The new grille on the roadster.
Discussion
james-witton said:
Pause... take a deep breath... and....
After moaning about the front of the new Vantage since it came out I now prefer it to the old style grille put onto the roadster.
I can’t believe I’m saying this but it looks like a retro step now.
Be gentle.
I agree. I think the 'hunter' grille on the coupe looks fantastic. The caveat being the right colour scheme. And for me, it looks so much better in the flesh than in photographs. The 'new' (or is it the old ?) slatted grille I think looks great too. Which one would I choose if I was in the market for a Vantage, I couldn't honestly say at this point. The outright aggressiveness of the original, or the softer appearance of the new one ? At least buyers now have a choice, which can only be a good thing. After moaning about the front of the new Vantage since it came out I now prefer it to the old style grille put onto the roadster.
I can’t believe I’m saying this but it looks like a retro step now.
Be gentle.
Octavarium said:
I agree. I think the 'hunter' grille on the coupe looks fantastic. The caveat being the right colour scheme. And for me, it looks so much better in the flesh than in photographs. The 'new' (or is it the old ?) slatted grille I think looks great too. Which one would I choose if I was in the market for a Vantage, I couldn't honestly say at this point. The outright aggressiveness of the original, or the softer appearance of the new one ? At least buyers now have a choice, which can only be a good thing.
Completely agree with this. Having the choice is definitely a good thing. Will be interesting to see what the split will be over time.
Beckson said:
New front is 100% better!
It'll be curious to see ........ if they will ever put a 600+ hp V12 in it.
I think the choice of grille is great for potential buyersIt'll be curious to see ........ if they will ever put a 600+ hp V12 in it.
personally its now a hard choice as the original look has grown on me, and i like the images of the revised grille - need to see one on a car up close
I'm told they will be putting a V12 in it one day (of course that was unofficial but from someone who should have some idea)
Graze
Like the OP I have been a critic of the previous grille, but it looks subtle compared to the new option. I think they could have done traditional without the whole fishface thing. What it lacks is the understatement that should be essential in an Aston Martin. It’s as if they tried to put a DB11 grille on the Vantage, but failed. Good luck to them, it’s still not my scene.
Graze01 said:
I'm told they will be putting a V12 in it one day (of course that was unofficial but from someone who should have some idea)
We have been told by AP that the V12 will fit, same pickup points as the DB11. However, as it is a much heavier engine (spoil the present handling), and there is a 600 bhp version of the AMG V8, why do it ?
I must say I kind of prefer the original too. In a strange way it does look more understated than the enormous slatted fishface.
The Roadster looks OK but not a great design in my opinion.
The two fixed roll bars and partly exposed soft top when open are to my eyes a step backwards desgnwise as opposed to the previous model's soft top which was completely hidden under a cover with leather hoops.
It doesn't look as special and dare I say the similar looking F-Type looks now much better since the new facelift and the Supercharged Jaguar V8 is a peach of an engine.
Bottom line: would I trade my V12 S Roadster with the Performance Pack for this? NO WAY!
P.S.: I'm not a naysayer, I just don't like the new design, I hope AML sell loads as I'm a big Aston fan and want the company to succeed.
Just saying.
The Roadster looks OK but not a great design in my opinion.
The two fixed roll bars and partly exposed soft top when open are to my eyes a step backwards desgnwise as opposed to the previous model's soft top which was completely hidden under a cover with leather hoops.
It doesn't look as special and dare I say the similar looking F-Type looks now much better since the new facelift and the Supercharged Jaguar V8 is a peach of an engine.
Bottom line: would I trade my V12 S Roadster with the Performance Pack for this? NO WAY!
P.S.: I'm not a naysayer, I just don't like the new design, I hope AML sell loads as I'm a big Aston fan and want the company to succeed.
Just saying.
Of course this all comes down to personal taste and personally I usually sit on the fence ...... but Gaydon modern era Aston Martins have always been things of real beauty combined with a powerful predatory stance, a design that takes classic styling cues and wraps them in a modern flowing shape that seems to appeal to pretty much all, men and women.
The new Vantage design is much more fractious, polarising and marmite... you either love it or hate it, you only have to see the Top Gear review to know that opinions are split in a way not encountered previously.
Having the option of a classic style grille has to be a good thing and extends the appeal of the design, now you can choose which appeals to YOU, neither is wrong or right.... but give me the new grille every time
https://www.designboom.com/technology/aston-martin...
