Sebastian Vettel

[glazbagun]

Ricciardo was as good as Verstappen at RB IMO. Maybe even better if you count a cool head collecting points as better than a banzai do-or-die charge. Had some great overtakes under braking.

[LaurasOtherHalf]

RichB said:

LaurasOtherHalf said:

Is Vettel still a tier one driver these days? Has his recent performances really lowered his stock so much? I see the rankings as follows

All tier 1 drivers, capable of winning races and a championship in the right car;
Hamilton
Verstappen
Le Clerc
Riciardo
Vettel

I'm not sure I'd include either Vettel or Ricciardo in the top tier, as likable as they both are.

It’s tricky to get a good grasp on anyone while they aren’t in a championship winning car as the very fact you’re going for a championship changes the way you drive somewhat.

I know it’s ten years ago but put any of the above drivers into the hot seats in 2010 and I expect you’d see a similar championship with them all fighting for the crown at the last race, just like Alonso, Webber, Vettel and Hamilton were.

[Fortitude]

Analysis: Why Ferrari hobbling Vettel in F1 doesn't make any sense
• By Jonathan Noble

His (Sebastian Vettel) comments to German broadcaster RTL were interpreted by some as him suggesting that the two Ferrari cars may not be completely equal.

Vettel was pushed later on the specific issue of whether or not he thought the cars were different, and he was not entirely definitive in ruling the idea out.

Vettel admits his main problem with the current car is that he cannot get the performance he wants from it during qualifying on Saturday. Then, starting so far down the order, his chances of making progress on Sundays are pretty slim.
He says his qualifying woes are triggered simply by him lacking consistency and being unable to 'feel the grip' that Leclerc is able to do.

Here is a look at how far Vettel has been behind or ahead of Leclerc so far this year, having been outqualified 10 time out of the 12 races. The times are taken from the qualifying sessions both completed (so it will be Q1 or Q2 comparisons if one of the drivers was eliminated there).

F1 race Ferrari driver Lap time difference Qualifying positions
Austrian GP Leclerc ahead +0.283s Leclerc 7th, Vettel 11th
Styria GP Vettel ahead -0.083s Leclerc 14th, Vettel 10th
Hungarian GP Vettel ahead -0.043s Leclerc 6th, Vettel 5th
British GP Leclerc ahead +0.912s Leclerc 4th, Vettel 10th
70th Anniversary GP Leclerc ahead +0.369s Leclerc 8th, Vettel 11th
Spanish GP Leclerc ahead +0.215s Leclerc 9th, Vettel 11th
Belgium GP Leclerc ahead +0.265s Leclerc 13th, Vettel 14th
Italian GP Leclerc ahead +0.708s Leclerc 13th, Vettel 17th
Tuscan GP Leclerc ahead +0.534s Leclerc 5th, Vettel 14th
Russian GP Leclerc ahead +0.370s Leclerc 10th, Vettel 14th
Eifel GP Leclerc ahead +0.498s Leclerc 4th, Vettel 11th
Portuguese GP Leclerc ahead +0.552s Leclerc 4th, Vettel 15th

Vettel and Leclerc were very evenly matched at the beginning of the season (apart from Silverstone where Vettel had a specific problem), but as the year has gone on the gap between them has got bigger.

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/153110/analysis-...


Leclerc car developments slowing Vettel says Villeneuve

Jacques Villeneuve thinks all of Ferrari's car development in 2020 has been done to suit Charles Leclerc.

…1997 world champion Villeneuve thinks a better explanation is that Ferrari is simply implementing only car developments that suit Leclerc.

"His driving is very different from that of Leclerc's," the Canadian told Sky Italia. "And it was Leclerc who did all of the development of this car, because Ferrari thinks he is their future.

"So the further he (Leclerc) goes, the less driveable the car is for Vettel. He can't push to the limit.

"With Vettel's car, we are not seeing the limits of the car, we are seeing the limits of Vettel," said Villeneuve.

Another former F1 driver, the DTM legend Bernd Schneider, agrees that Vettel cannot be solely blamed for his current lack of pace relative to Leclerc.

"If a four-time world champion is so far behind like this, it's not just the driver," he told Sport1.

https://www.grandprix.com/news/leclerc-car-develop...

[Schermerhorn]

Fortitude said:

Analysis: Why Ferrari hobbling Vettel in F1 doesn't make any sense
• By Jonathan Noble

His (Sebastian Vettel) comments to German broadcaster RTL were interpreted by some as him suggesting that the two Ferrari cars may not be completely equal.

Vettel was pushed later on the specific issue of whether or not he thought the cars were different, and he was not entirely definitive in ruling the idea out.

Vettel admits his main problem with the current car is that he cannot get the performance he wants from it during qualifying on Saturday. Then, starting so far down the order, his chances of making progress on Sundays are pretty slim.
He says his qualifying woes are triggered simply by him lacking consistency and being unable to 'feel the grip' that Leclerc is able to do.

Here is a look at how far Vettel has been behind or ahead of Leclerc so far this year, having been outqualified 10 time out of the 12 races. The times are taken from the qualifying sessions both completed (so it will be Q1 or Q2 comparisons if one of the drivers was eliminated there).

F1 race Ferrari driver Lap time difference Qualifying positions
Austrian GP Leclerc ahead +0.283s Leclerc 7th, Vettel 11th
Styria GP Vettel ahead -0.083s Leclerc 14th, Vettel 10th
Hungarian GP Vettel ahead -0.043s Leclerc 6th, Vettel 5th
British GP Leclerc ahead +0.912s Leclerc 4th, Vettel 10th
70th Anniversary GP Leclerc ahead +0.369s Leclerc 8th, Vettel 11th
Spanish GP Leclerc ahead +0.215s Leclerc 9th, Vettel 11th
Belgium GP Leclerc ahead +0.265s Leclerc 13th, Vettel 14th
Italian GP Leclerc ahead +0.708s Leclerc 13th, Vettel 17th
Tuscan GP Leclerc ahead +0.534s Leclerc 5th, Vettel 14th
Russian GP Leclerc ahead +0.370s Leclerc 10th, Vettel 14th
Eifel GP Leclerc ahead +0.498s Leclerc 4th, Vettel 11th
Portuguese GP Leclerc ahead +0.552s Leclerc 4th, Vettel 15th

Vettel and Leclerc were very evenly matched at the beginning of the season (apart from Silverstone where Vettel had a specific problem), but as the year has gone on the gap between them has got bigger.

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/153110/analysis-...


Leclerc car developments slowing Vettel says Villeneuve

Jacques Villeneuve thinks all of Ferrari's car development in 2020 has been done to suit Charles Leclerc.

…1997 world champion Villeneuve thinks a better explanation is that Ferrari is simply implementing only car developments that suit Leclerc.

"His driving is very different from that of Leclerc's," the Canadian told Sky Italia. "And it was Leclerc who did all of the development of this car, because Ferrari thinks he is their future.

"So the further he (Leclerc) goes, the less driveable the car is for Vettel. He can't push to the limit.

"With Vettel's car, we are not seeing the limits of the car, we are seeing the limits of Vettel," said Villeneuve.

Another former F1 driver, the DTM legend Bernd Schneider, agrees that Vettel cannot be solely blamed for his current lack of pace relative to Leclerc.

"If a four-time world champion is so far behind like this, it's not just the driver," he told Sport1.

https://www.grandprix.com/news/leclerc-car-develop...

I would rather believe the opinions of former and current racing drivers than journalists.

I just find it hard to believe that Vettel has lost so much speed when he is still in his physical prime. Even an old shot-to-sh*t Schumacher did not have such a deficiency to Rosberg.

[vaud]

Schermerhorn said:

I would rather believe the opinions of former and current racing drivers than journalists.

I agree but Villeneuve is more of a "rent a mouth"

[Derek Smith]

vaud said:

Schermerhorn said:

I would rather believe the opinions of former and current racing drivers than journalists.

I agree but Villeneuve is more of a "rent a mouth"

I would have said that he is no more than a rent-a-mouth.

[Exige77]

vaud said:

Schermerhorn said:

I would rather believe the opinions of former and current racing drivers than journalists.

I agree but Villeneuve is more of a "rent a mouth"

What happened to Seb after the blown diffuser era finished ? Ricciardo was a relative newbie and certainly bettered him.

