The Official F1 2020 silly season *contains speculation*

The Official F1 2020 silly season *contains speculation*

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Discussion

thegreenhell

6,108 posts

164 months

Sunday 1st September
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TheDeuce said:
I see Ferrari as looking increasingly old fashioned tbh. The way they do things, the way they rule their team and place personal blame on key figures for what is far more likely to be symptomatic of a wider cultural problem in the team just doesn't fly these days. Not just in F1, but in business in general. They don't appear to be a unified force, they never did but nowadays others are proving that unification does breed results and in terms of F1, better race-craft when under pressure.

I may be wrong in my assertions - but that team still has a whiff of serious dictatorship about it. Bernie would approve but the results disagree.
People have been saying that for the last 50 years.

TheDeuce

2,797 posts

11 months

Sunday 1st September
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thegreenhell said:
TheDeuce said:
I see Ferrari as looking increasingly old fashioned tbh. The way they do things, the way they rule their team and place personal blame on key figures for what is far more likely to be symptomatic of a wider cultural problem in the team just doesn't fly these days. Not just in F1, but in business in general. They don't appear to be a unified force, they never did but nowadays others are proving that unification does breed results and in terms of F1, better race-craft when under pressure.

I may be wrong in my assertions - but that team still has a whiff of serious dictatorship about it. Bernie would approve but the results disagree.
People have been saying that for the last 50 years.
Well, extended timescales don't tend to help when the criticism in the first place was that they were old fashioned.

Seriously, look at how much the world has changed in the last decade alone. That's spread through the culture of business and sport too.

MissChief

5,110 posts

113 months

Sunday 1st September
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Ferrari still has that allure of being 'the' team in Formula 1. They're the only team that's been there since the start and there's still a draw of racing in Red for just about every F1 driver past, present and future.

Having said that, those that have been in Red in F1 have said in the past that behind the scenes all isn't rosy, although this does appear to be changing recently. Lots of politics, vying for power and favour and lots of cliques, supporters of particular people within the team and lots of back stabbing to get ahead, especially rampant in the 2000's when everyone was clamouring to get attributed as responsible for some of the success. If Hamilton was offered a seat there I suspect he'd jump at the chance if he thought they had a winning car. I did wonder if a Vettel/Hamilton swap might have been on the cards at one point. Mercedes get a German Multiple World Champion, Ferrari get a very successful British driver (echoes of 'il Leone' from when Mansell drove for them would no doubt be thrown around) who seems able to extract the maximum out of any package, often more than it should be capable of.

slipstream 1985

6,535 posts

124 months

Sunday 1st September
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Antonio Giovinazzi needs to be dropped. imagine alfa had a half decent driver in there with Kimi they could be 5th best team

Dermot O'Logical

668 posts

74 months

Sunday 1st September
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slipstream 1985 said:
Antonio Giovinazzi needs to be dropped. imagine alfa had a half decent driver in there with Kimi they could be 5th best team
It's hard to argue with this. I suspect that he's only there because he's available, cheap, and keeping the seat warm for Mick Schumacher.

DanielSan

14,361 posts

112 months

Sunday 1st September
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Dermot O'Logical said:
It's hard to argue with this. I suspect that he's only there because he's available, cheap, and keeping the seat warm for Mick Schumacher.
He deserved a proper chance in F1 after a couple of weird races when he was on cover duty. This year was the best chance he could hope for to impress, no real pressure in the Sauber team and up against a proven driver, but he's been well and truly outclassed by his team mate whose now in F1 purely as a hobby that comes with the bonus of a nice pile of cash.

ELUSIVEJIM

6,652 posts

96 months

Monday 2nd September
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slipstream 1985 said:
Antonio Giovinazzi needs to be dropped. imagine alfa had a half decent driver in there with Kimi they could be 5th best team
It's stated that Hulkenberg will be in at Haas alongside Magnussen so if that's the case Grosjean could be a good driver for Alfa to take on.

But saying that they do have Kimi who is experienced so perhaps want someone younger.

Perhaps they should give Kyvat a call. I am sure he still wakes up with night sweats wondering if he is driving in 2020.

groomi

9,194 posts

188 months

Monday 2nd September
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ELUSIVEJIM said:
Perhaps they should give Kyvat a call. I am sure he still wakes up with night sweats wondering if he is driving in 2020.
I was watching the 3 RB 2nd seat contenders with interest at Spa...

