Mclaren

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rdjohn

3,009 posts

131 months

Sunday 11th November
quotequote all
But how often does a one-month team win the event? We are trying to complete FA’s CV here - no more.

How often does a winning car not come from a Penske, Andretti, or Ganassi? An experienced team and management has got to be better than a Rookie F1 outfit, finding their feet.

Honda teams seem to win twice as often as Chevrolet.

It may not be expensive in comparison, but it will be a drain on resources. If Coca-Cola were funding a full season’s racing for Fernando and dedicated team, then I would be inclined to view this slightly differently.

carl_w

6,170 posts

194 months

Sunday 11th November
quotequote all
FFS, Red Bull at the front and McLaren dead last with the same engine

Kinkell

454 posts

123 months

Sunday 11th November
quotequote all
Sorry to say they are ste. Poor management in that they lack a supremo of substance. Williams and the Macs at the back of grid ffs. I'm old enough to remember Williams in the 70's at the back of the grid and their climb to the top was due to the tough guy Frank at the top. Good people supporting him as a true leader brought on the funding and engineering to win.
At the moment they are directionless and director less. In my young days I did not appreciate the worth of guys like Frank and Ron in motor racing but I was naive and erm...young.

Frimley111R

9,132 posts

170 months

Sunday 11th November
quotequote all
Indeed but also the 'game' is not the same. Massive budgets and manufacturers etc. It's a different world as it is in all motor racing these days.

It's not enough to have a good leader. You need masses of money, huge sponsors, hundreds of people, etc.

It's sad to see McLaren and Williams at the back and I hope it isn't too long before they can become at least mid tier teams but I am not hopeful.That said, both seem to have acknowledged that their cars have fundamental issues which wrecked their seasons.

rev-erend

19,915 posts

220 months

Monday 12th November
quotequote all
carl_w said:
FFS, Red Bull at the front and McLaren dead last with the same engine
And Renault works team are somewhere in the middle.
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turbomoped

461 posts

19 months

Monday 12th November
quotequote all
rev-erend said:
carl_w said:
FFS, Red Bull at the front and McLaren dead last with the same engine
And Renault works team are somewhere in the middle.
You get the impression that when the Renault engine arrived they just got the dremel out an whittled away at bits
of the 2017 mclaren honda engine bay to make it fit.


rdjohn

3,009 posts

131 months

Monday 12th November
quotequote all
Frimley111R said:
Indeed but also the 'game' is not the same. Massive budgets and manufacturers etc. It's a different world as it is in all motor racing these days.

It's not enough to have a good leader. You need masses of money, huge sponsors, hundreds of people, etc.

It's sad to see McLaren and Williams at the back and I hope it isn't too long before they can become at least mid tier teams but I am not hopeful.That said, both seem to have acknowledged that their cars have fundamental issues which wrecked their seasons.
I feel that the management problem is the same for both teams.

In the days of Chapman, Tyrrell and Williams, teams and resources were minute by modern standards. Even when Jordan started in the ‘90s he only had 20 people to “control”. People like Ron were superb at making the team, bigger and better resourced but probably struggled to delegate, identify real talent and trust those with better knowledge around him.

It is pretty obvious why people like Horner and Wolff are successful. They have an even temperament no matter what is going on. They concentrating on managing the resources and media side, but rely heavily on the other leaders in the team, like Newey and Allison, to deliver the technical package, strategy and pit activities.

I don’t think you can see these qualities in either Claire Williams, or Zak Brown. I would be inclined to back Otmar Szafnauer, before Arrivabene, as well.

Frimley111R

9,132 posts

170 months

Monday 12th November
quotequote all
rdjohn said:
I don’t think you can see these qualities in either Claire Williams, or Zak Brown.
Yep, agreed. I can see either leading the teams forward.

entropy

3,498 posts

139 months

Tuesday 13th November
quotequote all
rdjohn said:
But how often does a one-month team win the event? We are trying to complete FA’s CV here - no more.

How often does a winning car not come from a Penske, Andretti, or Ganassi? An experienced team and management has got to be better than a Rookie F1 outfit, finding their feet.

Honda teams seem to win twice as often as Chevrolet.

It may not be expensive in comparison, but it will be a drain on resources. If Coca-Cola were funding a full season’s racing for Fernando and dedicated team, then I would be inclined to view this slightly differently.
Still doesn't stop McLaren tie-up with another team.

I reckon it could be Ed Carpenter Racing. It was an open secret he was running Danica Patrick this year before the official annoucement; Penske said he was at the limit this year so it'll mean running Alonso over Castroneves for 2019. AJ Foyt? Interesting dealing with the big guy....

I was listening to the Marshall Pruett Podcast last night and McLaren were close to buying out SPM a couple of years ago. Next year is likely a precursor to being an entrant outright for 2020.

ntiz

416 posts

72 months

Tuesday 13th November
quotequote all
I guess the difference between back in the day and now. Is that they used to actually be teams were an now they are huge multi million pound companies with so many more aspects than just getting a car to the track.

130R

5,807 posts

142 months

Wednesday 14th November
quotequote all
McLaren have the 4th highest budget in F1 (behind Mercedes, Ferrari and Red Bull). They are not some plucky underdog. Their performance in recent years has been embarrassing, especially with a driver as good as Alonso.

thegreenhell

4,860 posts

155 months

Thursday 15th November
quotequote all
It's reported this morning that Bob Fernley has joined McLaren, but only to lead their Indycar programme.

HustleRussell

15,460 posts

96 months

Thursday 15th November
quotequote all
130R said:
McLaren have the 4th highest budget in F1 (behind Mercedes, Ferrari and Red Bull). They are not some plucky underdog. Their performance in recent years has been embarrassing, especially with a driver as good as Alonso.
You are of course correct with your second sentence, but are you sure about your first- Renault have been pumping the money in of late.

revrange

1,164 posts

120 months

Thursday 15th November
quotequote all
130R said:
McLaren have the 4th highest budget in F1 (behind Mercedes, Ferrari and Red Bull). They are not some plucky underdog. Their performance in recent years has been embarrassing, especially with a driver as good as Alonso.
Not sure that is correct anymore now they dont have Honda's money, that was the story last year

rdjohn

3,009 posts

131 months

Thursday 15th November
quotequote all
thegreenhell said:
It's reported this morning that Bob Fernley has joined McLaren, but only to lead their Indycar programme.
I wish Bob was running the show in Woking and Zak running Indy cars, United Autosports, his historic racing antics, or whatever else might take his fancy.

But on a positive note, I feel that Bob will form the backbone of a good entry, if anybody doing a one off race can create the potential to win.

Gaz.

52,316 posts

187 months

Thursday 15th November
quotequote all
revrange said:
Not sure that is correct anymore now they dont have Honda's money, that was the story last year
I thought the Bahraini's made up the difference? Hence the Crown Prince having a face like a slapped arse after shelling out $260m?

revrange

1,164 posts

120 months

Tuesday 20th November
quotequote all
Gaz. said:
I thought the Bahraini's made up the difference? Hence the Crown Prince having a face like a slapped arse after shelling out $260m?
Not sure its true, others on here have pointed out Mclaren are bleeding cash, hence the investor early in the summer pumping $200m into the group. The F1 team use to be the bench mark for sponsorship in F1, now there barely a sticker on it.

Also dont forget they have gone from free enginers to having to pay for them.

ralphrj

2,728 posts

127 months

Tuesday 20th November
quotequote all
There is an investor update on McLaren's financial performance scheduled for next Tuesday (27/11).

Hopefully there will be something positive in them this time.



With regard to budgets, McLaren may still have the 4th largest but the gap to the top 3 is getting bigger.

MartG

13,169 posts

140 months

Tuesday 27th November
quotequote all
New sponsor announced - smartphone manufacturer OnePlus

https://www.mclaren.com/formula1/partners/oneplus/...

Edited by MartG on Tuesday 27th November 17:28

CoolHands

8,869 posts

131 months

Tuesday 27th November
quotequote all
I think they’re mad. They’ve gone from Honda to Renault and it’s cost them $100million. And red bull are going the other way!

And it turns out the engine isn’t the problem anyway their entire car and organisation structure is st. They should have saved the hundred mill. and developed the car.

I reckon either engine was fine to propel them. We can can see from other teams with the same engines that the engine is not th main factor in grid position.