The new Vantage design is much more fractious, polarising and marmite... you either love it or hate it, you only have to see the Top Gear review to know that opinions are split in a way not encountered previously.
Having the option of a classic style grille has to be a good thing and extends the appeal of the design, now you can choose which appeals to YOU, neither is wrong or right.... but give me the new grille every time
https://www.designboom.com/technology/aston-martin...
Factory - Here's the new Vantage, isn't it fantastic
Pistonheads - ugh, the front is horrible and ugly.
Factory - We think its fantastic we are not listening to you.
Pistonheads - its ugly and we wont buy it.
Factory - OK you win, here's a re-designed front, but you can still have the original one.
Pistonheads - Oh, can I order one with the the old design please, I've got used to it now
Pistonheads - ugh, the front is horrible and ugly.
Factory - We think its fantastic we are not listening to you.
Pistonheads - its ugly and we wont buy it.
Factory - OK you win, here's a re-designed front, but you can still have the original one.
Pistonheads - Oh, can I order one with the the old design please, I've got used to it now
Jon39 said:
Graze01 said:
I'm told they will be putting a V12 in it one day (of course that was unofficial but from someone who should have some idea)
We have been told by AP that the V12 will fit, same pickup points as the DB11. However, as it is a much heavier engine (spoil the present handling), and there is a 600 bhp version of the AMG V8, why do it ?
The last Vantage had a V12 fitted because they could, but it didn't help the handling or balance, it made it a thug of a car that made a great noise. In hindsight most would agree that the V8VS was the sweet spot in terms of balance though. It comes down to whether you want a car that priorities dynamics and handling over brute force and acceleration.
The V6 engine being developed in-house that will replace the M177 V8 in the near future, will probably make the V8 look asthmatic by comparison, as well as being lighter.
Back to the front end though to stay on topic; it's a very subjective thing - the design team cant please everyone, all the time. The new design and old design should cover most bases, but as already mentioned, re-designing the headlights means adding a chunk of overhang to miss the wheel arch, and that means restyling the entire car, such is the way the top line was penned on the original, a large increase in overhang would make the car have the proportions of a Senna, and that's far from a traditionally pretty car.
It's much easier being a stylist at Porsche...
Neil1300r said:
Factory - Here's the new Vantage, isn't it fantastic
Pistonheads - ugh, the front is horrible and ugly.
Factory - We think its fantastic we are not listening to you.
Pistonheads - its ugly and we wont buy it.
Factory - OK you win, here's a re-designed front, but you can still have the original one.
Pistonheads - Oh, can I order one with the the old design please, I've got used to it now
LOL.... nice one Neil, only I think on balance the new grille will win out and bring extra Vantage sales for Aston, which has to be a good thing Pistonheads - ugh, the front is horrible and ugly.
Factory - We think its fantastic we are not listening to you.
Pistonheads - its ugly and we wont buy it.
Factory - OK you win, here's a re-designed front, but you can still have the original one.
Pistonheads - Oh, can I order one with the the old design please, I've got used to it now
OK I have gone as far as the configurator - which persuaded me the coupe is better looking than the roadster, and I think the new grille does look better - but it would have to be in orange with black - completely out of character for me tbh
for some reason when i screen shot the image it changes the grill back to the Lesley Ash lips
for some reason when i screen shot the image it changes the grill back to the Lesley Ash lips
Edited by oilit on Friday 14th February 10:50
I`ve never found the new grill as jarring as many. Admittedly I was a bit taken aback when it was first released, but after seeing it live I didn`t mind it at all, and obviously over the course of a couple of years it has become the norm. The new/old grill, shall we say retro-grill, I don`t mind either, the extended bodywork gives a slight "duck-lips" look from some image angles, maybe that does not come across live, otherwise it is much the treatment that many wanted to see and seems to garner the desired enthusiasm.
Having said that I don`t think it looks quite like the 4.0 Vantage anymore. The more aggressive hunter grill suits the design language better I feel, than the retro-grill.
The thing that always bothered me the most about the hunter grill was the mesh, which looks to me as if it`s cheaply manufactured, almost a prototype hole filler, and I maintain that if that was replaced with the traditional vanes within the hunter grill, it would be the best scenario all together.
There we go, still not satisfied.
Having said that I don`t think it looks quite like the 4.0 Vantage anymore. The more aggressive hunter grill suits the design language better I feel, than the retro-grill.
