Lorry Drivers - Tachograph Limits

Lorry Drivers - Tachograph Limits

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Conscript

Original Poster:

1,378 posts

120 months

Friday 17th November 2017
quotequote all
Interested in some experiences from any lorry drivers on here regarding a minor drama this morning. I needed to get fuel on the way to work so popped into a Shell station just off the A2 at Gravesend. As I came off the roundabout I got caught behind a Dutch lorry heading to the same station. The lorry pumps are all occupied, so we as we get to the forecourt, he stops, blocking the entire entrance.

I wait behind him, guessing he's just going to go past and park up out of the way for a bit, but he sits there a bit longer, still blocking the entrance. By this time, several vans and cars have pulled up behind me, also trying to get into the station. He hasn't moved, then his hazards come on. Tooting ensues.

He eventually backs up a bit so he can get onto the forecourt, and pulls onto it out of the way of the pumps...but he is now stopped across the entire parking area, which is full, blocking in several cars. I can now get around him to the pumps, so I do so.

Whilst I'm filling up, one of the station attendants comes out and starts talking to the lorry passenger (there's two people in the cab). I'm kind of watching idly, not paying much attention, but it evidently starts to get a bit heated. One of the people who is blocked in has returned to her car and now needs to get out. Another attendant comes out and also starts remonstrating with the driver in the cab. More tooting ensues.

I go inside to pay by which time the first attendant is back at the cash desk, so I ask him what's going on. Apparently the driver has said he's not moving as he's hit his tachograph limit and needs to stop. As I get back into my car and leave, the driver apparently finally concedes to move backwards out of the station unblocking some rather angry look car drivers.

My query is about the use of tachographs - are they really so restrictive that some drivers would rather stop dead in such a situation and refuse to move, even when causing an obstruction? Is there no allowance for manoeuvring, or getting yourself to a safe resting spot before coming to a stop? What are the penalties for exceeding your time limits, and would they still apply if you could prove you absolutely had to move? And is it common for drivers to suddenly find themselves reaching their limit, or is there any kind of advance warning to allow them to find a safe area to stop?

Just posting out of curiosity really.

Edited by Conscript on Friday 17th November 10:32

Decky_Q

1,500 posts

176 months

Friday 17th November 2017
quotequote all
There is an allowance that can be used occasionally to go over by 15-30mins (it can only happen once in a set time period) to deal with this type of situation. He may have already used this allowance on his trip to the UK, and so couldn't continue.

In the real world though DVA aren't going to be stopping him in the filling station so he could take his card out and park up with no consequence.

the mac

99 posts

145 months

Friday 17th November 2017
quotequote all
Tachographs as such have largely been done away with unless it’s an old truck, you now have a tacho digital card a bit like your driving license which you insert into the tacho in the truck.
So everything you do is downloaded onto your card and will hold 28 days worth of work, at the push of a button the tacho machine will tell you how long you have been driving and how long till you need a break, it will also start flashing when you have 15 mins drive time remaining. As I’m sure you can imagine it’s not always easy finding somewhere to park an artic for a 45 min break particularly if you are in a city however you certainly know it’s coming and unless your certain of a place to park it’s never wise to run up to your limit(4.5hrs)
As for moving the vehicle whilst on a break you would get an infringement on your card for this, technically it’s not the end of the world however if stopped at some point by police/dvsa you will get grief but not necessarily fined if it’s a one off and you don’t have a pattern of doing this. The difficulty always is when the worst thing happens like being involved in a fatal accident that interrupted break becomes a lot more serious!
There is a lot more to it but hopefully that answers your question.

mp3manager

4,254 posts

195 months

Friday 17th November 2017
quotequote all
Driver was being a dick. You can put a tacho on rest, then move forward a few feet, (thus clearing the way for everybody), without it interrupting the rest mode.

Conscript

Original Poster:

1,378 posts

120 months

Friday 17th November 2017
quotequote all
Double post.

Conscript

Original Poster:

1,378 posts

120 months

Friday 17th November 2017
quotequote all
the mac said:
Tachographs as such have largely been done away with unless it’s an old truck, you now have a tacho digital card a bit like your driving license which you insert into the tacho in the truck.
So everything you do is downloaded onto your card and will hold 28 days worth of work, at the push of a button the tacho machine will tell you how long you have been driving and how long till you need a break, it will also start flashing when you have 15 mins drive time remaining. As I’m sure you can imagine it’s not always easy finding somewhere to park an artic for a 45 min break particularly if you are in a city however you certainly know it’s coming and unless your certain of a place to park it’s never wise to run up to your limit(4.5hrs)
As for moving the vehicle whilst on a break you would get an infringement on your card for this, technically it’s not the end of the world however if stopped at some point by police/dvsa you will get grief but not necessarily fined if it’s a one off and you don’t have a pattern of doing this. The difficulty always is when the worst thing happens like being involved in a fatal accident that interrupted break becomes a lot more serious!
There is a lot more to it but hopefully that answers your question.
It does indeed, thanks smile
Yes, I sympathise that it must be a right faff finding somewhere to stop safely. But equally, I couldn't believe that a driver would be so restricted that he'd just dump his lorry blocking lots of people then when asked to move, just be like "sorry, tacho, lol".

Helpful responses. Thanks, both smile

the mac

99 posts

145 months

Friday 17th November 2017
quotequote all
Yeah it’s pretty daft to attempt to take a break whilst blocking cars in as it’s a certainty that people will want out, it’s also a rubbish break if you spend it arguing with everyone for 45 mins, I wouldn’t block anyone in however unlike another poster wrote once I’m on a break the vehicle won’t be moving unless told to by the police they then need to sign a Tacho printout for you.

Edited by the mac on Friday 17th November 11:07

Section 8

541 posts

188 months

Friday 17th November 2017
quotequote all
You have to be pretty special to have ran out of driving time/WTD and just pull up blocking everyone to take a rest break. Rightly so as someone said you can pull forwards several metres and hit break again and it will continue on as before.

Personally if that was me i would tuck in somewhere out of the way as i was told by DVSA that they can go back as far as 6 months on a digi card and the last thing i would want is those buggers on my case.


Nickyboy

6,700 posts

233 months

Friday 17th November 2017
quotequote all
Would have been an Eastern European driver (the ones you see under bridges on the M25)

Yes, in theory if they've run out of hours then they're breaking the law if they continue but most people would use a little common sense. As someone else said you have a little bit of grace but the EE's are often scrutinised by DVSA & Police due to their relaxed attitude to driving rules etc so some will stick to the letter of the law.

They can however be moved on by the Police if they are causing an obstruction whether out of hours or not.

R0G

4,984 posts

154 months

Saturday 18th November 2017
quotequote all
Idiotic LGV driver being pedantic with a total lack of common sense - does that sum up the driver who blocked it all off ?

grumpy52

5,565 posts

165 months

Monday 20th November 2017
quotequote all
He is more likely to get grief from old bill /DVSA for lack of planning for his breaks .
Especially if its a digi tacho as they flash at 4hrs 15 mins reminding the driver to take a break .
Driver was being a dick especially if the passenger was a second driver who could easily have changed over and moved the vehicle.
Many older models of tachograph only record after a minute in any mode which is why you see trucks in stop start traffic trying to keep still for 60+ seconds as this extends the available driving time instead of wasting it whilst stationary in traffic . The later tachographs are much more efficient and accurate at recording various modes .

eldar

21,614 posts

195 months

Monday 20th November 2017
quotequote all
grumpy52 said:
He is more likely to get grief from old bill /DVSA for lack of planning for his breaks .
Especially if its a digi tacho as they flash at 4hrs 15 mins reminding the driver to take a break .
Driver was being a dick especially if the passenger was a second driver who could easily have changed over and moved the vehicle.
Many older models of tachograph only record after a minute in any mode which is why you see trucks in stop start traffic trying to keep still for 60+ seconds as this extends the available driving time instead of wasting it whilst stationary in traffic . The later tachographs are much more efficient and accurate at recording various modes .
So what happens if a truck gets stuck in a traffic jam? IE, driver has 60 minutes left, expects to reach destination in 30 minutes but gets stuck in traffic such as a motorway closure? Can't exit or pull over.

markymarkthree

2,236 posts

170 months

Monday 20th November 2017
quotequote all
If driver is in stationary traffic he can put taco to break.


eldar

21,614 posts

195 months

Monday 20th November 2017
quotequote all
markymarkthree said:
If driver is in stationary traffic he can put taco to break.
Seems sensible. Thanks.

R0G

4,984 posts

154 months

Tuesday 21st November 2017
quotequote all
driving time on a tacho only records when the vehicle is moving so every time the vehicle is motionless it does not record driving time

grumpy52

5,565 posts

165 months

Tuesday 21st November 2017
quotequote all
As rog has said modern digi tachographs record only when the vehicle is in motion so blaming traffic jams for exceeding driving time is rarely accepted by the authorities.
I always tried to plan not to run to the maximum time especially during rush hour .
The availability of traffic information and modern sat navs makes planning so much easier .

Fun Bus

17,911 posts

217 months

Thursday 23rd November 2017
quotequote all
eldar said:
markymarkthree said:
If driver is in stationary traffic he can put taco to break.
Seems sensible. Thanks.
And as soon as the driver moves, the tacho switches mode breaking the uninterrupted break the law requires.

R0G

4,984 posts

154 months

Friday 24th November 2017
quotequote all
Fun Bus said:
And as soon as the driver moves, the tacho switches mode breaking the uninterrupted break the law requires.
If stopped in traffic for 1 minute on break then that is still a break of 1 minute even though it will not count as a driving time break

markymarkthree

2,236 posts

170 months

Friday 24th November 2017
quotequote all
Fun Bus said:
eldar said:
markymarkthree said:
If driver is in stationary traffic he can put taco to break.
Seems sensible. Thanks.
And as soon as the driver moves, the tacho switches mode breaking the uninterrupted break the law requires.
I was replying to the post referring to a motorway closure.

Fun Bus

17,911 posts

217 months

Friday 24th November 2017
quotequote all
R0G said:
Fun Bus said:
And as soon as the driver moves, the tacho switches mode breaking the uninterrupted break the law requires.
If stopped in traffic for 1 minute on break then that is still a break of 1 minute even though it will not count as a driving time break
Yep, could have worded that better. I read it that it was thought it contributed to break.