Lando Norris

[vaud]

4.7AMV8 said:

I also see Lando as each week goes by a Button then a Verstappen or Hamilton. I do like him but he needs to own up to the fact he is making mistakes on the way which are not comparable to those I have mentioned or even his teammate. If it came to it, I would see Piastri next year with more of a chance getting a world title than Norris.

McLaren have a great problem for 2025 in having 2 excellent drivers.

[TheDeuce]

vaud said:

4.7AMV8 said:

I also see Lando as each week goes by a Button then a Verstappen or Hamilton. I do like him but he needs to own up to the fact he is making mistakes on the way which are not comparable to those I have mentioned or even his teammate. If it came to it, I would see Piastri next year with more of a chance getting a world title than Norris.

McLaren have a great problem for 2025 in having 2 excellent drivers.

That's not so much a problem, just a circumstance likely to ps off many fans and cause at least one driver to become very grumpy. It's likely to be awkward moving forwards, one way or the other.

[entropy]

Gazzab said:

If Verstappen is behind someone you know he will probably overtake them. If Verstappen is in front then you know he is going to be hard to overtake. Sadly not the same can be said for Lando. The red flag was bad luck but he should have passed Russell earlier. He should have got back some places later on. Piastri shouldn’t have let Verstappen past so easily. The difference between Verstappen and Lando was too stark yesterday.

Lando never had confidence in the car to attack Russell until George was crawling in the mid-race monsoon.

Not taking anything away from Max but his car was on another level and this was when he was having to contend with traffic. Red flag or not Max had the pace to win outright.

[cliffords]

4.7AMV8 said:

I also see Lando as each week goes by a Button then a Verstappen or Hamilton. I do like him but he needs to own up to the fact he is making mistakes on the way which are not comparable to those I have mentioned or even his teammate. If it came to it, I would see Piastri next year with more of a chance getting a world title than Norris.

Now your going to get a right telling off on here suggesting that. I agree with you entirely. OP is a far better prospect than Norris. Did OP have to let LN past twice this weekend? Given the number of F1 race starts LN has had, he is an average overall performer, who for a while this season had the bast car. He will never be a World Champion in my view.

[nickfrog]

^ I admire your confidence. They're probably very very close in reality so it's fine to have a favourite but beyond that, that's just guessing and speculation from a casual observer.

[TheDeuce]

nickfrog said:

^ I admire your confidence. They're probably very very close in reality so it's fine to have a favourite but beyond that, that's just guessing and speculation from a casual observer.

I would agree, but there actually is a demonstrable difference between OP and LN in terms of the likelihood of either winning a WDC... In as much as we don't know how OP would navigate that journey at all. We do know a little about how Lando would as he did have a (slim) chance this season, and he made a catalogue of errors yesterday that resulted in him going from a P1 to now losing that slim chance of a title altogether.

Maybe OP would do the same, or not even be fast enough consistently enough to get the chance in the first place - we simply don't know. But we do know that Lando has faltered having been in that position. That isn't speculation anymore, it's something that actually happened.

Thankfully, it's highly likely that the team will remain as top contenders next season, so we will probably learn a lot more about both then.

[Fire99]

I think perhaps Piastri is more mentally consistent (or atleast appears that way) than Norris. Norris at the moment seems to drop his chin quite easily. He can be a bit of a snarly sulker. If the two are even on pace then I think that would work to the benefit of Piastri.

It's all down to pace. It depends if on single lap and overall race pace, Piastri is an equal to Norris. Personally, I'd rather work with Piastri.

[TheDeuce]

Fire99 said:

I think perhaps Piastri is more mentally consistent (or atleast appears that way) than Norris. Norris at the moment seems to drop his chin quite easily. He can be a bit of a snarly sulker. If the two are even on pace then I think that would work to the benefit of Piastri.

It's all down to pace. It depends if on single lap and overall race pace, Piastri is an equal to Norris. Personally, I'd rather work with Piastri.

It's also possible that Piastri still has time to improve relative to Lando, although of course that's never guaranteed - it's just possible that he's not yet reached his peak, he has had less F1 experience than Lando.

The confidence of success is another factor too, he could emerge to be quite a different driver if he starts next season strong and bags a points lead early on. Sometimes a driver (or in fact, any sportsperson really) just needs a couple of good outings and then they're off. The same is true for repeatedly defeated drivers early in a season, their performance falls off a cliff - see RBR for details...

The above is a long winded way of saying that I doubt we've seen Piastri at his strongest just yet


(and I get the impression the team are careful not to demoralise Piastri as they probably suspect they haven't seen his best yet either)

[Fire99]

TheDeuce said:

The above is a long winded way of saying that I doubt we've seen Piastri at his strongest just yet


(and I get the impression the team are careful not to demoralise Piastri as they probably suspect they haven't seen his best yet either)

I think you're right. Piastri has shown some very strong moments and it is only his 2nd seaon in F1. I agree that the team probably see something in Piastri and are probably trying to balance maximising Norris's chances of a title (well they were until after this weekend perhaps!!). with ensuring Piastri is still allowed to drive at (near) the top of his ability..

