Has the FIA forgotten what F1 is really about?

[anonymous-user]

sgtBerbatov said:

jsf said:

We used to have one engine per session in the 80's and 90's. Those engines were cheap by modern standards.

So was a bottle of Coke.

Coke cost more in real terms in the 80's and 90's than it does now.

[Vaud]

jsf said:

we need to move away from the current spec and make the engines cheap to design and prototype, if we don't, we will never see new companies get involved. Its far too expensive to develop these engines, building the engine is the cheap bit. If you only have to make it last one event, its much cheaper to bring to market and make reliable.

It has to go hand in hand with sensible technical rules that are targeted towards low cost for performance, no one watching the sport really cares whats under the bodywork, you cant see it and in the current restricted access to IP you never will. As the years go by the link to road cars is going to break more, not get closer.

Oh I agree!

[Jonesy23]

One comment on this, ignoring the distraction of the engines.

The people running Formula One know what they think it's all about, and their strategy matches this.

They are much more interested in what it all means to the 'beautiful people' and how it works as part of a luxury goods type setup than anything to do with racing or related aspects, or the even the wider 'show'.

And I am utterly serious about that, heard first hand from the individual responsible for the whole mess. I think they're insane.

[Fonz]

At the end of the day Liberty own F1. If you as the consumer don’t like the product then move on and watch someone else’s show. When they start to lose money they will take notice and change their business plan or sell up. Sad but there we go.

[amgmcqueen]

They should have just stuck with the V8's.

They were cheap, reliable, powerful, sounded great and were very economical for their size.

[TerzoNeil]

if everyone takes an exact engine penalty at every race they cant demote the whole grid 25 places

push as hard as you like for the race, new engine at next race and same again

we want the cars to go fast as poosible and pushed as hars as anything like every lap a qualifying lap

bring back refuelling, splash and dash

[Vaud]

TerzoNeil said:

if everyone takes an exact engine penalty at every race they cant demote the whole grid 25 places

push as hard as you like for the race, new engine at next race and same again

we want the cars to go fast as poosible and pushed as hars as anything like every lap a qualifying lap

bring back refuelling, splash and dash

We tried that. It ended up in an engine war and people pulling out.

[anonymous-user]

The FIA will never change.

They are a complete waste of time and will only continue to mess up.

Shame DORNA who are in charge of Moto GP were not in control of F1.

[anonymous-user]

Another issue with the FIA.

Remember this

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula...

The big players do not want a level playing field as money talks.

I am sure even today Mercedes, Ferrari and Red Bull would all threaten to quit if a limit was imposed.

As we know the FIA they went back on their word to keep Ferrari happy.

This in turn cost three teams their stay in F1.

[MitchT]

Fonz said:

At the end of the day Liberty own F1. If you as the consumer don’t like the product then move on and watch someone else’s show. When they start to lose money they will take notice and change their business plan or sell up. Sad but there we go.

I suspect after 2018 when live F1 completely disappears behind the paywall it'll be well and truly on the slippery slope.

Engine wise, the obvious thing to me would be to make them much simpler. This would achieve two things ... 1: simpler engines are cheaper to produce so using more of them isn't as much of an issue. 2: Simpler engines are more reliable so you might not actually need that many.

Make them larger so the power can come from displacement rather than sophistication as is currently the case. Cheaper. More reliable.

[rubystone]

ELUSIVEJIM said:

The FIA will never change.

They are a complete waste of time and will only continue to mess up.

Shame DORNA who are in charge of Moto GP were not in control of F1.

If DORNA were in charge, it’d cost teams a fortune in aero...when is a wing not a wing?...

[paulguitar]

TerzoNeil said:

if everyone takes an exact engine penalty at every race they cant demote the whole grid 25 places

push as hard as you like for the race, new engine at next race and same again

we want the cars to go fast as poosible and pushed as hars as anything like every lap a qualifying lap

bring back refuelling, splash and dash

I agree aside from refueling. That was a disaster for F1, and resulted in almost no overtaking. Everyone just waited for pitstops instead which was unbearable.

[Vaud]

MitchT said:

I suspect after 2018 when live F1 completely disappears behind the paywall it'll be well and truly on the slippery slope.

Only in the UK, in fact in many countries Liberty are planning a streaming service.