Albon should have had the quickest of the three cars and the poor starting position wasn't his fault, but I thought he took a long time to work his way through the field and lucked into 5th at the end. But, it was a new car and team to him, so it's only natural to take a little time to gel.

Kvyat had yet another solid race. He pulled off some good, but safe moves, got a good result and beat his teammate while only being a few seconds behind Albons superior Red Bull.

Gasley was a little underwhelming and was lucky to be gifted some points at the end, but again, some lenience should be factored in for the unfamiliar car and that he's probably not in the best mindset at present.

So with all that taken into account, I would say that none of the three clearly stood out above the others, and on that basis for this race I'd say Kvyat was top of the pile on account of doing exactly what he had to do, exactly what he was realistically expected to do and that it is exactly that quality which RB have been lacking in the no.2 car. It will be interesting to see how things develop in the next few races.

StevieBee

7,877 posts

200 months

Monday 2nd September
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groomi said:
Albon should have had the quickest of the three cars and the poor starting position wasn't his fault, but I thought he took a long time to work his way through the field and lucked into 5th at the end. But, it was a new car and team to him, so it's only natural to take a little time to gel.
Wasn't he on the slower tyres at the start?

Those moves on Riccardo and Perez were pretty ballsy though.

Vaud

Original Poster:

33,183 posts

100 months

Monday 2nd September
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groomi said:
Gasley was a little underwhelming and was lucky to be gifted some points at the end, but again, some lenience should be factored in for the unfamiliar car and that he's probably not in the best mindset at present.
To be fair to Gasly...

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/gasly-hubert-de...

ELUSIVEJIM

6,652 posts

96 months

Monday 2nd September
quotequote all
groomi said:
I was watching the 3 RB 2nd seat contenders with interest at Spa...

Albon should have had the quickest of the three cars and the poor starting position wasn't his fault, but I thought he took a long time to work his way through the field and lucked into 5th at the end. But, it was a new car and team to him, so it's only natural to take a little time to gel.

Kvyat had yet another solid race. He pulled off some good, but safe moves, got a good result and beat his teammate while only being a few seconds behind Albons superior Red Bull.

Gasley was a little underwhelming and was lucky to be gifted some points at the end, but again, some lenience should be factored in for the unfamiliar car and that he's probably not in the best mindset at present.

So with all that taken into account, I would say that none of the three clearly stood out above the others, and on that basis for this race I'd say Kvyat was top of the pile on account of doing exactly what he had to do, exactly what he was realistically expected to do and that it is exactly that quality which RB have been lacking in the no.2 car. It will be interesting to see how things develop in the next few races.
Albon stated the medium tyres were his problem. Just couldn't get them to work but he felt much better on the softs when they changed after his first stint.

I am sure one of the Toro Rosso's was on the softs in the first stint but not sure if both were as Kvyat had the penalty to take.

ajprice

16,427 posts

141 months

Monday 2nd September
quotequote all
groomi said:
I was watching the 3 RB 2nd seat contenders with interest at Spa...

Albon should have had the quickest of the three cars and the poor starting position wasn't his fault, but I thought he took a long time to work his way through the field and lucked into 5th at the end. But, it was a new car and team to him, so it's only natural to take a little time to gel.

Kvyat had yet another solid race. He pulled off some good, but safe moves, got a good result and beat his teammate while only being a few seconds behind Albons superior Red Bull.
Albon said after the race that the car was much better on soft tyres at the end than the medium tyres he started on, and that the team told him that before the race. He wanted to know why the car was so different, and get it fixed for the future. Ok so Norris was fifth until the end, but he got through the 'class 2' cars to the back of the Merc/Ferrari cars. The next race should be a better comparison though, without any penalty and hopefully Max in the race with him.

768

4,929 posts

41 months

Monday 2nd September
quotequote all
Vaud said:
groomi said:
Gasley was a little underwhelming and was lucky to be gifted some points at the end, but again, some lenience should be factored in for the unfamiliar car and that he's probably not in the best mindset at present.
To be fair to Gasly...

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/gasly-hubert-de...
I thought Gaseleye was doing quite well initially, IIRC there was one point when he was the furthest RB/TR driver up the road.

Then they pitted him early and I didn't see him again, no idea why.