I think the first 3 or 4 races of next season will be interesting, seeing how the dynamics on the track between the two McLaren drivers evolves.. Who will stand out from the other?

[TheDeuce]

Fire99 said:

TheDeuce said:

The above is a long winded way of saying that I doubt we've seen Piastri at his strongest just yet


(and I get the impression the team are careful not to demoralise Piastri as they probably suspect they haven't seen his best yet either)

I think you're right. Piastri has shown some very strong moments and it is only his 2nd seaon in F1. I agree that the team probably see something in Piastri and are probably trying to balance maximising Norris's chances of a title (well they were until after this weekend perhaps!!). with ensuring Piastri is still allowed to drive at (near) the top of his ability..

I think the first 3 or 4 races of next season will be interesting, seeing how the dynamics on the track between the two McLaren drivers evolves.. Who will stand out from the other?

I'm certainly interested in that too. And McLaren must be, they certainly have no reason to back one driver over the other for the first several races of the season, so it's a big opportunity for Piastri to show what he can do.

Of course, it's possible he simply won't be as fast as Lando! Although I've followed him through his junior career and he's been stellar, he has the same sort of junior career success that LH & CLC share, amongst other top drivers current and past in F1. Not all high flying junior drivers convert well to F1 of course, it's never guaranteed. Just.. likely.

[Fire99]

TheDeuce said:

I'm certainly interested in that too. And McLaren must be, they certainly have no reason to back one driver over the other for the first several races of the season, so it's a big opportunity for Piastri to show what he can do.

Of course, it's possible he simply won't be as fast as Lando! Although I've followed him through his junior career and he's been stellar, he has the same sort of junior career success that LH & CLC share, amongst other top drivers current and past in F1. Not all high flying junior drivers convert well to F1 of course, it's never guaranteed. Just.. likely.

Piastri certainly seem to have the potential and has already shown some moments of flair but there have been plenty shining stars didn't shine as brightly as expected. Interesting times..

[thegreenhell]

Piastri just looks like another Stoffel Vandoorne to me. Lots of junior promise but unexciting, and generally not quite fast enough. The only reason he's as close to Lando as he is this year is because he's made fewer mistakes. He's usually behind on pace.

[Chamon_Lee]

thegreenhell said:

Piastri just looks like another Stoffel Vandoorne to me. Lots of junior promise but unexciting, and generally not quite fast enough. The only reason he's as close to Lando as he is this year is because he's made fewer mistakes. He's usually behind on pace.

I think that is a little unfair.

[cuprabob]

Chamon_Lee said:

thegreenhell said:

Piastri just looks like another Stoffel Vandoorne to me. Lots of junior promise but unexciting, and generally not quite fast enough. The only reason he's as close to Lando as he is this year is because he's made fewer mistakes. He's usually behind on pace.

I think that is a little unfair.

Agreed, some of his overtakes have been pretty good.

[Fire99]

cuprabob said:

Chamon_Lee said:

thegreenhell said:

Piastri just looks like another Stoffel Vandoorne to me. Lots of junior promise but unexciting, and generally not quite fast enough. The only reason he's as close to Lando as he is this year is because he's made fewer mistakes. He's usually behind on pace.

I think that is a little unfair.

Agreed, some of his overtakes have been pretty good.

Yup. I think it's too early to make a fully informed opinion but I think he's shown enough impressive moments to be encouraged at this stage.

[DOCG]

Lando Norris is like the Jack Lisowski of F1

Has a lot of flares, but lacks hugely in consistency. Also people don't realise that if he was going to accomplish anything great, he would have started doing it by now.

[carinaman]

I've not read the article, perhaps it's clickbait hype for the next GP as the Driver's Championship has been won and Formula Netflix compatible, but if Verstappen said that he'd be correct:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/articles/c170...


Papaya Rules. Papaya Fools.

I am sad. In a previous B2B sales job I dealt with McLaren, Williams and Kenny Roberts Racing. I've kept a used envelope from McLaren that had their franking mark on it. A colleague also got a Shell Ferrari sticker for me while I was in that job.

[Muzzer79]

DOCG said:

Lando Norris is like the Jack Lisowski of F1

Also people don't realise that if he was going to accomplish anything great, he would have started doing it by now.

What 'great' things do you think he should have started doing with a McLaren that has only been on the pace for the last 17 races (of which he won 20%) ?

[paulguitar]

Muzzer79 said:

DOCG said:

Lando Norris is like the Jack Lisowski of F1

Also people don't realise that if he was going to accomplish anything great, he would have started doing it by now.

What 'great' things do you think he should have started doing with a McLaren that has only been on the pace for the last 17 races (of which he won 20%) ?

Yep, he only won for the first time earlier this season. He could achieve a lot from here.

Edited by paulguitar on Saturday 30th November 11:02

[DOCG]

Muzzer79 said:

What 'great' things do you think he should have started doing with a McLaren that has only been on the pace for the last 17 races (of which he won 20%) ?

Won more than 2/7 from pole. Jack Lisowski has won 0/6 ranking finals.