RE: Tygan Speedster

[shipley]

I'm looking forward to buying a Speedster. I've wanted one for 30 years and think it is one of the loveliest cars ever designed.

I hover around the owners club (www.speedsters.com) where you can get a good condition pre-owned car for sub £20k. I don't see the point in buying a new old car !

Here's a good example of one....
http://www.speedsters.com/taylor.htm

I'll replace my existing 'toy' with one soon as its impossible to drive quickly in this country.

Won't be long then !!

Edited by shipley on Tuesday 4th March 15:12

[hairy]

ricola said:

hairy said:

heard of a bloke running an turbo impreza motor in one of these, was described as "frightening"

That was me, along with Porsche running gear, it was also my daily car for 5 years...

think you took my mate Paul out in it a few years ago, he working for gary shovel hands building speedsters in redditch.

cant be many cars like that out there!!!

[Fetchez la vache]

nomis said:

I was told, by Chesil, that the letter of the law had been changed by the DVLA regarding age-related plates (as you called it); in essence, kitcars that utilise a donor car cannot 'inherit' the classic status and therefore it is illegal to use a black plate on one.

Is this incorrect?

That's news to me. as far as I'm aware it's still the Jan 1st 1973 rule, relating to age related plates - i.e. you can if 1st reg date is before, and not if it's after.

My kit car is 1972 with black plates, and I've certainly never been stopped for this, and it's never been questioned when I've been stopped for anything else either

[nervous]

Mon Ami Mate said:

Fittster said:

Is Mon Ami Mate still involved with these?

Yes!

MAM, YHM

[Skyedriver]

Looks the part certainly, and I have always loved the look of the old 356 etc.
The continual James Dean link is a bit tenuous however as it was a 550 that he had his unfortunate accident in not a 356 Speedster

[briSk]

nomis said:

Mon Ami Mate said:

Beetle floot pan" the only part kept from a donor car is the spine, which is shortened and made corrosion resistant. The only reason we use these is that it enables us to use an age-related plate. Absolutely everything else is brand new and purpose-engineered.

I was told, by Chesil, that the letter of the law had been changed by the DVLA regarding age-related plates (as you called it); in essence, kitcars that utilise a donor car cannot 'inherit' the classic status and therefore it is illegal to use a black plate on one.

Is this incorrect?

Also, if you buy a Tygan Speedster, what vehicle details does the V5 show? This is a question I could never get a straight response from Chesil regarding.

TIA

..come on somebody.. this is potentially the most interesting part of the discussion...

will it be tax free and will it (by extension) be allowed to run black 'plates?

[Mon Ami Mate]

briSk said:

nomis said:

Mon Ami Mate said:

Beetle floot pan" the only part kept from a donor car is the spine, which is shortened and made corrosion resistant. The only reason we use these is that it enables us to use an age-related plate. Absolutely everything else is brand new and purpose-engineered.

I was told, by Chesil, that the letter of the law had been changed by the DVLA regarding age-related plates (as you called it); in essence, kitcars that utilise a donor car cannot 'inherit' the classic status and therefore it is illegal to use a black plate on one.

Is this incorrect?

Also, if you buy a Tygan Speedster, what vehicle details does the V5 show? This is a question I could never get a straight response from Chesil regarding.

TIA

..come on somebody.. this is potentially the most interesting part of the discussion...

will it be tax free and will it (by extension) be allowed to run black 'plates?

The chassis number of the donor beetle is printed on the retained part of the spine. The car is registered as a Tygan but can legitmately use an age-related plate (not the plate that comes from the donor Beetle).

[briSk]

Mon Ami Mate said:

The chassis number of the donor beetle is printed on the retained part of the spine. The car is registered as a Tygan but can legitmately use an age-related plate (not the plate that comes from the donor Beetle).

so if it were a 1972 beetle it would become a 1972 Tygan and be tax free and be allowed black plates? (i am not letting you off that easily! ).

