The Official Australian Grand Prix Thread ***SPOILERS***

[AndStilliRise]

Vettal. Key season for him, clearly has not done a Schumi by saving Ferrari as of yet.

[angrymoby]

I reckon the Merc's have 0.3-4s over the Ferrari's, so will walk it with a 1-2 both in Quali & Race

Key to season will be if Ferrari bounce back at the following race in Bahrain ...if Merc walk that, then it's game over

[anonymous-user]

I am just hoping the "upgrade" Red Bull are supposed to be bringing to OZ will give them the upper hand.

Problem is there will be updates by everyone.

Having Ricciardo and Verstappen in the mix will give Mercedes and Ferrari big headaches.

Well here's hoping.

[Dr Z]

An interesting development before this weekend's racing.

• The FIA have been monitoring oil use by the cars last year and have found that while Renault and Honda engines consumed ~0.1L/100km, the Merc and Ferrari engines appeared to consume exactly the number specified by the rules, i.e. 1.2L/100km when that was in force and in the latter part of the season, 0.9L/100km, raising suspicions.
• The oil consumption limit this year is 0.6L/100km, however this cannot be policed during a qualifying session due to the error rate of the sensor used.
• The FIA are to weigh the oil tanks of all cars before and after qualifying this weekend to more accurately measure oil use for qualifying.
• The spec of oil that can be used has been specified more clearly for this year, with only one (approved) spec that can be used for a particular GP weekend.

Source: AMuS/F1 Technical Regulations


Could mix things up! Renault/Honda engined teams will be licking their lips.

[Fire99]

Dr Z said:

Could mix things up! Renault/Honda engined teams will be licking their lips.

I see it a different way.. I tip my hat to Mercedes and Ferrari coming up with the 'oil burn' to boost power.. I'd rather see the other teams match them rather than the FIA squeeze them..

Likely a McLaren win so long as Hamilton doesn't do something odd at the start or is plagued with bizarre unreliability..

On a side note, the tyres are starting to sound like fabric conditioner.. super soft, ultra soft.. What's next? Luxuary soft? Arctic fresh soft?

[Gad-Westy]

Fire99 said:

I see it a different way.. I tip my hat to Mercedes and Ferrari coming up with the 'oil burn' to boost power.. I'd rather see the other teams match them rather than the FIA squeeze them..

Likely a McLaren win so long as Hamilton doesn't do something odd at the start or is plagued with bizarre unreliability..

On a side note, the tyres are starting to sound like fabric conditioner.. super soft, ultra soft.. What's next? Luxuary soft? Arctic fresh soft?

Ever an optimist

[Zoobeef]

I take it this is engine oil. If they are talking such small quantities how will there be eacatly the same amount left sat in the engine and not in the tank in each test. How will they confirm this?

[Fire99]

Gad-Westy said:

Ever an optimist

Haha.. Doh!! I think I meant Mercedes.. I'd just been watching an old video of Hamilton and Alonso at McLaren and clearly my head jumped into a DeLorean and toddled back to join them.

[M3ax]

I think red bull will be in the mix this year. I’m not sure merc will run away with it. Danny Ric has a point to prove.

[Oldwolf]

FIA Said:
The oil consumption limit this year is 0.6L/100km, however this cannot be policed during a qualifying session due to the error rate of the sensor used.

That made me laugh out loud.
I really don't envy the FIA, they have to police things but don't have a fraction of the resources the teams have.

[shirt]

Surely they dont need the resources. The FIA has the power and the remit to ask teams to drain the engine of all fluids under supervision if they so wished. Their job is also made much easier by teams grassing each other up.

[ISO51200]

I'm worried that Red Bull and Ferrari will spend all season stealing points from one another that Mercedes romp away for the WCC

[Oldwolf]

shirt said:

Surely they dont need the resources. The FIA has the power and the remit to ask teams to drain the engine of all fluids under supervision if they so wished. Their job is also made much easier by teams grassing each other up.

I disagree about them not needing resources, they mandate a rule but how do they enforce it?
In my example I am sure the teams know to the ml how much oil they're using and if they are asked to fill and empty the engine in front of FIA officials what's to stop them having secret fluid containers as has happened before? There are ways around this example as there will be most examples we give but the FIA have to deal with them all - thus my comment about resources.

I do agree about the teams making the FIA job easier by grassing, sorry, 'policing' the other teams

[rdjohn]

ISO51200 said:

I'm worried that Red Bull and Ferrari will spend all season stealing points from one another that Mercedes romp away for the WCC

I think this is about right. Occasionally, I think that McLaren and Renault might also be nipping at Red Bull’s, or Ferrari’s heels.

However, I do feel positive that there will be more “exciting” races this year.

[angrymoby]

Dr Z said:

An interesting development before this weekend's racing.
Could mix things up! Renault/Honda engined teams will be licking their lips.

i doubt it, neither have mastered burning fuel yet, let alone oil

[shirt]

Oldwolf said:

shirt said:

Surely they dont need the resources. The FIA has the power and the remit to ask teams to drain the engine of all fluids under supervision if they so wished. Their job is also made much easier by teams grassing each other up.

