Max Verstappen
Discussion
Exige77 said:
It’s only his Moaning on the radio that let him down.
Blah blah blah but we’ll discuss after the race.
Other than that pretty good.
Sadly, the better he drives the more we're going to hear his radio - and all drivers spend their time complaining about something or other...Blah blah blah but we’ll discuss after the race.
Other than that pretty good.
In leclerc's defense specifically, he often does have a reason to moan, when his team have either let him down or thrown him under a bus in vettels favour... I'm actually quite glad that on such occasions he makes his dissatisfaction heard. In fact one of his achievements in 2019 has perhaps been his standing up to the Ferrari team - too stubborn for Ferrari to be happy about, yet too fast for them to sack.
Anyway, back to Max.. also moaned a lot and becomes increasingly diva-ish. Endlessly petulant and I think will forever be somewhat hot headed - yet he's gone and beaten both Ferrari drivers in a car that many would say isn't as good. Personally I think the red bull is now as good and that next season, we should hopefully see a lot of red bull Vs Ferrari and at least some of that battling should be Max Vs leclerc
TheDeuce said:
Exige77 said:
It’s only his Moaning on the radio that let him down.
Blah blah blah but we’ll discuss after the race.
Other than that pretty good.
Sadly, the better he drives the more we're going to hear his radio - and all drivers spend their time complaining about something or other...Blah blah blah but we’ll discuss after the race.
Other than that pretty good.
It’s irritating that he complains but then says “we’ll discuss after the race”.
Exige77 said:
TheDeuce said:
Exige77 said:
It’s only his Moaning on the radio that let him down.
Blah blah blah but we’ll discuss after the race.
Other than that pretty good.
Sadly, the better he drives the more we're going to hear his radio - and all drivers spend their time complaining about something or other...Blah blah blah but we’ll discuss after the race.
Other than that pretty good.
It’s irritating that he complains but then says “we’ll discuss after the race”.
But yes, it is annoying for us.
Most annoying this year was Lewis spending the last 40 odd laps of Monaco complaining twice each lap that his tyres were toast. They broadcast every such whinge until he won the race anyway!
Verstappen's been spouting b
ks as usual saying that 60% of the drivers on the grid would have been WDC if they had been in the Mercedes car:
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/verstappen-ferr...
So which 12 drivers do you think are better than Bottas?
Hamilton
Vettel
Leclerc
Verstappen
Ricciardo
?
ks as usual saying that 60% of the drivers on the grid would have been WDC if they had been in the Mercedes car:https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/verstappen-ferr...
So which 12 drivers do you think are better than Bottas?
Hamilton
Vettel
Leclerc
Verstappen
Ricciardo
?
Mr Pointy said:
Verstappen's been spouting bks as usual saying that 60% of the drivers on the grid would have been WDC if they had been in the Mercedes car:
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/verstappen-ferr...
So which 12 drivers do you think are better than Bottas?
Hamilton
Vettel
Leclerc
Verstappen
Ricciardo
?
What is highlighting as well is that he is not comfortable with the challenge of an equal team mate or equal opportunity in his team... ks as usual saying that 60% of the drivers on the grid would have been WDC if they had been in the Mercedes car:https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/verstappen-ferr...
So which 12 drivers do you think are better than Bottas?
Hamilton
Vettel
Leclerc
Verstappen
Ricciardo
?
Mr Pointy said:
Verstappen's been spouting bks as usual saying that 60% of the drivers on the grid would have been WDC if they had been in the Mercedes car:
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/verstappen-ferr...
So which 12 drivers do you think are better than Bottas?
Hamilton
Vettel
Leclerc
Verstappen
Ricciardo
?
He meant if Hamilton wasn't in the Mercedes, 60% of the field could become WDC if they were in the car, so that could include Bottas as well.ks as usual saying that 60% of the drivers on the grid would have been WDC if they had been in the Mercedes car:https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/verstappen-ferr...
So which 12 drivers do you think are better than Bottas?
Hamilton
Vettel
Leclerc
Verstappen
Ricciardo
?
That's the only thing he said in that regard. He didn't say they would all beat or have to beat Bottas
DeltonaS said:
He meant if Hamilton wasn't in the Mercedes, 60% of the field could become WDC if they were in the car, so that could include Bottas as well.
That's the only thing he said in that regard. He didn't say they would all beat or have to beat Bottas
Well the link I posted doesn't quote him as saying that. He is quoted as saying:That's the only thing he said in that regard. He didn't say they would all beat or have to beat Bottas
"That's because it's purely down to the car. Sixty percent of the grid, if they are in a Mercedes, they also would become world champion".
Well Bottas was in a Mercedes & he didn't become WDC so clearly he isn't in the 60%.
Mr Pointy said:
DeltonaS said:
He meant if Hamilton wasn't in the Mercedes, 60% of the field could become WDC if they were in the car, so that could include Bottas as well.
That's the only thing he said in that regard. He didn't say they would all beat or have to beat Bottas
Well the link I posted doesn't quote him as saying that. He is quoted as saying:That's the only thing he said in that regard. He didn't say they would all beat or have to beat Bottas
"That's because it's purely down to the car. Sixty percent of the grid, if they are in a Mercedes, they also would become world champion".
Well Bottas was in a Mercedes & he didn't become WDC so clearly he isn't in the 60%.
Although this season it has been tighter at the top and I wouldn't be confident enough myself in that prediction to make it publicly. A superior driver in the Ferrari or Red Bull could have displaced a couple of top 60% drivers in the Mercedes, that definitely could have happened.
Just one of those things he says that leaves me questioning mostly why he said it at all, regardless of whether or not it's right/wrong. And what exactly IS he saying!? That his own teams efforts are in the end pointless because they will never beat the Mercedes? Or perhaps he's letting them know he's better than the car they have given him...? Whatever, sometimes best to keep it zipped
TheDeuce said:
Mr Pointy said:
DeltonaS said:
He meant if Hamilton wasn't in the Mercedes, 60% of the field could become WDC if they were in the car, so that could include Bottas as well.
That's the only thing he said in that regard. He didn't say they would all beat or have to beat Bottas
Well the link I posted doesn't quote him as saying that. He is quoted as saying:That's the only thing he said in that regard. He didn't say they would all beat or have to beat Bottas
"That's because it's purely down to the car. Sixty percent of the grid, if they are in a Mercedes, they also would become world champion".
Well Bottas was in a Mercedes & he didn't become WDC so clearly he isn't in the 60%.
Although this season it has been tighter at the top and I wouldn't be confident enough myself in that prediction to make it publicly. A superior driver in the Ferrari or Red Bull could have displaced a couple of top 60% drivers in the Mercedes, that definitely could have happened.
Just one of those things he says that leaves me questioning mostly why he said it at all, regardless of whether or not it's right/wrong. And what exactly IS he saying!? That his own teams efforts are in the end pointless because they will never beat the Mercedes? Or perhaps he's letting them know he's better than the car they have given him...? Whatever, sometimes best to keep it zipped
DeltonaS said:
That's the point isn't it: lack of balance.
The actual freak is the F1 championship itself.
Because since the hybrid engine formula, for 6 years in a row now, the title fight is between the drivers of just 1 team: Mercedes.
In all these years Mercedes dominance has never been challenged. This season alone 15 of the 20 GP's went to Mercedes.
And in all these years Hamilton had to fight two lesser drivers, Rosberg and Bottas. Good drivers, but they lack the skill of others like Alonso, Vettel, Ricciardo, Verstappen, Leclerc.etc.
And let's look at Hamilton WDC standings in the years in between his WDC's when Vettel was the second comming:
2013: 4th
2012: 4th
2011: 5th
2010: 4th
2009: 5th
And all these years in a Mercedes, Hamilton is just very lucky he started and stayed in a team which made the upmost of what became the hybrid engine formula.
Hamilton's McLaren was possibly the 3rd best car on the grid from 2009The actual freak is the F1 championship itself.
Because since the hybrid engine formula, for 6 years in a row now, the title fight is between the drivers of just 1 team: Mercedes.
In all these years Mercedes dominance has never been challenged. This season alone 15 of the 20 GP's went to Mercedes.
And in all these years Hamilton had to fight two lesser drivers, Rosberg and Bottas. Good drivers, but they lack the skill of others like Alonso, Vettel, Ricciardo, Verstappen, Leclerc.etc.
And let's look at Hamilton WDC standings in the years in between his WDC's when Vettel was the second comming:
2013: 4th
2012: 4th
2011: 5th
2010: 4th
2009: 5th
And all these years in a Mercedes, Hamilton is just very lucky he started and stayed in a team which made the upmost of what became the hybrid engine formula.
Mr Pointy said:
TheDeuce said:
Mr Pointy said:
DeltonaS said:
He meant if Hamilton wasn't in the Mercedes, 60% of the field could become WDC if they were in the car, so that could include Bottas as well.
That's the only thing he said in that regard. He didn't say they would all beat or have to beat Bottas
Well the link I posted doesn't quote him as saying that. He is quoted as saying:That's the only thing he said in that regard. He didn't say they would all beat or have to beat Bottas
"That's because it's purely down to the car. Sixty percent of the grid, if they are in a Mercedes, they also would become world champion".
Well Bottas was in a Mercedes & he didn't become WDC so clearly he isn't in the 60%.
Although this season it has been tighter at the top and I wouldn't be confident enough myself in that prediction to make it publicly. A superior driver in the Ferrari or Red Bull could have displaced a couple of top 60% drivers in the Mercedes, that definitely could have happened.
Just one of those things he says that leaves me questioning mostly why he said it at all, regardless of whether or not it's right/wrong. And what exactly IS he saying!? That his own teams efforts are in the end pointless because they will never beat the Mercedes? Or perhaps he's letting them know he's better than the car they have given him...? Whatever, sometimes best to keep it zipped
I think it's clear what he means though. 60% of the drivers on the grid, in the Mercedes, would be able to beat anyone else in any of the other cars to the world championship. He's not thinking about whomever might be in the other Merc, but if you always put the slowest driver on the grid (sorry Robert, full respect from me for making it back, giving it a go and scoring a point!) in the second Merc, then it's possible mathematically at least. I say that with some irony that Kubica outpointed his far better rated, and quicker, team mate this year
I don't agree with his statement though. Unless Bottas isn't in the 60%, he's only managed to beat the other cars 1 out of 3 times, so I don't think 60% could do it, but I do agree with the sentiment that, by and large, the best car always wins the world championship and a great driver can get some great race wins out of a car that is clearly not the best in the field, but no driver is good enough to make up a visible shortfall in the car for a full season. Yet I've always maintained it's a team sport and it's impossible to work out exactly how much of a driver / car combination's success is down to the driver, and how much is the car, but it seems very widely accepted that it's mostly the car.
i.e. If Hamilton and Verstappen had swapped drives in 2019, what would have happened? Would Hamilton have kept his consistency and done better in the Red Bull, and would Verstappen's lack of consistency put him under more pressure from Bottas? Or would Verstappen be more consistent in the Merc because the car allows it? Would Hamilton have managed to win any races in the Red Bull? Would the car even suit him?
It's nice to think about but we'll really never know.
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