MissChief

5,110 posts

113 months

Monday 2nd September
quotequote all
768 said:
Vaud said:
groomi said:
Gasley was a little underwhelming and was lucky to be gifted some points at the end, but again, some lenience should be factored in for the unfamiliar car and that he's probably not in the best mindset at present.
To be fair to Gasly...

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/gasly-hubert-de...
I thought Gaseleye was doing quite well initially, IIRC there was one point when he was the furthest RB/TR driver up the road.

Then they pitted him early and I didn't see him again, no idea why.
I thought Gaseously drive a decent race given how close he was to Hubert.

LaurasOtherHalf

15,416 posts

141 months

Tuesday 3rd September
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ELUSIVEJIM said:
It's stated that Hulkenberg will be in at Haas alongside Magnussen so if that's the case Grosjean could be a good driver for Alfa to take on.

But saying that they do have Kimi who is experienced so perhaps want someone younger.

Perhaps they should give Kyvat a call. I am sure he still wakes up with night sweats wondering if he is driving in 2020.
That second Alfa seat belongs to Ferrari though doesn’t it? They’ll basically have whoever Ferrari demands is in it.

Can’t help thinking GIO’s best place is in the Ferrari sim however where he did such good work previously.

Still not convinced about Mick Schumacher, we saw him in the F2/3 Paddock over the weekend and I normally wouldn’t hesitate in approaching a driver at an appropriate time but, you just got the feeling he didn’t want to be there at all. Certainly not engaging with the fans.


housen

1,587 posts

137 months

Tuesday 3rd September
quotequote all
LaurasOtherHalf said:
ELUSIVEJIM said:
It's stated that Hulkenberg will be in at Haas alongside Magnussen so if that's the case Grosjean could be a good driver for Alfa to take on.

But saying that they do have Kimi who is experienced so perhaps want someone younger.

Perhaps they should give Kyvat a call. I am sure he still wakes up with night sweats wondering if he is driving in 2020.
That second Alfa seat belongs to Ferrari though doesn’t it? They’ll basically have whoever Ferrari demands is in it.

Can’t help thinking GIO’s best place is in the Ferrari sim however where he did such good work previously.

Still not convinced about Mick Schumacher, we saw him in the F2/3 Paddock over the weekend and I normally wouldn’t hesitate in approaching a driver at an appropriate time but, you just got the feeling he didn’t want to be there at all. Certainly not engaging with the fans.
was this before of after one of his mates died though ?

davidd

5,969 posts

229 months

Tuesday 3rd September
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housen said:
was this before of after one of his mates died though ?
We saw him and Giuliano Alesi in the f1 paddock on Sunday, they were both given lots of space.

Vaud

Original Poster:

33,183 posts

100 months

Tuesday 3rd September
quotequote all
LaurasOtherHalf said:
Still not convinced about Mick Schumacher, we saw him in the F2/3 Paddock over the weekend and I normally wouldn’t hesitate in approaching a driver at an appropriate time but, you just got the feeling he didn’t want to be there at all. Certainly not engaging with the fans.
Tough weekend for all F2 drivers. I also think Mick is being protected from the media and fans to reduce pressure. I can only imagine that some (insensitive) fans might focus questions on his dad rather than Mick.

LaurasOtherHalf

15,416 posts

141 months

Tuesday 3rd September
quotequote all
housen said:
LaurasOtherHalf said:
ELUSIVEJIM said:
It's stated that Hulkenberg will be in at Haas alongside Magnussen so if that's the case Grosjean could be a good driver for Alfa to take on.

But saying that they do have Kimi who is experienced so perhaps want someone younger.

Perhaps they should give Kyvat a call. I am sure he still wakes up with night sweats wondering if he is driving in 2020.
That second Alfa seat belongs to Ferrari though doesn’t it? They’ll basically have whoever Ferrari demands is in it.

Can’t help thinking GIO’s best place is in the Ferrari sim however where he did such good work previously.

Still not convinced about Mick Schumacher, we saw him in the F2/3 Paddock over the weekend and I normally wouldn’t hesitate in approaching a driver at an appropriate time but, you just got the feeling he didn’t want to be there at all. Certainly not engaging with the fans.
was this before of after one of his mates died though ?
Friday, so before anything that occurred on Saturday.

DanielSan

14,361 posts

112 months

Tuesday 3rd September
quotequote all
Idle thought, Hulkenberg to replace Giovanazzi at Sauber? It's got to be a better option than going to Haas.