[Mon Ami Mate]

briSk said:

Mon Ami Mate said:

The chassis number of the donor beetle is printed on the retained part of the spine. The car is registered as a Tygan but can legitmately use an age-related plate (not the plate that comes from the donor Beetle).

so if it were a 1972 beetle it would become a 1972 Tygan and be tax free and be allowed black plates? (i am not letting you off that easily! ).

It is sadly registered as a new car and tax is payable!

[Mon Ami Mate]

Mon Ami Mate said:

briSk said:

Mon Ami Mate said:

The chassis number of the donor beetle is printed on the retained part of the spine. The car is registered as a Tygan but can legitmately use an age-related plate (not the plate that comes from the donor Beetle).

so if it were a 1972 beetle it would become a 1972 Tygan and be tax free and be allowed black plates? (i am not letting you off that easily! ).

It is sadly registered as a new car and tax is payable!

I've just checked and I'm talking bks. THe V5 will show the age of the donor car, but is a Tygan, not a Volkswagen, so it will be a 1972 Tygan. The Government closed the no-tax loophole last year.

[briSk]

Mon Ami Mate said:

Mon Ami Mate said:

briSk said:

Mon Ami Mate said:

The chassis number of the donor beetle is printed on the retained part of the spine. The car is registered as a Tygan but can legitmately use an age-related plate (not the plate that comes from the donor Beetle).

so if it were a 1972 beetle it would become a 1972 Tygan and be tax free and be allowed black plates? (i am not letting you off that easily! ).

It is sadly registered as a new car and tax is payable!

I've just checked and I'm talking bks. THe V5 will show the age of the donor car, but is a Tygan, not a Volkswagen, so it will be a 1972 Tygan. The Government closed the no-tax loophole last year.

good stuff. that's fair enough. it's just interesting to know.

[nomis]

Mon Ami Mate said:

Mon Ami Mate said:

briSk said:

Mon Ami Mate said:

The chassis number of the donor beetle is printed on the retained part of the spine. The car is registered as a Tygan but can legitmately use an age-related plate (not the plate that comes from the donor Beetle).

so if it were a 1972 beetle it would become a 1972 Tygan and be tax free and be allowed black plates? (i am not letting you off that easily! ).

It is sadly registered as a new car and tax is payable!

I've just checked and I'm talking bks. THe V5 will show the age of the donor car, but is a Tygan, not a Volkswagen, so it will be a 1972 Tygan. The Government closed the no-tax loophole last year.

I assume it will also not be allowed to legally 'wear' a black classic reg plate?

[shoestring7]

356Speedster said:

In the early days, Porsche had no money, so built the 356 with modified a Beetle chassis and a modified Beetle engine.

Hmm, it wasn't quite like that was it? you make it sounds as if they cast around for a car to hot-rod. But of course the Porsche father and son developed the Beetle and always wanted to build a sports version. The nearest they got was the Berlin-Rome racers.

After the war they were able to develop this initial concept, but only the very early Gmund cars were Beetle specials, by the time they had Cisitalia money and moved to Stuttgart very few parts were interchangable.

SS7

[Mon Ami Mate]

nomis said:

Mon Ami Mate said:

Mon Ami Mate said:

briSk said:

Mon Ami Mate said:

The chassis number of the donor beetle is printed on the retained part of the spine. The car is registered as a Tygan but can legitmately use an age-related plate (not the plate that comes from the donor Beetle).

so if it were a 1972 beetle it would become a 1972 Tygan and be tax free and be allowed black plates? (i am not letting you off that easily! ).

It is sadly registered as a new car and tax is payable!

I've just checked and I'm talking bks. THe V5 will show the age of the donor car, but is a Tygan, not a Volkswagen, so it will be a 1972 Tygan. The Government closed the no-tax loophole last year.

I assume it will also not be allowed to legally 'wear' a black classic reg plate?

It can, provided it is pre-1972.

[nomis]

Mon Ami Mate said:

It can, provided it is pre-1972.

Are you sure about this? As I said, one of the stumbling blocks with Chesil was that they stated the law had changed and that when a car was given a new V5 (as you stated the Volkswagen becomes a Tygan), the new 'kit car' status meant the vehicle was not legally able to use the black classic plates. This may be worth looking into as a future consideration.

