Discussion
ralphrj said:
Jake899 said:
No one has a shot at Red Bull while Max and Horner are there.
Lando's sliding doors moment is McLaren binning Stoffel Vandoorne to take up their option on him.McLaren signed up Norris as a junior driver in early 2017 but needed to secure an F1 race seat for him in 2019 or their option on him would expire. The only option was at Toro Rosso but Red Bull wouldn't allow McLaren to place Norris there on loan. They wanted Norris long term and hoped that McLaren would allow their option to lapse. McLaren let Vandoorne go and took up the option on Norris.
If they had let him go them Norris would have gone to Toro Rosso instead of Alex Albon and presumably would have been promoted to the Red Bull team in place of Gasly in the second half of the season.
I think he's a good racer, quick and gets great pace out of the package he has. I did notice after the bad crash at Spa last year in qualifying in the wet, when he could and was looking like getting pole, he appeared (to me) a little bit more tentative in the next race. It was as if the wind was taken out of him (literally!). Two races later though it was a McLaren 1 - 2 at Monza
He appears to be on it again now though. I really hope McLaren get a competitive car for him or he gets a seat in a car that has the potential to win the Championship. He’s hugely likeable, would be/is a good ambassador for the sport, has a good social media presence, not afraid to bring up mental health issues, and as another contributor said he’s one driver even my daughter knows! She’s 19.
Edited by FrankieBee on Tuesday 26th July 14:16
I said on the previous page and he did it again in France. He’s just scared/frightened at the start of races. Alonso and GR just went straight past him. It’s all well and good saying he doesn’t get involved in crashes but it is no good if he’s always losing out at the start.
He’s clearly a really nice guy but he doesn’t show any of that belief that he’s capable of winning and/or winning consistently. At the end of last season where he started at the front with LH and MV, Rosberg asked him what he was going to do and he basically said ‘Stay the heck out of they way.’ Rosberg told him he should be in there fighting and trying to win. Felt like two quite different mindsets… Needless to say Lanod just bailed immediately.
Nice guy and quick but no champion IMO.
He’s clearly a really nice guy but he doesn’t show any of that belief that he’s capable of winning and/or winning consistently. At the end of last season where he started at the front with LH and MV, Rosberg asked him what he was going to do and he basically said ‘Stay the heck out of they way.’ Rosberg told him he should be in there fighting and trying to win. Felt like two quite different mindsets… Needless to say Lanod just bailed immediately.
Nice guy and quick but no champion IMO.
Frimley111R said:
I said on the previous page and he did it again in France. He’s just scared/frightened at the start of races. Alonso and GR just went straight past him. It’s all well and good saying he doesn’t get involved in crashes but it is no good if he’s always losing out at the start.
He’s clearly a really nice guy but he doesn’t show any of that belief that he’s capable of winning and/or winning consistently. At the end of last season where he started at the front with LH and MV, Rosberg asked him what he was going to do and he basically said ‘Stay the heck out of they way.’ Rosberg told him he should be in there fighting and trying to win. Felt like two quite different mindsets… Needless to say Lanod just bailed immediately.
Nice guy and quick but no champion IMO.
I think picking your fights is a good trait and why try and get involved in a WDC fight when your'e not in it.He’s clearly a really nice guy but he doesn’t show any of that belief that he’s capable of winning and/or winning consistently. At the end of last season where he started at the front with LH and MV, Rosberg asked him what he was going to do and he basically said ‘Stay the heck out of they way.’ Rosberg told him he should be in there fighting and trying to win. Felt like two quite different mindsets… Needless to say Lanod just bailed immediately.
Nice guy and quick but no champion IMO.
I'm sure if there was any low flying fruit to be picked from the situation he would have taken it, but why put it all on the line when it's not your fight!!
Rosberg can sday what he likes now. He's won his WDC and he bailed out big time. Easy for him to put his oar in when he as well, is not in the fight.
super7 said:
Frimley111R said:
I said on the previous page and he did it again in France. He’s just scared/frightened at the start of races. Alonso and GR just went straight past him. It’s all well and good saying he doesn’t get involved in crashes but it is no good if he’s always losing out at the start.
He’s clearly a really nice guy but he doesn’t show any of that belief that he’s capable of winning and/or winning consistently. At the end of last season where he started at the front with LH and MV, Rosberg asked him what he was going to do and he basically said ‘Stay the heck out of they way.’ Rosberg told him he should be in there fighting and trying to win. Felt like two quite different mindsets… Needless to say Lanod just bailed immediately.
Nice guy and quick but no champion IMO.
I think picking your fights is a good trait and why try and get involved in a WDC fight when your'e not in it.He’s clearly a really nice guy but he doesn’t show any of that belief that he’s capable of winning and/or winning consistently. At the end of last season where he started at the front with LH and MV, Rosberg asked him what he was going to do and he basically said ‘Stay the heck out of they way.’ Rosberg told him he should be in there fighting and trying to win. Felt like two quite different mindsets… Needless to say Lanod just bailed immediately.
Nice guy and quick but no champion IMO.
I'm sure if there was any low flying fruit to be picked from the situation he would have taken it, but why put it all on the line when it's not your fight!!
Rosberg can say what he likes now. He's won his WDC and he bailed out big time. Easy for him to put his oar in when he as well, is not in the fight.
Frimley111R said:
super7 said:
Frimley111R said:
I said on the previous page and he did it again in France. He’s just scared/frightened at the start of races. Alonso and GR just went straight past him. It’s all well and good saying he doesn’t get involved in crashes but it is no good if he’s always losing out at the start.
He’s clearly a really nice guy but he doesn’t show any of that belief that he’s capable of winning and/or winning consistently. At the end of last season where he started at the front with LH and MV, Rosberg asked him what he was going to do and he basically said ‘Stay the heck out of they way.’ Rosberg told him he should be in there fighting and trying to win. Felt like two quite different mindsets… Needless to say Lanod just bailed immediately.
Nice guy and quick but no champion IMO.
I think picking your fights is a good trait and why try and get involved in a WDC fight when your'e not in it.He’s clearly a really nice guy but he doesn’t show any of that belief that he’s capable of winning and/or winning consistently. At the end of last season where he started at the front with LH and MV, Rosberg asked him what he was going to do and he basically said ‘Stay the heck out of they way.’ Rosberg told him he should be in there fighting and trying to win. Felt like two quite different mindsets… Needless to say Lanod just bailed immediately.
Nice guy and quick but no champion IMO.
I'm sure if there was any low flying fruit to be picked from the situation he would have taken it, but why put it all on the line when it's not your fight!!
Rosberg can say what he likes now. He's won his WDC and he bailed out big time. Easy for him to put his oar in when he as well, is not in the fight.
It's not ALL about the race win!
Frimley111R said:
super7 said:
Frimley111R said:
I said on the previous page and he did it again in France. He’s just scared/frightened at the start of races. Alonso and GR just went straight past him. It’s all well and good saying he doesn’t get involved in crashes but it is no good if he’s always losing out at the start.
He’s clearly a really nice guy but he doesn’t show any of that belief that he’s capable of winning and/or winning consistently. At the end of last season where he started at the front with LH and MV, Rosberg asked him what he was going to do and he basically said ‘Stay the heck out of they way.’ Rosberg told him he should be in there fighting and trying to win. Felt like two quite different mindsets… Needless to say Lanod just bailed immediately.
Nice guy and quick but no champion IMO.
I think picking your fights is a good trait and why try and get involved in a WDC fight when your'e not in it.He’s clearly a really nice guy but he doesn’t show any of that belief that he’s capable of winning and/or winning consistently. At the end of last season where he started at the front with LH and MV, Rosberg asked him what he was going to do and he basically said ‘Stay the heck out of they way.’ Rosberg told him he should be in there fighting and trying to win. Felt like two quite different mindsets… Needless to say Lanod just bailed immediately.
Nice guy and quick but no champion IMO.
I'm sure if there was any low flying fruit to be picked from the situation he would have taken it, but why put it all on the line when it's not your fight!!
Rosberg can say what he likes now. He's won his WDC and he bailed out big time. Easy for him to put his oar in when he as well, is not in the fight.
Frimley111R said:
It was an F1 race. His job is to try to win it. He had nothing to lose and they had everything to lose.
Well, he could get written off and then not have any opportunity to score any points...... Which I think for their team is vital at this stage.As they say, the points get handed out at the end of the race, no point crashing out on Lap 1
Frimley111R said:
super7 said:
Frimley111R said:
I said on the previous page and he did it again in France. He’s just scared/frightened at the start of races. Alonso and GR just went straight past him. It’s all well and good saying he doesn’t get involved in crashes but it is no good if he’s always losing out at the start.
He’s clearly a really nice guy but he doesn’t show any of that belief that he’s capable of winning and/or winning consistently. At the end of last season where he started at the front with LH and MV, Rosberg asked him what he was going to do and he basically said ‘Stay the heck out of they way.’ Rosberg told him he should be in there fighting and trying to win. Felt like two quite different mindsets… Needless to say Lanod just bailed immediately.
Nice guy and quick but no champion IMO.
I think picking your fights is a good trait and why try and get involved in a WDC fight when your'e not in it.He’s clearly a really nice guy but he doesn’t show any of that belief that he’s capable of winning and/or winning consistently. At the end of last season where he started at the front with LH and MV, Rosberg asked him what he was going to do and he basically said ‘Stay the heck out of they way.’ Rosberg told him he should be in there fighting and trying to win. Felt like two quite different mindsets… Needless to say Lanod just bailed immediately.
Nice guy and quick but no champion IMO.
I'm sure if there was any low flying fruit to be picked from the situation he would have taken it, but why put it all on the line when it's not your fight!!
Rosberg can say what he likes now. He's won his WDC and he bailed out big time. Easy for him to put his oar in when he as well, is not in the fight.
super7 said:
Yes his job is to try and win it...... but there's also a huge team, money from winnings and lot's of other things that get in the way of that 'Try and Win it'..... So when you are racing for a position in the championship which is worth another $x million , your team boss is going to be pretty pissed if you get involved and screw that up.
It's not ALL about the race win!
Sorry, but in that case it was. Can you imagine what it would have done for team morale and points etc if he'd had fought them or even won? F1 is full of drivers playing it safe and getting a few points. That's fine of course, if you're happy to make up the numbers, win nothing and enjoy the scenery. It's not ALL about the race win!
But...nice guy though he is and fast though he is, he shows none of the WC level or bravey and determination that put LH, MV, NR and many others at the top of the WDC.
Frimley111R said:
super7 said:
Yes his job is to try and win it...... but there's also a huge team, money from winnings and lot's of other things that get in the way of that 'Try and Win it'..... So when you are racing for a position in the championship which is worth another $x million , your team boss is going to be pretty pissed if you get involved and screw that up.
It's not ALL about the race win!
Sorry, but in that case it was. Can you imagine what it would have done for team morale and points etc if he'd had fought them or even won? F1 is full of drivers playing it safe and getting a few points. That's fine of course, if you're happy to make up the numbers, win nothing and enjoy the scenery. It's not ALL about the race win!
But...nice guy though he is and fast though he is, he shows none of the WC level or bravey and determination that put LH, MV, NR and many others at the top of the WDC.
Bravery? Eau Rouge last year..... that was Bravery!!!!!
Frimley111R said:
It was an F1 race. His job is to try to win it. He had nothing to lose and they had everything to lose. It was a great opportunity and he patently failed to take it. Yes, it's easy for Rosberg to say 'Get in there' but you could see him thinking 'WTF, you sound like you daren't get involved.' The fight was for the race in and he was in P2 (or P3).
If he had the car to win I’d agree but he didn’t. He came 5th behind the much better performing cars of Mercedes and Red Bull. He did his job and got the best out of the car and the max amount of points for the team. I assume your talking about the Styrian GP 2021. Start here: https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/video.2021-styr...