The thing that always bothered me the most about the hunter grill was the mesh, which looks to me as if it`s cheaply manufactured, almost a prototype hole filler, and I maintain that if that was replaced with the traditional vanes within the hunter grill, it would be the best scenario all together.
There we go, still not satisfied.
Neil1300r said:
Factory - Here's the new Vantage, isn't it fantastic
Pistonheads - ugh, the front is horrible and ugly.
Factory - We think its fantastic we are not listening to you.
Pistonheads - its ugly and we wont buy it.
Factory - OK you win, here's a re-designed front, but you can still have the original one.
Pistonheads - Oh, can I order one with the the old design please, I've got used to it now
Pistonheads - ugh, the front is horrible and ugly.
Factory - We think its fantastic we are not listening to you.
Pistonheads - its ugly and we wont buy it.
Factory - OK you win, here's a re-designed front, but you can still have the original one.
Pistonheads - Oh, can I order one with the the old design please, I've got used to it now
Yes indeed Neil, there is a saying for that, what is it now? When it takes time for something to be appreciated (although when it is being given away, it becomes instantly perfect).
I was privileged to be shown a sketch of the future Vantage by one of the design team, on 9th April 2017 at the St Athan open day.
My comment to the designer was, "If that front is on the production model, there might be difficulties". I did not repeat that to anyone else.
In the recent Company trading statement it was finally admitted, that Vantage sales have not met expectations.
The slatted grille has been a continuous and widely recognised brand feature, for over 60 years on Aston Martin road cars.
AP has said that each new core model must look different (Andy's mother test). Presumably the designers therefore followed his brief. They took the grille design from the Vulcan track car. Unfortunately it appears to have had implications on the finances of the Company.
If only they had thought more deeply about the brand history. The choice of grille being offered now, clearly should have been available at launch time. Letting the customer decide often works.
Numerouus PHers told them.
Mr.Tremlini said:
The thing that always bothered me the most about the hunter grill was the mesh, which looks to me as if it`s cheaply manufactured, almost a prototype hole filler, and I maintain that if that was replaced with the traditional vanes within the hunter grill, it would be the best scenario all together.
I agree with this. The whole design of the Vantage front end seems to 'need' the hunter style grille to hang together properly, so I think AM should have just added traditional vanes as an option. I never liked the massive expanse of mesh personally - it's not opaque enough to hide all the gubbins behind it and such a large area of what's a pretty basic and cheap material just doesn't sit well on a premium/luxury product. I have the same issue with the Range Rover Velar - which has some lovely design details, all ruined to my eye by a big chunk of mesh on the lower front bumper.As I'm more of a traditionalist styling wise, I think the new grille is a nice try by AM, but it wouldn't suddenly turn me into a potential customer for the new Vantage. It's still too aggressive and 'showy' for my tastes. Add some bigger headlights, some decent size bonnet vents, a better executed side vent, a tidier and better integrated rear diffuser and I might be persuaded. That's basically the DB10 and I'll always think it's a shame that this ended up as just a one-off Bond car rather than the new Vantage...
Agree on the extended bodywork around the edge of the new grill - brings the nose/bumper bodywork out to I assume the same level as the original grill splitter type surround.
Does original grill surround at top help force high pressure air through the grill for cooling etc or push high pressure air over the bonnet to counter lift at high speed?
So assume new lips do the much same and not just necessary for new large vanes to be fitted.
The black smaller vanes in existing grill does look good though.
Does original grill surround at top help force high pressure air through the grill for cooling etc or push high pressure air over the bonnet to counter lift at high speed?
So assume new lips do the much same and not just necessary for new large vanes to be fitted.
The black smaller vanes in existing grill does look good though.
I am pretty sure that aerodynamics dictated the new grill outer shape.
Or, in simpler terms this was the easiest way to keep the initial aero balance (& cooling) intact.
Basically the outer shape is generated like stretching a rubber film over the lips of the "hunter grill".
On top they had to elongate the nose to "keep the stretch".
So it's most likely that the shape of the "mouth" is the same and that the new blades fit into the old hunter grill without much modifications.
Or, in simpler terms this was the easiest way to keep the initial aero balance (& cooling) intact.
Basically the outer shape is generated like stretching a rubber film over the lips of the "hunter grill".
On top they had to elongate the nose to "keep the stretch".
So it's most likely that the shape of the "mouth" is the same and that the new blades fit into the old hunter grill without much modifications.
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