Edited by nomis on Thursday 6th March 10:44

[odyssey2200]

Took the PoGO for a blast today

Roof down (heater on) sun shining!

[nomis]

Mon Ami Mate said:

the only part kept from a donor car is the spine, which is shortened and made corrosion resistant. The only reason we use these is that it enables us to use an age-related plate. Absolutely everything else is brand new and purpose-engineered.

Actually, if you only use one part and it is modified, it seems you cannot use an age related plate according to the DVLA: -

"Kit Conversions

This is where a kit of new parts is added to an existing vehicle or old parts are added to a kit comprising a manufactured body, chassis or monocoque bodyshell. The general appearance of the vehicle will change and result in a revised description on the registration certificate.

A vehicle will retain its donor registration mark if either the original unmodified chassis or unaltered monocoque bodyshell and two other major components are used. If a new monocoque bodyshell or chassis from a specialist kit manufacturer is used (or an altered chassis or bodyshell from an existing vehicle) together with two major components from a donor vehicle, an age related mark will be assigned. The mark will be based on the age of the donor vehicle. An ESVA, SVA or MSVA test will be required to register the vehicle.

Where there are insufficient parts from a donor vehicle or in cases where the original registration mark is unknown, an ESVA, SVA or MSVA certificate will be required to register the vehicle and a 'Q' prefix registration number will be allocated."

In the case of Kit Cars - they are only allowed to use a current reg: -

"Kit Cars

Where all the parts of a vehicle are supplied new by the manufacturer. Subject to the provision of satisfactory receipts and a certificate of newness these vehicles will be registered under a current registration mark.

Kit cars which have been built using not more than one reconditioned component will also be registered under a current mark. This is subject to the provision of satisfactory evidence that the component has been reconditioned to an "as new" standard. An ESVA, SVA or MSVA test will be required."

All take from the DVLA site - http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/BuyingAndSell...

So it would seem Chesil were correct and you are unable to use a classic plate?

[Miguel]

odyssey2200 said:

Took the PoGO for a blast today

Roof down (heater on) sun shining!

I'd never heard of PGO before, but like you, I also prefer that 356 replicas be mid-engined and contain no VW parts. This is the Yank version, which is well priced:

http://www.specialtyauto.com/PORSCHE.htm

Miguel

[Davi]

Miguel said:

odyssey2200 said:

Took the PoGO for a blast today

Roof down (heater on) sun shining!

I'd never heard of PGO before, but like you, I also prefer that 356 replicas be mid-engined and contain no VW parts. This is the Yank version, which is well priced:

http://www.specialtyauto.com/PORSCHE.htm

Miguel

Strange that you shun a Ferrari that has anything less than Ferrari parts beneath it, yet when a true replica comes along - something that really is very, very close to the original due to the almost identical design of the underpinnings, you then want your replica to have no parts fitted that could be considered replicating the original.

[odyssey2200]

Davi said:

Miguel said:

odyssey2200 said:

Took the PoGO for a blast today

Roof down (heater on) sun shining!

I'd never heard of PGO before, but like you, I also prefer that 356 replicas be mid-engined and contain no VW parts. This is the Yank version, which is well priced:

http://www.specialtyauto.com/PORSCHE.htm

Miguel

Strange that you shun a Ferrari that has anything less than Ferrari parts beneath it, yet when a true replica comes along - something that really is very, very close to the original due to the almost identical design of the underpinnings, you then want your replica to have no parts fitted that could be considered replicating the original.

IMHO I do not like Replias as such.

They are just ..too phoney IYKWIM.

And paying £36000 for a car built from patern engine parts and bits of old beetle is just silly.

The PGO is in the style of the 365 but does not try to be something which it is not too much.

Chesil/Tygan will always have the Kit car stigma and there will be those who will look upon you as the person who could not afford a real one. A if you will.

IMHo the PGO Cevennes is in the style of a 356 but not trying to fool anyone ( like the new Mini and Fiat 500).
It has better mechanicals, New mechanicals, better equipment and is cheaper.

Not having an aircooled VW engine is an advantage as far as I am concerned as I do not want to have a fake anything.