FrankieBee said:
If he had the car to win I’d agree but he didn’t. He came 5th behind the much better performing cars of Mercedes and Red Bull. He did his job and got the best out of the car and the max amount of points for the team.
I assume your talking about the Styrian GP 2021. Start here: https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/video.2021-styr...
He could have overdriven and crashed, screwed his tyres, had a collision, killed an engine, etc... He took the points and a calculated position that reduced the 100% risk/0% reward.I assume your talking about the Styrian GP 2021. Start here: https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/video.2021-styr...
PhilAsia said:
FrankieBee said:
If he had the car to win I’d agree but he didn’t. He came 5th behind the much better performing cars of Mercedes and Red Bull. He did his job and got the best out of the car and the max amount of points for the team.
I assume your talking about the Styrian GP 2021. Start here: https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/video.2021-styr...
He could have overdriven and crashed, screwed his tyres, had a collision, killed an engine, etc... He took the points and a calculated position that reduced the 100% risk/0% reward.I assume your talking about the Styrian GP 2021. Start here: https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/video.2021-styr...
Frimley111R said:
Sorry, but in that case it was. Can you imagine what it would have done for team morale and points etc if he'd had fought them or even won? F1 is full of drivers playing it safe and getting a few points. That's fine of course, if you're happy to make up the numbers, win nothing and enjoy the scenery.
But...nice guy though he is and fast though he is, he shows none of the WC level or bravey and determination that put LH, MV, NR and many others at the top of the WDC.
He was never in the fight to win the race, even if he manages to get to 2nd off the start he'd have 2 laps in that position at most watching a Ferrari/Red Bull drive away into the distance and as soon as the DRS is enabled he then gets to watch the other Ferrari/Red Bull come past him and also clear off into the distance. But...nice guy though he is and fast though he is, he shows none of the WC level or bravey and determination that put LH, MV, NR and many others at the top of the WDC.
It doesn't matter who the driver is, if the car isn't good enough he isn't going to be fighting to win the race.
MustangGT said:
I personally don't think it far away from us having an all Brit podium, and I do not care about the order. I think it possible Lando could go to Mercedes after Lewis retires. Red Bull? No chance Lando would sign as a number 2. Ferrari, I doubt it.
1968 US Grand Prix since the last all British podium ...I have the distinct impression that Norris is being way too hard on himself and suffering as a result; for whatever reason he gave himself a bit of a kicking after a couple of 2nd places in Canada and Spain and has seemed a little deflated since. There's no doubt that some dodgy strategy calls from the team have played a part, but his bad starts seem to be eating away at him too - as well as affecting his race results.
It's a shame as he's definitely champion material, but does he possess the ultimate mental strength to pull it off? For me - as things stand at any rate - Oscar Piastri seems the stronger of the two McLaren drivers, and the driver that will be the biggest threat to Verstappen as the season goes on.
Thoughts?
It's a shame as he's definitely champion material, but does he possess the ultimate mental strength to pull it off? For me - as things stand at any rate - Oscar Piastri seems the stronger of the two McLaren drivers, and the driver that will be the biggest threat to Verstappen as the season goes on.
Thoughts?
Yes, I have had similar thoughts which I’ve relayed in other F1 related threads.
It’s good be somewhat self critical and motivated to do better, but I agree that he’s taking this a little far. I think he would be a better driver to relax just a tad, roll with it and not dwell on every little mistake. He’s got the speed and ability but so has Oscar (with an extra helping of calm composure), and it may well come down to mental strength and stamina for superiority with the McLaren team over the next couple of seasons.
It’s good be somewhat self critical and motivated to do better, but I agree that he’s taking this a little far. I think he would be a better driver to relax just a tad, roll with it and not dwell on every little mistake. He’s got the speed and ability but so has Oscar (with an extra helping of calm composure), and it may well come down to mental strength and stamina for superiority with the McLaren team over the next couple of seasons.
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