Discussion
thegreenhell said:
It's interesting to read the story of his father's adventure into F1.
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/remarkable-stor...
Shows how much the sport has changed too, imagine a 38 year old man with no racing experience getting into an F1 car 4 years later now, no chance!https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/remarkable-stor...
Fairplay to Nissany Snr, I am not even a little jealous at all, nope, not one bit
thegreenhell said:
TheDeuce said:
I would guess that since their latest test pilot has been promised a practice session at three circuits, and also sponsorship on the car itself, it's probably £10m+. That's a lot of seat time and exposure...
That's three very expensive trackdays he's bought.I read or saw an interview with Claire Williams recently where she said they had a better budget for 2020 than they had for 2019, despite losing some sponsors, although she conceded that that was in part due to the sale of WAE.
Driving a current F1 car in a genuine practice session at an actual Grand Prix weekend is going to be very hard to top on the boasting front even if you are the worst driver in the worst car .... and let's face it he'll be better than his dad was
Mark-C said:
thegreenhell said:
TheDeuce said:
I would guess that since their latest test pilot has been promised a practice session at three circuits, and also sponsorship on the car itself, it's probably £10m+. That's a lot of seat time and exposure...
That's three very expensive trackdays he's bought.I read or saw an interview with Claire Williams recently where she said they had a better budget for 2020 than they had for 2019, despite losing some sponsors, although she conceded that that was in part due to the sale of WAE.
Driving a current F1 car in a genuine practice session at an actual Grand Prix weekend is going to be very hard to top on the boasting front even if you are the worst driver in the worst car .... and let's face it he'll be better than his dad was
I obviously don't really know how much nissany paid, but I do know that each time Williams do this kind of thing they devalue and embarrass themselves a little so it has to be serious and life saving money. Otherwise... They wouldn't be saying yes to these joke drivers.
And I cringe at Claire giving them positive PR introductions each time. I appreciate she has no choice but it's awkward to read her words.
Mark-C said:
thegreenhell said:
TheDeuce said:
I would guess that since their latest test pilot has been promised a practice session at three circuits, and also sponsorship on the car itself, it's probably £10m+. That's a lot of seat time and exposure...
That's three very expensive trackdays he's bought.I read or saw an interview with Claire Williams recently where she said they had a better budget for 2020 than they had for 2019, despite losing some sponsors, although she conceded that that was in part due to the sale of WAE.
Driving a current F1 car in a genuine practice session at an actual Grand Prix weekend is going to be very hard to top on the boasting front even if you are the worst driver in the worst car .... and let's face it he'll be better than his dad was
skwdenyer said:
Is it really any worse than buying a seat on Virgin Galactic, or more extremely a loop around the Moon with SpaceX? Lots-of-money-can-buy experiences for the well-heeled few. F1 was always the stamping ground of richly-funded experience-chasers; it doesn't seem all that wrong that it could still be so.
Yes, much worse. It’s supposed to be a competitive sport! I’d be all for them selling experiences, hiring Silverstone and letting them thrash around at a non race event.
But at a Grand Prix, no thanks. If teams don’t need the practice session, maybe they should reduce them and stick something more interesting on instead - like a 25% distance race for example.
The_Nugget said:
skwdenyer said:
Is it really any worse than buying a seat on Virgin Galactic, or more extremely a loop around the Moon with SpaceX? Lots-of-money-can-buy experiences for the well-heeled few. F1 was always the stamping ground of richly-funded experience-chasers; it doesn't seem all that wrong that it could still be so.
Yes, much worse. It’s supposed to be a competitive sport! I’d be all for them selling experiences, hiring Silverstone and letting them thrash around at a non race event.
But at a Grand Prix, no thanks. If teams don’t need the practice session, maybe they should reduce them and stick something more interesting on instead - like a 25% distance race for example.
From an F1 teams point of view, it's nothing to proud of. But as I have said a few times, they have no option right now, so I can't criticise them for taking the £££.
None of this seat selling has any effect on the teams long term plans, but in the here and now, 'today', what else are they supposed to do?
As of right now, Williams are doing everything possible short of putting the team up for sale. In my opinion it is better to sell sooner rather than later, but in the end it is in every way their business... They can't ever be criticised in how they treat a team/business they created.
TheDeuce said:
I would guess that since their latest test pilot has been promised a practice session at three circuits, and also sponsorship on the car itself, it's probably £10m+. That's a lot of seat time and exposure...