[London424]

paulguitar said:

TerzoNeil said:

if everyone takes an exact engine penalty at every race they cant demote the whole grid 25 places

push as hard as you like for the race, new engine at next race and same again

we want the cars to go fast as poosible and pushed as hars as anything like every lap a qualifying lap

bring back refuelling, splash and dash

I agree aside from refueling. That was a disaster for F1, and resulted in almost no overtaking. Everyone just waited for pitstops instead which was unbearable.

This is why F1 has such a problem. You ask 10 people what direction they want to go in and they get 11 different answers.

They're damned if they do, damned if they don't.

[Bo_apex]

Doink said:

But why do the FIA have a say in what the engine should be, correct me if I'm wrong but aren't they just there to police the rules whatever they may be?

^^This ^^

Liberty could decide to switch to exciting V10's, which would also be lower cost.

Current problem F1 has:

FIA = France
F1 Technology = UK (except Ferrari of course)

Liberty could establish it's own Governing Body.

[MitchT]

Vaud said:

Only in the UK, in fact in many countries Liberty are planning a streaming service.

At what cost in addition to whatever people are already paying for their TV services?

[amgmcqueen]

London424 said:

paulguitar said:

TerzoNeil said:

if everyone takes an exact engine penalty at every race they cant demote the whole grid 25 places

push as hard as you like for the race, new engine at next race and same again

we want the cars to go fast as poosible and pushed as hars as anything like every lap a qualifying lap

bring back refuelling, splash and dash

I agree aside from refueling. That was a disaster for F1, and resulted in almost no overtaking. Everyone just waited for pitstops instead which was unbearable.

This is why F1 has such a problem. You ask 10 people what direction they want to go in and they get 11 different answers.

They're damned if they do, damned if they don't.

They asked hundreds of thousands of people a few years ago with the biggest fan survey ever. The results showed which direction the fans wanted the sport to take. Unfortunately they were not the right results and were subsequently ignored!

[StevieBee]

iandc said:

We already have drivers managing their tyres and engines leading to "managed" races rather than balls out start to finish racing.

This has always been the case. It was probably more so in the past as the ability to change tyres quickly did not exist and the fragility of engines was far greater. The only difference is that to day, it’s far more obvious.

Doink said:

But why do the FIA have a say in what the engine should be, correct me if I'm wrong but aren't they just there to police the rules whatever they may be?

Yep – that’s correct. It’s F1 itself that sets the rules. The FIA give their authority to implement those rules, which is driven by their ability to properly police them.

In practice, it’s a two way street. The FIA is a member’s institution and – in a round about way – represent the interests of the motor industry and get lobbied by them to exert influence on championships so those championships align with their corporate direction.

jsf said:

We need a much cheaper architecture than the current V6 hybrid if we are ever going to see new manufacturers involved.

Well, it seems Aston Martin and Porsche are looking seriously at getting stuck in.

Personally, I think (part of) the solution could be drawn from standardising engines across different series. They did this with the DFV, variants of which popped up in sports cars, F3000 and others. Porsche won LeMans this year using an engine every bit, if not more complex than those used in F1. Taking this approach would enable costs to be spread over a wider array of applications.

This would also open the door for independent engine makers as they would be able secure sales beyond a single team in a single championship.

Soul Reaver said:

I honestly get more enjoyment watching Ginnetta Juniors so what does that say for the pinnacle of motrosport!

All it says is that you prefer GJ to F1. And that’s the benefit of being a race fan. There’s no end of options to pursue if one’s not to your liking.

But globally, I somewhat suspect that a World Ginnetta Junior Championship would not gather much interest.


The problems exist with F1, not the FIA. Mosley proposed cost caps which had the teams not kicked into the long grass at the time, would probably mean that we would not have the hybrid engines today, and more teams on the grid. And more competition at the front.

[Vaud]

MitchT said:

At what cost in addition to whatever people are already paying for their TV services?

Don't know.

I'd buy it, but then I don't have Sky.

[ghost83]

I like the current engines tbh all they need do is remove the silly fuel limits and raise the rev limit abit

I'd also prefer drs to be used whenever the driver wanted

It's mainly aero that needs changing Kimi said the other day he could catch bottas but not get close enough to follow and overtake

Also 6 engines per season imo