.
Yes, can be laziness or lack of education but I think a lot of it comes down to low self esteem, depression, general unhappiness - reach for the chocolate / ready meals etc. Then it’s the vicious circle of I feel sad and have low self esteem because of my weight, and the thing that gives me a short term boost is a bar of dairy milk.
However there are other reasons.
Middle class lifestyle - I gained 6kg or so due to getting comfortable once married, two bottles of wine per night over a nice meal, the wife likes chocolate so it’s always in the house (I haven’t got great willpower so when single I used to just not buy it - then when it’s constantly available it’s hard to not eat it) and bad habits like a beer when getting in from work becoming something that happens every night, the wife offers a bar of chocolate every evening, it becomes very habitual very quickly and I need to be really careful not to start that sort of thing as it becomes embedded quickly and proves really hard to break out of.
Moving on, I’ve now got two autistic children, post concussive syndrome from a car crash which means a days work exhausts me, and low testosterone levels too - so I have no spare time whatsoever and no energy to exercise even if I did.
As a result I’ve put on a further 18kg and am now just about obese at 112kg and 6’3”.
I’m hoping to get the testosterone thing sorted this summer but I haven’t the slightest idea how I can get time to exercise the blubber back off.
Poor relationship with food.
Comfort eating.
Bad habits becoming ingrained.
Yes, can be laziness or lack of education but I think a lot of it comes down to low self esteem, depression, general unhappiness - reach for the chocolate / ready meals etc. Then it’s the vicious circle of I feel sad and have low self esteem because of my weight, and the thing that gives me a short term boost is a bar of dairy milk.
However there are other reasons.
Middle class lifestyle - I gained 6kg or so due to getting comfortable once married, two bottles of wine per night over a nice meal, the wife likes chocolate so it’s always in the house (I haven’t got great willpower so when single I used to just not buy it - then when it’s constantly available it’s hard to not eat it) and bad habits like a beer when getting in from work becoming something that happens every night, the wife offers a bar of chocolate every evening, it becomes very habitual very quickly and I need to be really careful not to start that sort of thing as it becomes embedded quickly and proves really hard to break out of.
Moving on, I’ve now got two autistic children, post concussive syndrome from a car crash which means a days work exhausts me, and low testosterone levels too - so I have no spare time whatsoever and no energy to exercise even if I did.
As a result I’ve put on a further 18kg and am now just about obese at 112kg and 6’3”.
I’m hoping to get the testosterone thing sorted this summer but I haven’t the slightest idea how I can get time to exercise the blubber back off.
Everyone's genes are hardwired to store fat. It's what allowed us to survive while the lean times back when wheels was wooden or made of rock.
A tiny percentage of people will have a genetic predisposition for something, being massively big, small, whatever, or it's a feature of a genetic condition.
A subset of people will have some sort of significant psychological issue that leads them to obesity,
Everyone else is the middle-ground, so chances are if (me included) you're overweight, it's because you got yourself there.
A tiny percentage of people will have a genetic predisposition for something, being massively big, small, whatever, or it's a feature of a genetic condition.
A subset of people will have some sort of significant psychological issue that leads them to obesity,
Everyone else is the middle-ground, so chances are if (me included) you're overweight, it's because you got yourself there.
I think it depends on how you define the terms "illness" and "lifestyle choice". There is not necessarily a clear distinction between the two.
Would obese people lose weight if they ate less, yes of course they would (there are a very small number of people who would actually starve to death without burning their body-fat, but that's clearly not what we're talking about here). Do different people have biological/genetic dispositions towards eating different amounts, yes of course they do. Do some mental illnesses cause people to eat more? Undoubtedly.
Personally I am of the opinion that it's more helpful to individuals to treat it as a medical problem, but probably more helpful to society as a whole to treat it as a social one.
Would obese people lose weight if they ate less, yes of course they would (there are a very small number of people who would actually starve to death without burning their body-fat, but that's clearly not what we're talking about here). Do different people have biological/genetic dispositions towards eating different amounts, yes of course they do. Do some mental illnesses cause people to eat more? Undoubtedly.
Personally I am of the opinion that it's more helpful to individuals to treat it as a medical problem, but probably more helpful to society as a whole to treat it as a social one.
Edited by kambites on Thursday 17th June 10:59
All of the above I certainly agree with, there's a lot more to the reasons people are eating too much.
