Goodbye Fernando...
Discussion
For the record.
It’s not that I don’t think Alonso isn’t great, he’s immensely talented, but I can’t see how he can be considered amongst the greats when we haven’t seen his talents shine through for several years.
He’s a great driver no doubt, but would I class him along with Senna, Schumacher, Prost, fangio? ....how can I?
..through his own actions and choices, we haven’t been able to see his talent, he has been mired in a few controversies and been prone to quite a few hissy fits...see mclaren 2007, pretty much the whole Honda era with the engine complaints etc.
...I think Alonsos legacy will be one of a wasted talent, he should have beaten Schumacher records, but hasn’t through bad choices. I for one, can’t wait for him to get into Indycar so we can see that talent shine through again and get that legacy back on track
It’s not that I don’t think Alonso isn’t great, he’s immensely talented, but I can’t see how he can be considered amongst the greats when we haven’t seen his talents shine through for several years.
He’s a great driver no doubt, but would I class him along with Senna, Schumacher, Prost, fangio? ....how can I?
..through his own actions and choices, we haven’t been able to see his talent, he has been mired in a few controversies and been prone to quite a few hissy fits...see mclaren 2007, pretty much the whole Honda era with the engine complaints etc.
...I think Alonsos legacy will be one of a wasted talent, he should have beaten Schumacher records, but hasn’t through bad choices. I for one, can’t wait for him to get into Indycar so we can see that talent shine through again and get that legacy back on track
37chevy said:
For the record.
It’s not that I don’t think Alonso isn’t great, he’s immensely talented, but I can’t see how he can be considered amongst the greats when we haven’t seen his talents shine through for several years.
He’s a great driver no doubt, but would I class him along with Senna, Schumacher, Prost, fangio? ....how can I?
..through his own actions and choices, we haven’t been able to see his talent, he has been mired in a few controversies and been prone to quite a few hissy fits...see mclaren 2007, pretty much the whole Honda era with the engine complaints etc.
...I think Alonsos legacy will be one of a wasted talent, he should have beaten Schumacher records, but hasn’t through bad choices. I for one, can’t wait for him to get into Indycar so we can see that talent shine through again and get that legacy back on track
^^^^^What he so eloquently said.It’s not that I don’t think Alonso isn’t great, he’s immensely talented, but I can’t see how he can be considered amongst the greats when we haven’t seen his talents shine through for several years.
He’s a great driver no doubt, but would I class him along with Senna, Schumacher, Prost, fangio? ....how can I?
..through his own actions and choices, we haven’t been able to see his talent, he has been mired in a few controversies and been prone to quite a few hissy fits...see mclaren 2007, pretty much the whole Honda era with the engine complaints etc.
...I think Alonsos legacy will be one of a wasted talent, he should have beaten Schumacher records, but hasn’t through bad choices. I for one, can’t wait for him to get into Indycar so we can see that talent shine through again and get that legacy back on track
I don’t think many people “hate” Alonso, but F1 enthusiasts can see all Alonso’s baggage has got in the way of his potential. We will never know what he could have achieved.
Too much Wuda, Cuda, Shuda when discussions turn to Alonso.
Exige77 said:
37chevy said:
For the record.
It’s not that I don’t think Alonso isn’t great, he’s immensely talented, but I can’t see how he can be considered amongst the greats when we haven’t seen his talents shine through for several years.
He’s a great driver no doubt, but would I class him along with Senna, Schumacher, Prost, fangio? ....how can I?
..through his own actions and choices, we haven’t been able to see his talent, he has been mired in a few controversies and been prone to quite a few hissy fits...see mclaren 2007, pretty much the whole Honda era with the engine complaints etc.
...I think Alonsos legacy will be one of a wasted talent, he should have beaten Schumacher records, but hasn’t through bad choices. I for one, can’t wait for him to get into Indycar so we can see that talent shine through again and get that legacy back on track
^^^^^What he so eloquently said.It’s not that I don’t think Alonso isn’t great, he’s immensely talented, but I can’t see how he can be considered amongst the greats when we haven’t seen his talents shine through for several years.
He’s a great driver no doubt, but would I class him along with Senna, Schumacher, Prost, fangio? ....how can I?
..through his own actions and choices, we haven’t been able to see his talent, he has been mired in a few controversies and been prone to quite a few hissy fits...see mclaren 2007, pretty much the whole Honda era with the engine complaints etc.
...I think Alonsos legacy will be one of a wasted talent, he should have beaten Schumacher records, but hasn’t through bad choices. I for one, can’t wait for him to get into Indycar so we can see that talent shine through again and get that legacy back on track
I don’t think many people “hate” Alonso, but F1 enthusiasts can see all Alonso’s baggage has got in the way of his potential. We will never know what he could have achieved.
Too much Wuda, Cuda, Shuda when discussions turn to Alonso.
For me, and the one thing Alonso has to his credit is his drive to be a complete all-rounder. He won't ever be seen as a great in F1 up on the top-step with Hamilton, Schumacher, Clark etc, but it looks like he's determined to keep driving after F1 and will go one to add Daytona to his Le Mans win and F1 titles, and then keep adding to them.
I'm a huge Hamilton fan, but we all know he will simply hang-up his helmet when he leaves F1, Alonso looks determined to add to his legacy winning other championships as a more rounded driver.
37chevy said:
For the record.
It’s not that I don’t think Alonso isn’t great, he’s immensely talented, but I can’t see how he can be considered amongst the greats when we haven’t seen his talents shine through for several years.
He’s a great driver no doubt, but would I class him along with Senna, Schumacher, Prost, fangio? ....how can I?
..through his own actions and choices, we haven’t been able to see his talent, he has been mired in a few controversies and been prone to quite a few hissy fits...see mclaren 2007, pretty much the whole Honda era with the engine complaints etc.
...I think Alonsos legacy will be one of a wasted talent, he should have beaten Schumacher records, but hasn’t through bad choices. I for one, can’t wait for him to get into Indycar so we can see that talent shine through again and get that legacy back on track
I’m not sure you can say we haven’t seen Alonso’s talent for a few years, unless you’re just watching a Mercedes or Ferrari at the front ad seeing nothing happen behind. It’s not that I don’t think Alonso isn’t great, he’s immensely talented, but I can’t see how he can be considered amongst the greats when we haven’t seen his talents shine through for several years.
He’s a great driver no doubt, but would I class him along with Senna, Schumacher, Prost, fangio? ....how can I?
..through his own actions and choices, we haven’t been able to see his talent, he has been mired in a few controversies and been prone to quite a few hissy fits...see mclaren 2007, pretty much the whole Honda era with the engine complaints etc.
...I think Alonsos legacy will be one of a wasted talent, he should have beaten Schumacher records, but hasn’t through bad choices. I for one, can’t wait for him to get into Indycar so we can see that talent shine through again and get that legacy back on track
I’d argue we’ve seen more of how good Alonso really is this last couple of years than when he was in the Renault or Ferrari. Last weekend alone was a fine example of his race craft. Sadly 7th place is about the highest he’s ever going to get unless one of the 3 teams in front has a reliability issue or crash. I know the Mclaren is an utter pile of a car but he’s always getting the most out of it, look at the gap to his team mate.l every weekend. And the 13-0 quali results, the huge difference in points scored between the 2 teams.
If Alonso was still in that Ferrari would people be hoping/expecting LeClerc to do so well against him as they’re hoping/praying/expecting him to do against Vettelv I doubt it. For a driver at his age now to still be as quick as he is says a lot about his motivation even in a car that’s crap. If he was in that Ferrari this year it’s not a daft thing to say that he could easily be 40 points to the good in front of Hamilton rather than behind.
The Surveyor said:
I would also agree with this almost fully.
For me, and the one thing Alonso has to his credit is his drive to be a complete all-rounder. He won't ever be seen as a great in F1 up on the top-step with Hamilton, Schumacher, Clark etc, but it looks like he's determined to keep driving after F1 and will go one to add Daytona to his Le Mans win and F1 titles, and then keep adding to them.
I'm a huge Hamilton fan, but we all know he will simply hang-up his helmet when he leaves F1, Alonso looks determined to add to his legacy winning other championships as a more rounded driver.
IndeedFor me, and the one thing Alonso has to his credit is his drive to be a complete all-rounder. He won't ever be seen as a great in F1 up on the top-step with Hamilton, Schumacher, Clark etc, but it looks like he's determined to keep driving after F1 and will go one to add Daytona to his Le Mans win and F1 titles, and then keep adding to them.
I'm a huge Hamilton fan, but we all know he will simply hang-up his helmet when he leaves F1, Alonso looks determined to add to his legacy winning other championships as a more rounded driver.
I see Alonso as more of a Mario Andretti type of driver. That is, of course if his self hype conned through and he can go on to win in other Formula
DanielSan said:
I’m not sure you can say we haven’t seen Alonso’s talent for a few years, unless you’re just watching a Mercedes or Ferrari at the front ad seeing nothing happen behind.
I’d argue we’ve seen more of how good Alonso really is this last couple of years than when he was in the Renault or Ferrari. Last weekend alone was a fine example of his race craft. Sadly 7th place is about the highest he’s ever going to get unless one of the 3 teams in front has a reliability issue or crash. I know the Mclaren is an utter pile of a car but he’s always getting the most out of it, look at the gap to his team mate.l every weekend. And the 13-0 quali results, the huge difference in points scored between the 2 teams.
If Alonso was still in that Ferrari would people be hoping/expecting LeClerc to do so well against him as they’re hoping/praying/expecting him to do against Vettelv I doubt it. For a driver at his age now to still be as quick as he is says a lot about his motivation even in a car that’s crap. If he was in that Ferrari this year it’s not a daft thing to say that he could easily be 40 points to the good in front of Hamilton rather than behind.
Exactly.I’d argue we’ve seen more of how good Alonso really is this last couple of years than when he was in the Renault or Ferrari. Last weekend alone was a fine example of his race craft. Sadly 7th place is about the highest he’s ever going to get unless one of the 3 teams in front has a reliability issue or crash. I know the Mclaren is an utter pile of a car but he’s always getting the most out of it, look at the gap to his team mate.l every weekend. And the 13-0 quali results, the huge difference in points scored between the 2 teams.
If Alonso was still in that Ferrari would people be hoping/expecting LeClerc to do so well against him as they’re hoping/praying/expecting him to do against Vettelv I doubt it. For a driver at his age now to still be as quick as he is says a lot about his motivation even in a car that’s crap. If he was in that Ferrari this year it’s not a daft thing to say that he could easily be 40 points to the good in front of Hamilton rather than behind.
Perhaps 40 points ahead of Hamilton is a bit too much but he would have taken the chances Vettel didn't. But I do feel he would be leading the Championship.
I think Baku just shows you how much drive Alonso has.
The car should have been out of the race but he had the skill and desire to get the thing back to the pits.
Amazing as he then scored 7th in the points.
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|https://thumbsnap.com/JzZvDMG9[
Exige77 said:
I don’t think many people “hate” Alonso, but F1 enthusiasts can see all Alonso’s baggage has got in the way of his potential. We will never know what he could have achieved.
I think that's part of Alonso's appeal. He has a dark side and he's not particularly bothered about hiding it. Ever watched a film where the good guys are so toe-curlingly perfect and pious that you root for the baddies? And he's the housewives' favourite.
You have to laugh after the Crashgate scandal when Grosjean lost it at the exact same corner as Piquet did a year earlier.
Not an easy clip to find.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpIZ34Z1W_s
Not an easy clip to find.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cpIZ34Z1W_s
Joe Saward on the Missed Apex Podcast said:
Alonso isn't the second Messiah
12 minutes in:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqdWRTBDVoI
carinaman said:
Great podcast all the way through and spot on in this bitcarinaman said:
Joe Saward on the Missed Apex Podcast said:
Alonso isn't the second Messiah
12 minutes in:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqdWRTBDVoI
Funny how he didn't compare Alonso's performances to Hamilton throughout 2010-2013... Joe Saward is renowned in the industry for his bias. I'd take Brundle's opinion and many others in the industry over Saward.
As someone else mentioned above, if you've only been watching the Mercs & Ferraris this year then you won't notice what Alonso has been achieving. To be best-of-the-rest (Merc, Ferrari, Red Bull) at times when the Haas, Force India, Renault and at times Sauber are better than the McLaren says it all.
Not sure how anyone can say he hasn't achieved much in the last several years.
Edited by TobyTR on Wednesday 26th September 00:04
carinaman said:
I think on an Autosport podcast they did say that Alonso did have to do some driving at Le Mans and that his driving was on it.
He did well at Le Mans. It was pretty much a two horse race (both horses being Toyotas), but the stints he did were impressive. Nice that he let Nakajima take the flag too and didn't try and pull rank. Grahamdub said:
carinaman said:
I think on an Autosport podcast they did say that Alonso did have to do some driving at Le Mans and that his driving was on it.
He did well at Le Mans. It was pretty much a two horse race (both horses being Toyotas), but the stints he did were impressive. Nice that he let Nakajima take the flag too and didn't try and pull rank. TobyTR said:
"Alonso hasn't been the same driver since 2007" - really? Alonso's been even better the last 10 years. What a moron. "Took him to the cleaners in 2007" - no, they finished on equal points...
Funny how he didn't compare Alonso's performances to Hamilton throughout 2010-2013... Joe Saward is renowned in the industry for his bias. I'd take Brundle's opinion and many others in the industry over Saward.
As someone else mentioned above, if you've only been watching the Mercs & Ferraris this year then you won't notice what Alonso has been achieving. To be best-of-the-rest (Merc, Ferrari, Red Bull) at times when the Haas, Force India, Renault and at times Sauber are better than the McLaren says it all.
Not sure how anyone can say he hasn't achieved much in the last several years.
Totally agree. Funny how he didn't compare Alonso's performances to Hamilton throughout 2010-2013... Joe Saward is renowned in the industry for his bias. I'd take Brundle's opinion and many others in the industry over Saward.
As someone else mentioned above, if you've only been watching the Mercs & Ferraris this year then you won't notice what Alonso has been achieving. To be best-of-the-rest (Merc, Ferrari, Red Bull) at times when the Haas, Force India, Renault and at times Sauber are better than the McLaren says it all.
Not sure how anyone can say he hasn't achieved much in the last several years.
Edited by TobyTR on Wednesday 26th September 00:04
Joe Saward comments are laughable.
What a complete joke.
TobyTR said:
"Alonso hasn't been the same driver since 2007" - really? Alonso's been even better the last 10 years. What a moron. "Took him to the cleaners in 2007" - no, they finished on equal points...
Funny how he didn't compare Alonso's performances to Hamilton throughout 2010-2013... Joe Saward is renowned in the industry for his bias. I'd take Brundle's opinion and many others in the industry over Saward.
As someone else mentioned above, if you've only been watching the Mercs & Ferraris this year then you won't notice what Alonso has been achieving. To be best-of-the-rest (Merc, Ferrari, Red Bull) at times when the Haas, Force India, Renault and at times Sauber are better than the McLaren says it all.
Not sure how anyone can say he hasn't achieved much in the last several years.
The way I see what Saward says is that mentally Alonso really got taken to the cleaner by Hamilton. So much that he blackmailed McLaren as he wasn't ready for a rookie to be as fast as him on his first season at the peak of his life. No he never been the same again after that as he knew another driver on the start line was faster than him and could only get better. It must have hurt him so much for Hamilton to be world champion the following year. Alonso is a fantastic driver but whatever people say, he finished behind a rookie in 2007 table and never been able after that to win a world title again. Funny how he didn't compare Alonso's performances to Hamilton throughout 2010-2013... Joe Saward is renowned in the industry for his bias. I'd take Brundle's opinion and many others in the industry over Saward.
As someone else mentioned above, if you've only been watching the Mercs & Ferraris this year then you won't notice what Alonso has been achieving. To be best-of-the-rest (Merc, Ferrari, Red Bull) at times when the Haas, Force India, Renault and at times Sauber are better than the McLaren says it all.
Not sure how anyone can say he hasn't achieved much in the last several years.
Edited by TobyTR on Wednesday 26th September 00:04
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