Will VAR Change Football for the Better?
Discussion
Melchett1905 said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Melchett1905 said:
nobody knows for sure whether incident 2 would have happened had incident 1 been given.
We all know for sure apart from you...it wouldn't have happened. Yes, we may have got another corner at some point, as yes, he may have tugged a shirt at that corner and given away a pen. Or he might have got sent off for pushing the ref when he gave the first pen. Or Hazard may have hit the post from the pen and Spurs might have scored from the rebound. Or Hazard might have scored the pen, slipped when celebrating, broken his leg and never played again. He could have slipped, banged his head, died, and the game have been abandoned. And because it finished early, you got up to do something else, and also died as a result.
All kinds of stuff might have happened, apart from what did happen. That definitely wouldn't have happened.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Melchett1905 said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Melchett1905 said:
nobody knows for sure whether incident 2 would have happened had incident 1 been given.
We all know for sure apart from you...it wouldn't have happened. Yes, we may have got another corner at some point, as yes, he may have tugged a shirt at that corner and given away a pen. Or he might have got sent off for pushing the ref when he gave the first pen. Or Hazard may have hit the post from the pen and Spurs might have scored from the rebound. Or Hazard might have scored the pen, slipped when celebrating, broken his leg and never played again. He could have slipped, banged his head, died, and the game have been abandoned. And because it finished early, you got up to do something else, and also died as a result.
All kinds of stuff might have happened, apart from what did happen. That definitely wouldn't have happened.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Melchett1905 said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Melchett1905 said:
nobody knows for sure whether incident 2 would have happened had incident 1 been given.
We all know for sure apart from you...it wouldn't have happened. Yes, we may have got another corner at some point, as yes, he may have tugged a shirt at that corner and given away a pen. Or he might have got sent off for pushing the ref when he gave the first pen. Or Hazard may have hit the post from the pen and Spurs might have scored from the rebound. Or Hazard might have scored the pen, slipped when celebrating, broken his leg and never played again. He could have slipped, banged his head, died, and the game have been abandoned. And because it finished early, you got up to do something else, and also died as a result.
All kinds of stuff might have happened, apart from what did happen. That definitely wouldn't have happened.
Melchett1905 said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Melchett1905 said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Melchett1905 said:
nobody knows for sure whether incident 2 would have happened had incident 1 been given.
We all know for sure apart from you...it wouldn't have happened. Yes, we may have got another corner at some point, as yes, he may have tugged a shirt at that corner and given away a pen. Or he might have got sent off for pushing the ref when he gave the first pen. Or Hazard may have hit the post from the pen and Spurs might have scored from the rebound. Or Hazard might have scored the pen, slipped when celebrating, broken his leg and never played again. He could have slipped, banged his head, died, and the game have been abandoned. And because it finished early, you got up to do something else, and also died as a result.
All kinds of stuff might have happened, apart from what did happen. That definitely wouldn't have happened.
Pick up a glass. Drop it in the middle of the floor and take a picture of where every piece lands. Now pick up another glass and drop that. The chances of all those pieces of glass landing in the same place are centillions to one. You would literally have to drop that glass an infinite number of times more to get the same result.
On a football pitch, once a decision is made which changes the game to any degree (like not awarding a penalty vs awarding one) then that same thing happens but to an even further degree because, unlike dropping the glass which is one event, many will occur one after the other - the chances of the match ever aligning so exactly the same events occur at any point in the game are as close to zero as you could possibly get.
Now, don't confuse the chances of , say Hazard breaking his leg as the same and think that if that happened then the chances of your shirt pulling would happen because the Hazard example is just one of centillions of examples of what may happen. In other words, something will happen we know that - it just won't be what did happen.
Is that any clearer ?! For the love of god tell me the penny has dropped.
Edited by jcremonini on Tuesday 11th December 12:34
jcremonini said:
I know this is very hard for you to grasp so let me try again.
Pick up a glass. Drop it in the middle of the floor and take a picture of where every piece lands. Now pick up another glass and drop that. The chances of all those pieces of glass landing in the same place are centillions to one. You would literally have to drop that glass an infinite number of times more to get the same result.
On a football pitch, once a decision is made which changes the game to any degree (like not awarding a penalty vs awarding one) then that same thing happens but to an even further degree because, unlike dropping the glass which is one event, many will occur one after the other - the chances of the match ever aligning so exactly the same events occur at any point in the game are as close to zero as you could possibly get.
Now, don't confuse the chances of , say Hazard breaking his leg as the same and think that if that happened then the chances of your shirt pulling would happen because the Hazard example is just one of centillions of examples of what may happen. In other words, something will happen we know that - it just won't be what did happen.
Is that any clearer ?! For the love of god tell me the penny has dropped.