I was over 100kg and got to 76kg from exercise and caring a little more about what I ate, even if I believed some people were 'hard wired to be fat' those people would make up a tiny fraction of the currently 28% of the UK that are obese. The overweight thing I think is a bit harsh based on BMI scale, I've just plugged in my current weight/height and I'm overweight. 32" jeans and cycle most days at a decent intensity.
I was over 100kg and got to 76kg from exercise and caring a little more about what I ate, even if I believed some people were 'hard wired to be fat' those people would make up a tiny fraction of the currently 28% of the UK that are obese. The overweight thing I think is a bit harsh based on BMI scale, I've just plugged in my current weight/height and I'm overweight. 32" jeans and cycle most days at a decent intensity.
I think there are 2 factors here.
Firstly, in the main it really is as simple as calories in vs calorie expenditure. You can’t get fat in a deficit. Anyone who suggests they barely eat and still get fat are not being honest with themselves.
However, our lifestyles, work, food available/cost and the addictive nature of fatty and/or sugar laden foods means that only those with extremely strong willpower seem able to resist eating more than they really need.
I wouldn’t therefore say it’s an illness, but i also don’t think it’s a proactive lifestyle choice. Surely nobody wakes up one day and thinks “f
k it, I’m going to get fat as fk”.
Firstly, in the main it really is as simple as calories in vs calorie expenditure. You can’t get fat in a deficit. Anyone who suggests they barely eat and still get fat are not being honest with themselves.
However, our lifestyles, work, food available/cost and the addictive nature of fatty and/or sugar laden foods means that only those with extremely strong willpower seem able to resist eating more than they really need.
I wouldn’t therefore say it’s an illness, but i also don’t think it’s a proactive lifestyle choice. Surely nobody wakes up one day and thinks “f
k it, I’m going to get fat as fk”. FNG said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
eldar said:
BBC article suggests it is genetic, biological
When the allies got to the concentration camps in 1945, it would strangely appear that none of those people had those genes or biology. I don't recall seeing a single person coming out of the camps with a big pot belly saying "been here for 3 years, worked like a slave for hardly any food, but I'm still 20st, I just can't shift it".They were all thin.
It’s easy to say “no fatties in Belsen were there” but it’s also uninformed.
Are you advocating fat camps then? Feed them gruel and/or force them to do star jumps?
okgo said:
All of the above I certainly agree with, there's a lot more to the reasons people are eating too much.
I was over 100kg and got to 76kg from exercise and caring a little more about what I ate, even if I believed some people were 'hard wired to be fat' those people would make up a tiny fraction of the currently 28% of the UK that are obese. The overweight thing I think is a bit harsh based on BMI scale, I've just plugged in my current weight/height and I'm overweight. 32" jeans and cycle most days at a decent intensity.
The BMI thing is a crap measurement in my opinion. I'm similar to you, can cycle 50 miles quite easily, run 10km plus at a decent pace and generally run circles around a lot of people without killing myself, yet I'm overweight on the BMI scale as well. I was over 100kg and got to 76kg from exercise and caring a little more about what I ate, even if I believed some people were 'hard wired to be fat' those people would make up a tiny fraction of the currently 28% of the UK that are obese. The overweight thing I think is a bit harsh based on BMI scale, I've just plugged in my current weight/height and I'm overweight. 32" jeans and cycle most days at a decent intensity.
towser44 said:
The BMI thing is a crap measurement in my opinion. I'm similar to you, can cycle 50 miles quite easily, run 10km plus at a decent pace and generally run circles around a lot of people without killing myself, yet I'm overweight on the BMI scale as well.
The counter argument is that anyone with that degree of fitness is likely to know that the BMI scale isn't really suitable for them and hence that they can ignore it. For those who don't know enough about fitness and health to understand that BMI has its limits, it's probably quite accurate.Of course it also has to be mentioned that it's perfectly possible to be both fit (in the muscular and cardiovascular sense) and be carrying unhealthy amounts of body-fat.
kambites said:
The counter argument is that anyone with that degree of fitness is likely to know that the BMI scale isn't really suitable for them and hence that they can ignore it. For those who don't know enough about fitness and health to understand that BMI has its limits, it's probably quite accurate.
I tend to agree but cycling isn't really something that gives people 'the rugger build' you usually hear about on such threads. I was surprised overweight was set as low as it is. Anyway, Obese probably is quite reliable.Gassing Station | The Lounge | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff