Honda - another disaster ?
Discussion
Sainz needs to move on. Grosjean keeps talking about the Ferrari seat but I can't see him going there. If Ferrari are looking for someone to push Vettel then Sainz would be the obvious choice IMO. He's got no chance of moving into the main team at the moment (although from what I heard on the Sky F1 broadcast earlier his position at the team long term isn't guaranteed) and how long can/will Red bull keep him in the second team? I can't see Kvyat staying next season, he's had his chance and not exactly shone brightly. Gasly is waiting for a seat.
Ocon has really impressed me this season and has been keeping Perez, a veteran really these days very honest. I wasn't so sure about FI taking Ocon over Wehrlein but I'm inclined to say at this point I rate Esteban over Pascal. If Bottas doesn't get an extension I could see Mercedes offering a swap deal for Ocon. And I don't think FI would be able to do a damned thing other than negotiate with Valterri over money.
Ocon has really impressed me this season and has been keeping Perez, a veteran really these days very honest. I wasn't so sure about FI taking Ocon over Wehrlein but I'm inclined to say at this point I rate Esteban over Pascal. If Bottas doesn't get an extension I could see Mercedes offering a swap deal for Ocon. And I don't think FI would be able to do a damned thing other than negotiate with Valterri over money.
Crafty_ said:
Not sure where than image is from, but FP2 only shows Alonso still not fastest, but not too far away
https://twitter.com/hlawiczka/status/8782866696983...
Suggests Vandoorne was either doing something odd or wasn't running flat out.
Vandoorne had the old spec engine.https://twitter.com/hlawiczka/status/8782866696983...
Suggests Vandoorne was either doing something odd or wasn't running flat out.
MissChief said:
Sainz needs to move on. Grosjean keeps talking about the Ferrari seat but I can't see him going there. If Ferrari are looking for someone to push Vettel then Sainz would be the obvious choice IMO. He's got no chance of moving into the main team at the moment (although from what I heard on the Sky F1 broadcast earlier his position at the team long term isn't guaranteed) and how long can/will Red bull keep him in the second team? I can't see Kvyat staying next season, he's had his chance and not exactly shone brightly. Gasly is waiting for a seat.
Surely that gives him a bit more time, since Kvyat is almost certainly the one to go for any replacements? Sainz has done well enough to keep him on a bit more. Moving to Ferrari (even if they offered it, which I am not sure they would yet) would make it tricky to prove himself at the highest level since Vettel would be the priority.NRS said:
MissChief said:
Sainz needs to move on. Grosjean keeps talking about the Ferrari seat but I can't see him going there. If Ferrari are looking for someone to push Vettel then Sainz would be the obvious choice IMO. He's got no chance of moving into the main team at the moment (although from what I heard on the Sky F1 broadcast earlier his position at the team long term isn't guaranteed) and how long can/will Red bull keep him in the second team? I can't see Kvyat staying next season, he's had his chance and not exactly shone brightly. Gasly is waiting for a seat.
Surely that gives him a bit more time, since Kvyat is almost certainly the one to go for any replacements? Sainz has done well enough to keep him on a bit more. Moving to Ferrari (even if they offered it, which I am not sure they would yet) would make it tricky to prove himself at the highest level since Vettel would be the priority.EDLT said:
I haven't read the entire thread so this might have been answered, but why was Eddie Jordan still banging on about McLaren getting Mercedes engines (and the channel 4 team taking his word as gospel) if McLaren and Mercedes have both said it was a load of rubbish?
Because "Eddie" . 
To be fair he has been right on many things before - didn't he break the news of Alonso back to McLaren (with similar denials)
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/formula-1/sebastien-...
etc
They may be "technically right" in that it "will not be a Mercedes engine"... cue a "Maybach Sport" engine...
Lots of things are denied and end up becoming true.
Doink said:
He's also angered Toto today by suggesting Mercedes are pulling out at the end of 2018 along with Petronas and UBS
Yes, angry Toto is back.He also annoyed Bob from Force India too, with his talk of Mercedes sending them a text to pit their car in Canada.
I think EJ should lead the Brexit negotiations
cuprabob said:
Doink said:
He's also angered Toto today by suggesting Mercedes are pulling out at the end of 2018 along with Petronas and UBS
Yes, angry Toto is back.He also annoyed Bob from Force India too, with his talk of Mercedes sending them a text to pit their car in Canada.
I think EJ should lead the Brexit negotiations
It is equally possible that the board has asked to value (not commit, just value) an exit strategy in order to realise the investment.
Mercedes have always been transitory in their involvement, it wouldn't surprise me at all if they dropped to engine supply only.
As far as Eddie goes, he just says lots of stuff and sometimes gets lucky. For example : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IaLKzbGMA4E
Mercedes did some market research last year (IIRC) and that came to the conclusion being involved in F1 was worth $3bn to the brand. They seem happy to accept that sort of figure, regardless of what anyone else thinks.
The brand has moved away from being "old mans cars" and F1 has been part of that move - probably in other countries more than here.
Until they decide they aren't getting that value or that figure decreases I don't think they will go anywhere.
Even if sponsors disappear (which Toto says isn't true anyway) I don't think it'd be too difficult to find others. As it is its thought that the team is almost revenue neutral currently.
There would certainly be no point in quitting the end of next year, this is their era in terms of performance. When regs change in 2020/2021 with the new (as yet undecided) engine format is when they might take a decision to leave. I think a lot will depend on the new/replacement Concorde agreement between teams and FOM - Ferrari stand to lose more of course, so it might even be seen as a positive thing ? who knows.
When/uf they do leave the team will remain - they only own 60% of it, so if they sell their share I could see the team being the defacto factory team (much like McLaren were or Red Bull were to Renault) and still being closely aligned to the brand.
Mercedes did some market research last year (IIRC) and that came to the conclusion being involved in F1 was worth $3bn to the brand. They seem happy to accept that sort of figure, regardless of what anyone else thinks.
The brand has moved away from being "old mans cars" and F1 has been part of that move - probably in other countries more than here.
Until they decide they aren't getting that value or that figure decreases I don't think they will go anywhere.
Even if sponsors disappear (which Toto says isn't true anyway) I don't think it'd be too difficult to find others. As it is its thought that the team is almost revenue neutral currently.
There would certainly be no point in quitting the end of next year, this is their era in terms of performance. When regs change in 2020/2021 with the new (as yet undecided) engine format is when they might take a decision to leave. I think a lot will depend on the new/replacement Concorde agreement between teams and FOM - Ferrari stand to lose more of course, so it might even be seen as a positive thing ? who knows.
When/uf they do leave the team will remain - they only own 60% of it, so if they sell their share I could see the team being the defacto factory team (much like McLaren were or Red Bull were to Renault) and still being closely aligned to the brand.
rubystone said:
MissChief said:
Pardon me. It should have read 'although from what I heard on the Sky F1 broadcast earlier Verstappen's position at the team long term isn't guaranteed'
It's said by some scribes that Max has a performance clause in his contract that currently is in his favour....S0 What said:
rubystone said:
MissChief said:
Pardon me. It should have read 'although from what I heard on the Sky F1 broadcast earlier Verstappen's position at the team long term isn't guaranteed'
It's said by some scribes that Max has a performance clause in his contract that currently is in his favour....MissChief said:
S0 What said:
rubystone said:
MissChief said:
Pardon me. It should have read 'although from what I heard on the Sky F1 broadcast earlier Verstappen's position at the team long term isn't guaranteed'
It's said by some scribes that Max has a performance clause in his contract that currently is in his favour....Gassing Station | Formula 1 | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff