Lando Norris

[HTP99]

I am starting to get irritated by him, he needs to pull up his big boy pants and get on with thing and sort himself out mentally, he seems to be in a hole currently and seems very fragile, he's been an F1 driver for long enough and he is a very good one but until he sorts himself out I honestly think he'll be on a downward spiral.

He's worried, Piastri has been doing the gig 18m and he's as cool and calm as anything and will soon be dominating him, from what I've seen lately I firmly believe the next F1 champion after Lewis and Max will be Oscar.

[Heathwood]

HTP99 said:

I am starting to get irritated by him, he needs to pull up his big boy pants and get on with thing and sort himself out mentally, he seems to be in a hole currently and seems very fragile, he's been an F1 driver for long enough and he is a very good one but until he sorts himself out I honestly think he'll be on a downward spiral.

He's worried, Piastri has been doing the gig 18m and he's as cool and calm as anything and will soon be dominating him, from what I've seen lately I firmly believe the next F1 champion after Lewis and Max will be Oscar.

Yes, that’s a good point about Oscar. It’s quite possible that Lando is more worried about the threat from the other side of the garage than anything else, and that is eating away at him and presenting itself as mental fragility.

[HTP99]

Heathwood said:

Yes, I have had similar thoughts which I’ve relayed in other F1 related threads.

It’s good be somewhat self critical and motivated to do better, but I agree that he’s taking this a little far. I think he would be a better driver to relax just a tad, roll with it and not dwell on every little mistake. He’s got the speed and ability but so has Oscar (with an extra helping of calm composure), and it may well come down to mental strength and stamina for superiority with the McLaren team over the next couple of seasons.

LeClerc is very self critical, however, unlike Norris, he doesn't do it it in a sulky way, he is matter of fact and almost positive about it, with Norris he's like a sulky teenager and you get the impression after the interview he'll run off to his mum for a cuddle and a cry.

He's also started to come out with the odd sarky comments, something is eating away at him, an elite sportsman can't be like this, he is showing weakness which his competitors will capitalise on.

Edited by HTP99 on Monday 5th August 18:56

[vaud]

If I were Mclaren I would be very happy - two very, very good drivers. Ferrari next year will arguably have an similarly strong talent pool of capability in terms of there being no clear no 1.

Personally I think they are all superb, all with their strengths and all with their flaws. The biggest challenge will be the teams managing the drivers as they will be so close.

[BrownEaredDog]

HTP99 said:

He's worried, Piastri has been doing the gig 18m and he's as cool and calm as anything and will soon be dominating him, from what I've seen lately I firmly believe the next F1 champion after Lewis and Max will be Oscar.

I agree. Oscar seems to have the emotional detachment that multiple champions have had. Hamilton, Schumacher, Lauda (for example): they rarely show(ed) emotions when things weren't going their way. Verstappen seems to be handling the Red Bull troubles well, too - I'll bet his old man is chucking all his toys out of the pram, but Max doesn't seem too phased by it all.

Interesting stuff.

[vaud]

BrownEaredDog said:

Verstappen seems to be handling the Red Bull troubles well, too - I'll bet his old man is chucking all his toys out of the pram, but Max doesn't seem too phased by it all.

I agree. I don't think Max cares. He could quit tomorrow with millions in the bank (at 26) and be the youngest ever 3x WDC (2x for the trolls) in history and walk away to compete in any series he wanted to, e-sport or real. Or do other stuff.

[BrownEaredDog]

Heathwood said:

I think he would be a better driver to relax just a tad, roll with it and not dwell on every little mistake

Exactly, and he needs to rediscover a bit of the enjoyment of the racing that he used to have.

[Big Nanas]

HTP99 said:

I am starting to get irritated by him, he needs to pull up his big boy pants and get on with thing and sort himself out mentally, he seems to be in a hole currently and seems very fragile, he's been an F1 driver for long enough and he is a very good one but until he sorts himself out I honestly think he'll be on a downward spiral.

He's worried, Piastri has been doing the gig 18m and he's as cool and calm as anything and will soon be dominating him, from what I've seen lately I firmly believe the next F1 champion after Lewis and Max will be Oscar.

Lando has been very open about his struggles with mental health. My wife has had some serious mental health issues over the years, and telling someone who struggles with this to 'Pull up your big boy pants' really isn't helpful.

McLaren will have access to the best sports psychology around, so hopefully they can all get on top of this in the best way possible.

"Man up", just doesn't cut it anymore. (sorry for the rant)

[vaud]

Big Nanas said:

Lando has been very open about his struggles with mental health. My wife has had some serious mental health issues over the years, and telling someone who struggles with this to 'Pull up your big boy pants' really isn't helpful.

McLaren will have access to the best sports psychology around, so hopefully they can all get on top of this in the best way possible.

"Man up", just doesn't cut it anymore. (sorry for the rant)

Quite agree. Mental health is as a complex a health issue as there can be.

[HTP99]

Big Nanas said:

HTP99 said:

I am starting to get irritated by him, he needs to pull up his big boy pants and get on with thing and sort himself out mentally, he seems to be in a hole currently and seems very fragile, he's been an F1 driver for long enough and he is a very good one but until he sorts himself out I honestly think he'll be on a downward spiral.

He's worried, Piastri has been doing the gig 18m and he's as cool and calm as anything and will soon be dominating him, from what I've seen lately I firmly believe the next F1 champion after Lewis and Max will be Oscar.

Lando has been very open about his struggles with mental health. My wife has had some serious mental health issues over the years, and telling someone who struggles with this to 'Pull up your big boy pants' really isn't helpful.

McLaren will have access to the best sports psychology around, so hopefully they can all get on top of this in the best way possible.

"Man up", just doesn't cut it anymore. (sorry for the rant)

Maybe I said it the wrong way, I apologise, my wife has been in dark places too in the past, both of my daughter's have had varying degrees of anxiety problems.

I am aware of Lando's mental health struggles, I just feel in the environment he is in, given the nature of the competetiveness and the global reach, he should try and be less visibly down all the time, it shows things are getting to him, maybe he's not getting the help he needs!

[Big Nanas]

HTP99 said:

Big Nanas said:

HTP99 said:

I am starting to get irritated by him, he needs to pull up his big boy pants and get on with thing and sort himself out mentally, he seems to be in a hole currently and seems very fragile, he's been an F1 driver for long enough and he is a very good one but until he sorts himself out I honestly think he'll be on a downward spiral.

He's worried, Piastri has been doing the gig 18m and he's as cool and calm as anything and will soon be dominating him, from what I've seen lately I firmly believe the next F1 champion after Lewis and Max will be Oscar.

Lando has been very open about his struggles with mental health. My wife has had some serious mental health issues over the years, and telling someone who struggles with this to 'Pull up your big boy pants' really isn't helpful.

McLaren will have access to the best sports psychology around, so hopefully they can all get on top of this in the best way possible.

"Man up", just doesn't cut it anymore. (sorry for the rant)

Maybe I said it the wrong way, I apologise, my wife has been in dark places too in the past, both of my daughter's have had varying degrees of anxiety problems.

I am aware of Lando's mental health struggles, I just feel in the environment he is in, given the nature of the competetiveness and the global reach, he should try and be less visibly down all the time, it shows things are getting to him, maybe he's not getting the help he needs!

I get what youre saying.
Now Lando is a genuinely competitive car and arguably the best on the grid, the pressure is showing. It's one thing to possibly get on to the podium, quite another to go into a race thinking 'Theres no reason we should lose'.

Lando has an issue with his starts. Always slow, and the next 15 or so laps he can't make time up. He's a very fast finisher though. Helpful that he's a great qualifier, up 9-4 (I think) up in qualifying).

Of course it doesn't help that he's got a likeable, cool as a cucumber fast driver in Piastri. He's almost the opposite of Lando; fast starts, chilled out.

McLaren are obviously aware of all this.

It's clear that being a world champion doesn't come to 'luck'., You can luck into a win, but over a season? The mental fortitude to keep it going must be immense when it's so tight.

It's nice problem to have at McLaren, and as a fan I'm thrilled to see how good they look, I'm just hoping Lando can understand himself and work within himself.

Edited by Big Nanas on Monday 5th August 20:33

[BrownEaredDog]

HTP99 said:

Big Nanas said:

HTP99 said:

I am starting to get irritated by him, he needs to pull up his big boy pants and get on with thing and sort himself out mentally, he seems to be in a hole currently and seems very fragile, he's been an F1 driver for long enough and he is a very good one but until he sorts himself out I honestly think he'll be on a downward spiral.

He's worried, Piastri has been doing the gig 18m and he's as cool and calm as anything and will soon be dominating him, from what I've seen lately I firmly believe the next F1 champion after Lewis and Max will be Oscar.

Lando has been very open about his struggles with mental health. My wife has had some serious mental health issues over the years, and telling someone who struggles with this to 'Pull up your big boy pants' really isn't helpful.

McLaren will have access to the best sports psychology around, so hopefully they can all get on top of this in the best way possible.

"Man up", just doesn't cut it anymore. (sorry for the rant)

Maybe I said it the wrong way, I apologise, my wife has been in dark places too in the past, both of my daughter's have had varying degrees of anxiety problems.

I am aware of Lando's mental health struggles, I just feel in the environment he is in, given the nature of the competetiveness and the global reach, he should try and be less visibly down all the time, it shows things are getting to him, maybe he's not getting the help he needs!

I didn't read HTP99's comment as a criticism or in any way denigrating others' mental health challenges. I have a bunch of these myself, it's not been fun for many years and it ain't getting better, but that's a subject for another thread on another forum...

Lando has been part of McLaren's academy for many years, one would hope that their own psychologists would have been with him all the way.

What strikes me is the abrupt change in his demeanour from Spain onwards; I feel for him, but my point still stands - at the moment he seems to be his own worst enemy. He's been blaming himself not only for driving errors (fair enough), but also for things beyond his control.

I've just read this article on f1.com which seems to confirm that he's not quite on top of things.

[neverlifted]

vaud said:

I agree. I don't think Max cares. He could quit tomorrow with millions in the bank (at 26) and be the youngest ever 3x WDC (2x for the trolls) in history and walk away to compete in any series he wanted to, e-sport or real. Or do other stuff.

I think Vettel still holds the youngest WDC related records for up to 4 WDCs anyway.

[vaud]

neverlifted said:

I think Vettel still holds the youngest WDC related records for up to 4 WDCs anyway.

Ahh you might be right. My bad. Either way I don't think Max cares.

[Big Nanas]

BrownEaredDog said:

Lando has been part of McLaren's academy for many years, one would hope that their own psychologists would have been with him all the way.

.

That's an interesting observation.
I have no doubt McLaren must have observed this and are taking steps, which shows how hard it is. It's fascinating.

[kambites]

He clearly needs to change something because for the last few races Piastri has, for the first time, looked the better overall driver and Piastri is still on the steeper part of the learning curve.

I think Piastri has higher potential in the long run.

Edited by kambites on Monday 5th August 21:27

[ChocolateFrog]

He's not a top tier F1 driver.

He's the next rung down. The A- category if you like.

Him and Piastri are very evenly matched TBF.

[Heathwood]

ChocolateFrog said:

He's not a top tier F1 driver.

He's the next rung down. The A- category if you like.

Him and Piastri are very evenly matched TBF.

I think it’s still too early to judge. You may be right or he might get a handle on things and prove almost unbeatable. Time, as ever, will tell.

[rallycross]

Anyone know if he has a driver coach?
Peter Windsor often talks about the benefit of having a driver coach and how surprised he is that so few past or current F1 drivers use them which makes sense as you can imagine the size of most F1 drivers ego, then having a driving coach might seem like an unnecessary resource.
I'd guess a driver coach might also help with mental approach as well as driving style.

[RB Will]

He seems to have got to a point I had with work not too long ago. Had years of being held back by things out of his control, maybe doubting himself a bit, had that first chance of a win taken away by team orders, forever being told thing would get better and they got worse. Finally things turn around a bit and you get the right resources and your chance to shine and yet things go wrong (whether his fault or not) so you still don't start getting in the wins you just take on the down attitude of what is the bloody point, no matter what happens things still fall to st and I cant win.
He seems like he has lost faith in himself and life (maybe a bit dramatic). Might do him some good to get off between races and go do some karting or something hopefully get some wins and give himself some confidence back and show him not everything is poo.