Doubt it’s as much as that, Bobby K was reported to have brought around 15m, can’t remember whether that was pounds or dollars... Full season plus Orlen on the car. Makes me wonder how much Rokit are paying for title sponsorship, and how much less it is than what Martini were paying.
HustleRussell said:
Doubt it’s as much as that, Bobby K was reported to have brought around 15m, can’t remember whether that was pounds or dollars... Full season plus Orlen on the car.
Makes me wonder how much Rokit are paying for title sponsorship, and how much less it is than what Martini were paying.
I think a little over £11m, so perhaps $15mMakes me wonder how much Rokit are paying for title sponsorship, and how much less it is than what Martini were paying.
I can't see that the two are comparable. RK was a returning and credible driver that bought a wave of positive PR with him, no doubt helping to reinforce and retain other sponsors confidence. He added value.
Nissany having three joy rides this season doesn't add any value, so I would expect him to pay more relative to the seat time he gets out of it. No offense to the guy, I'm sure he's way more talented than I behind the wheel... But he also effectively finished last in F2 last season so it's totally unrealistic to imagine his input is of value to Williams over and above their regular drivers.
As for the exact figure, we can't know and I accept I may be totally wrong...
geeks said:
thegreenhell said:
It's interesting to read the story of his father's adventure into F1.
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/remarkable-stor...
Shows how much the sport has changed too, imagine a 38 year old man with no racing experience getting into an F1 car 4 years later now, no chance!https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/remarkable-stor...
Fairplay to Nissany Snr, I am not even a little jealous at all, nope, not one bit
As regards Williams aren't all the announcements meaning that live is looking up? Hopefully this year they will at least get to the first test with a working car!
Tyre Smoke said:
It is clear that there is either a plan to sell the team as a going concern as a future B team, or because of Frank's intransigence, the team will die.
Patrick Head would make an excellent CEO of a 'Williams' B team.
Or do they drop a formula to F2?
I can't see they'd ever drop to f2 - Williams are very much focused on engineering, not buying in solutions, so don't think a one make, spec, formula is their sort of thing at all.Patrick Head would make an excellent CEO of a 'Williams' B team.
Or do they drop a formula to F2?
Chrisgr31 said:
As regards Williams aren't all the announcements meaning that live is looking up? Hopefully this year they will at least get to the first test with a working car!
Depends how you look at it, it's good for them and us that they have found enough to sell to (I assume) plug the hole in their budget so they can get through 2020. On the other hand, it feels like without enough money to survive AND also effect major changes, this is just dragging out the inevitable at this point. They can't forever build just a technically qualifying car, sell seat time and run around at the back - the remaining sponsors will tire of that soon enough.I'd be very surprised if the car wasn't ready on time, on the basis it's just an evolutionary year so the car already effectively exits. A few tweaks and hopefully some improvements aside, I can't see any reason it wouldn't be ready on time and meet the regulations this time.
Maybe they’ll just chuck out the 2020 car as a small update and have been channeling all their energy into the 2021 car and take some risks with creative interpretations of the rules. Wouldn’t be the first time a team has turned up with something different and blown everyone away. Otherwise seems difficult to see how they will survive as perennial back markers.
Deesee said:
5th biggest budget on the grid..
2017/2018/2019 design team have a few questions to answer IMO.
It's not the budget. It's that the budget doesn't remotely fit the size of the team, or their ambitions to remain constructors - it hasn't remotely fitted either for all the years you list 2017/2018/2019 design team have a few questions to answer IMO.
If they ran a micro team, and built cars akin to how HAAS do, their budget would indeed be perfectly OK. As it is, they're by far the poorest team in terms of 'money for the car' on the grid. For reference, in 2018, HAAS had 250 employees and a budget of $130m. Williams had a budget of $150m, but 630 employees! And since then, Williams have struggled further to maintain even that budget, yet the last I remember Claire said they now had 700 employees on the F1 side last year...Which is just weird. Possibly they had moved some talent over from WAE ahead of selling it.
You can see it doesn't really add up - whatever the design team are capable of.
Teddy Lop said:
where'd you see that? Speculation I see paints it as less .
5th sounds about right to me. Although the exact budgets for some teams are not accurately known publicly.. So in reality they could in fact be 6th/7th due to inaccuracies. No one knows their 2019/20 figures yet, nor their final budget for this 20/21 year.This is 2018. A lot of the numbers are from public accounts, others are estimated, all explained in the report page 1:
https://www.racefans.net/2018/12/19/how-much-f1-te...
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