With the glass analogy, you should drop one in the middle of the floor, then smash the next one against the wall. There is no way the shattered pieces could end up the same, not least as the impact mark will be in a different place, just as would the ball as it would be restarted from different points in the pitch. Pick up a glass. Drop it in the middle of the floor and take a picture of where every piece lands. Now pick up another glass and drop that. The chances of all those pieces of glass landing in the same place are centillions to one. You would literally have to drop that glass an infinite number of times more to get the same result.
On a football pitch, once a decision is made which changes the game to any degree (like not awarding a penalty vs awarding one) then that same thing happens but to an even further degree because, unlike dropping the glass which is one event, many will occur one after the other - the chances of the match ever aligning so exactly the same events occur at any point in the game are as close to zero as you could possibly get.
Now, don't confuse the chances of , say Hazard breaking his leg as the same and think that if that happened then the chances of your shirt pulling would happen because the Hazard example is just one of centillions of examples of what may happen. In other words, something will happen we know that - it just won't be what did happen.
Is that any clearer ?! For the love of god tell me the penny has dropped.
Edited by jcremonini on Tuesday 11th December 12:34
You are wasting your time with the other poster, but I completely agree with you.
Edited by graylag on Tuesday 11th December 13:46
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Melchett1905 said:
Where did you get that crystal ball?
I got it in shop B. I visited shop A first, but they'd run out. If shop A had them in stock, I wouldn't have go on to shop B. No doubt you think I'm unlucky not to have bought 2 crystal balls!
graylag said:
Melchett1905 said:
On the way to shop A you may have tripped over. That doesn't mean you wouldn't trip over on the way to shop B too.
Equally, just because he tripped up on the way to Shop A it doesn’t mean that he will trip up on the way to Shop B. Black can man said:
If this was given i reckon Spurs would have won the league, then the champions league, & dominated the English game for ever as well as winning the Champions league at least 10 times.
Melchett1905 said:
mikal83 said:
Walcott clearly offside, both linesman and ref missed it. 1-2 for Watford would have been massive for them
Yes. Terrible decision by the officials. I have no faith in VAR - it was demonstrably in favour of bigger teams in the world cup.
Puggit said:
Melchett1905 said:
mikal83 said:
Walcott clearly offside, both linesman and ref missed it. 1-2 for Watford would have been massive for them
Yes. Terrible decision by the officials. I have no faith in VAR - it was demonstrably in favour of bigger teams in the world cup.
Black can man said:
If this was given i reckon Spurs would have won the league, then the champions league, & dominated the English game for ever as well as winning the Champions league at least 10 times.
So over the last week or so VAR has made two decisions which turned out to be incorrect.
Kane last week v Chelsea, his head/torso was offside - the linesman was correct to flag him off.
and last night
Derby's disallowed goal - he was onside. The defenders shoulder was in line with the attackers foot.
Kane last week v Chelsea, his head/torso was offside - the linesman was correct to flag him off.
and last night
Derby's disallowed goal - he was onside. The defenders shoulder was in line with the attackers foot.
Melchett1905 said:
So over the last week or so VAR has made two decisions which turned out to be incorrect.
Kane last week v Chelsea, his head/torso was offside - the linesman was correct to flag him off.
and last night
Derby's disallowed goal - he was onside. The defenders shoulder was in line with the attackers foot.
It's utter crap. Even if they'd got the calls right, it would still be utter crap. Because it's crap. Kane last week v Chelsea, his head/torso was offside - the linesman was correct to flag him off.
and last night
Derby's disallowed goal - he was onside. The defenders shoulder was in line with the attackers foot.
So we're told VAR will be good because it'll stop the bigger clubs getting all the decisions, because the refs all favour the big clubs.
So the ref gives a pen to Sheff Weds against Chelsea, and VAR overrules it. So another VAR myth exposed.
Perhaps the reason that the top teams tend to get more pens is because they spend more time in the opposition penalty area. VAR will not change that.
So the ref gives a pen to Sheff Weds against Chelsea, and VAR overrules it. So another VAR myth exposed.
Perhaps the reason that the top teams tend to get more pens is because they spend more time in the opposition penalty area. VAR will not change that.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Perhaps the reason that the top teams tend to get more pens is because they spend more time in the opposition penalty area. VAR will not change that.
I agree with that. I also think that mistakes are too often overlooked in games. If the big team wins 3-0 everyone quickly forgets the errors as they didn't influence the result.
However, the small team never forgets the wrong decision that cost them as it's often one of their few key chances they had.
Everyone manages to forget all the wrong decisions that went their way.
Could have done with VAR in my son's game yesterday; game poised at 2-2 and in the final 30 seconds our striker was one on one with the keeper. He got past him and the keeper tripped him. Stonewall penalty. Only, the ref was looking at his watch.
The team plays in a friendly league so point in arguing about it... even though the referee was the opposition's manager's son.
The team plays in a friendly league so point in arguing about it... even though the referee was the opposition's manager's son.
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