I disagree about them not needing resources, they mandate a rule but how do they enforce it?
In my example I am sure the teams know to the ml how much oil they're using and if they are asked to fill and empty the engine in front of FIA officials what's to stop them having secret fluid containers as has happened before? There are ways around this example as there will be most examples we give but the FIA have to deal with them all - thus my comment about resources.

I do agree about the teams making the FIA job easier by grassing, sorry, 'policing' the other teams

Most rules are enforced my measuring something. If they claim they can’t or are worried there are other volumes of liquid stored then its merely a case of how far they wanted to go. The FIA has the power, if they chose to use it, to completely dismantle the car. Or rather, drink tea and tap their clipboards as the team mechanics do it.

[Hungrymc]

Why is everyone convinced Merc will walk this year?

What we saw last year was a Ferrari that was generally fast and consistent. We saw a Mercedes that was sometimes very fast but could be hard / impossible to set up. For large parts of the year the Ferrari looked a very good race car. I don't think we have seen any evidence yet to determine if Merc have solved their problems other than what they claim. If they have, then I'd say they have a good advantage this year but it if they haven't I don't think Ferrari will be far behind at all (and Red Bull off course will be strong at some rounds).

There is also the change in the tyres, but Merc were certainly hard on tyres and found it hard to switch some on (odd combination) - will the changes help Merc or give Ferrari more options to be able to nail race pace?

I'm really looking forward to this weekend !

[stevesingo]

Dr Z said:

An interesting development before this weekend's racing.

• The FIA have been monitoring oil use by the cars last year and have found that while Renault and Honda engines consumed ~0.1L/100km, the Merc and Ferrari engines appeared to consume exactly the number specified by the rules, i.e. 1.2L/100km when that was in force and in the latter part of the season, 0.9L/100km, raising suspicions.
• The oil consumption limit this year is 0.6L/100km, however this cannot be policed during a qualifying session due to the error rate of the sensor used.
• The FIA are to weigh the oil tanks of all cars before and after qualifying this weekend to more accurately measure oil use for qualifying.
• The spec of oil that can be used has been specified more clearly for this year, with only one (approved) spec that can be used for a particular GP weekend.

Source: AMuS/F1 Technical Regulations


Could mix things up! Renault/Honda engined teams will be licking their lips.

The quantities burnt are interesting. 1.2l/100km is equivalent to 3.6l per 300km race, or about 3kg. If all of this is combustible then it is 3% increase in fuel.

The problem the FiA has is they are measuring quantity in a tank and not flow in a line, Measuring the oil tank level periodically will give a rate of burn and the longer the time period the more accurate the measurement.

Over one lap, one could expect the engine to burn slightly more than (due to no fuel saving) 100kg/race laps amount of fuel, so 100/58=1.82kg or probably closer to 2kg. The amount of oil consumed would be 0.6/100*lap length, in the case of Aus, (5.303km), 0.031lt, or just over a shot glass full, or about 25grams. Good luck with that.

I guess in times gone by the FiA could have taken the total mileage in qualifying and done the math on oil consumption averaged through qualifying. Thing is a team could use zero oil on in/out laps and banked that allowance against the flyers, allowing the teams to use 3x the oil based on in/flyer/out.

[Dr Z]

stevesingo said:

The problem the FiA has is they are measuring quantity in a tank and not flow in a line, Measuring the oil tank level periodically will give a rate of burn and the longer the time period the more accurate the measurement.

Over one lap, one could expect the engine to burn slightly more than (due to no fuel saving) 100kg/race laps amount of fuel, so 100/58=1.82kg or probably closer to 2kg. The amount of oil consumed would be 0.6/100*lap length, in the case of Aus, (5.303km), 0.031lt, or just over a shot glass full, or about 25grams. Good luck with that.

Yeah, I'm not sure how they're going to measure such a small amount to prove infringement either, even if for qualifying they ended up running at twice or thrice the limit, that still comes in at less than 100g.

RBR seem sure that this is the big advantage Merc/Ferrari cars have against them during qualifying.

A curious sentence in the Tech Regs:

F1 Technical Regulations Article 20.7.4 said:

Engine oil samples taken during an Event will be checked for conformity by using a fourier transform infrared (FTIR) technique, which will compare the sample taken with that submitted at the start of the event. Samples which differ from the reference engine oil in a manner consistent with fuel dilution, engine fluids contamination and oil ageing as a result of normal engine operation, will be considered to conform. Samples which differ from the reference engine oil in a manner consistent with the mixing with other engine oils, which have been approved by the FIA for use by the team, will be deemed to comply, provided that the adulterant oils are in total present at no more than 10% in the sample. However, the FIA retains the right to subject the oil sample to further testing at an FIA approved laboratory.

[my emphasis]

Weird when teams are only allowed to use one approved spec of oil at a given GP weekend, which must be declared prior to the event. But this oil could be contaminated with another oil spec up to 10%.

Edited by Dr Z on Wednesday 21st March 14:52

[anonymous-user]

AndStilliRise said:

Vettal. Key season for him, clearly has not done a Schumi by saving Ferrari as of yet.

Schumacher went to Ferrari and dragged a dog of a car up the front whilst the dream team set about building a good car and team. Vettel hasn't got that in him and wont achieve anything compared to what Michael did. He isn't good enough in a car that isn't dominant.