Maybe Seb just needs a tighter performance envelop to go quick ? If it’s even a little out he’s just not comfortable ? Plus his state of mind which can’t be great after the Ferrari rejection ?

[vaud]

Exige77 said:

What happened to Seb after the blown diffuser era finished ? Ricciardo was a relative newbie and certainly bettered him.

Maybe Seb just needs a tighter performance envelop to go quick ? If it’s even a little out he’s just not comfortable ? Plus his state of mind which can’t be great after the Ferrari rejection ?

I don't know.

I just feel that Villeneuve has been known to provoke with his comments - for what?

Not sure I have a great deal of time for a former WDC who has even been banned from his former teams motorhome...

[Fundoreen]

We may see a resurgence of the vettel of old with the new 2022 formula as they will find it easier to stick the car down to his liking.

[Steamer]

Fundoreen said:

We may see a resurgence of the vettel of old with the new 2022 formula as they will find it easier to stick the car down to his liking.

I had heard that - the 2022 cars could really suit Vettel's style.. expensive gamble though? (although what isn't in F1?!)

[Deesee]

2022 is due to be ground led aero (purely to clean the air of the cars that follow), the engine regs are fixed until 2025 so he will have the the Merc engine too.

I would not write him off for next year (21) the RP will have the Merc rear suspension for 21, Hulk, Stroll & checo have put the car on the 2nd row this year, the 21 aero changes are more likely to cramp the high downforce led Merc and Red Bull, I’m expecting to see RP and Ferrari (low drag) climb forwards next yr, and perhaps Merc & Red Bull to remain static with the 10% loss of downforce.

[Durzel]

Didn't RB say they'd quit if there wasn't engine development allowed, were they to buy the Honda powerplant? Or was that one of those "quit" in quotes things, as per Ferrari?

[HustleRussell]

Durzel said:

Didn't RB say they'd quit if there wasn't engine development allowed, were they to buy the Honda powerplant? Or was that one of those "quit" in quotes things, as per Ferrari?

They’re saying they’ll quit if there is engine development allowed. They want them frozen until the next big engine regs change. 2025 or 2026, I forget.

[carl_w]

HustleRussell said:

They’re saying they’ll quit if there is engine development allowed. They want them frozen until the next big engine regs change. 2025 or 2026, I forget.

Yes, because without the support of Honda and the other engine manufacturers developing their engines, the RB engine will fall behind rapidly. As happened with the BMW/Megatron engine and the Renault/Supertec/Mechachrome engine.

[Munter]

Derek Smith said:

vaud said:

Schermerhorn said:

I would rather believe the opinions of former and current racing drivers than journalists.

I agree but Villeneuve is more of a "rent a mouth"

I would have said that he is no more than a rent-a-mouth.

Guys...I don't think the noise is coming from his mouth.

[Steamer]

carl_w said:

HustleRussell said:

They’re saying they’ll quit if there is engine development allowed. They want them frozen until the next big engine regs change. 2025 or 2026, I forget.

Yes, because without the support of Honda and the other engine manufacturers developing their engines, the RB engine will fall behind rapidly. As happened with the BMW/Megatron engine and the Renault/Supertec/Mechachrome engine.

This just sounds like madness to me..

...However I did wonder if Andy Cowell has had to start screening his phone calls recently?

[faa77]

Oilchange said:

I get the impression he’s a bit of an old racist. Am I reading this right?

Yeah because he disagrees with your opinion, must be racist.

[CraigyMc]

Oilchange said:

I get the impression he’s a bit of an old racist. Am I reading this right?

No, you're reading the daily fail and it's messing with your head.

[Oilchange]

Ok, I'm reading it wrong. No need to be 'funny'

[MB140]

Just watching the Imola practice (recorded), currently Vettel is 2.4 seconds a lap slower than CLC and Vettel has had times deleted (so must be pushing the limits)

Unless it’s different fuel loads I just can’t help but think Ferrari are hindering Vettel in some way. Either through slowing Vettel car (don’t believe that) or just not giving him the same upgrades as CLC.

Vettel just doesn’t go from racing wheel to wheel with CLC last season to 2.4 seconds behind him this season.

Something funny is going on.