Gasley - What's gone wrong?
Discussion
thegreenhell said:
In their current situation, Kvyat is clearly the most sensible choice for the seat. He's by far the most experienced of the bunch, and is much more mature now than he was. He also has something to prove, as it was he that was dropped to place Max in the big team.
I am pretty sure he was pitching for the seat in his post race interview......95 fiesta si said:
they already done all this with Kuvat....maybe Albon
Id be scared if i was a Toro Rosso driver and got offered a drive at RedBull, could be career ending
Kvyat got shafted IMO. He grabbed a podium in China only to be demoted for hitting Vettel twice whilst Max was waiting in the wings. Id be scared if i was a Toro Rosso driver and got offered a drive at RedBull, could be career ending
Want to see the Hockenheim room of akward to see the body language between those three!
But I agree, any driver who goes to Red Bull will need to be content with #2 status given their (not totally unjustified) fawning over Max unless they can leave him for dead. Ricciardo obviously felt the same despite his great start to 2018.
Edited by glazbagun on Monday 29th July 06:26
glazbagun said:
Kvyat got shafted IMO. He grabbed a podium in China only to be demoted for hitting Vettel twice whilst Max was waiting in the wings.
Want to see the Hockenheim room of akward to see the body language between those three!
But I agree, any driver who goes to Red Bull will need to be content with #2 status given their (not totally unjustified) fawning over Max unless they can leave him for dead. Ricciardo obviously felt the same despite his great start to 2018.
The room of awkwardness was the least awkward I've ever seen, just three drivers who were all massively happy with their result!Want to see the Hockenheim room of akward to see the body language between those three!
But I agree, any driver who goes to Red Bull will need to be content with #2 status given their (not totally unjustified) fawning over Max unless they can leave him for dead. Ricciardo obviously felt the same despite his great start to 2018.
Edited by glazbagun on Monday 29th July 06:26
Kvyat deserves the seat and it's too soon for Albon, he needs to stay at TR for at least the rest of this season before being thrown into a front(ish) running car!
thegreenhell said:
In both cases they promoted the junior driver too soon when they were taken by surprise by a senior driver leaving. It's just bad planning and poor management, as much as you can blame the incoming drivers for not performing.
This is the problem of having a junior team. Theoretically a great proving ground, but actually ties RB's hands to promoting one of only two drivers - whatever their level of experience/proof of ability. It's now proven to limit their chances at the top table - should be second in the Championship as many say above.Compare it with the situation for Mercedes when Nico retired unexpectedly - they took their time in chosing a battle-hardened no.2 who was well-proven and could be reasonably expected to step up in his new role.
If Mercedes were to pick up Max now, what would RB do? Hypothetical...but the answer should not lie in Toro Rosso.
Equilibrium25 said:
Compare it with the situation for Mercedes when Nico retired unexpectedly - they took their time in chosing a battle-hardened no.2 who was well-proven and could be reasonably expected to step up in his new role.
They did not. Nico dropped them right in it at the end of the season and at that point all the other leading drivers were contracted for the following year. They were just lucky Bottas managed to get out of his contract (can't remember if he was contracted for the following year at the time). Bottas is a good driver who is being made to look average by an outstanding driver. Same for Gasly really but then that's F1...HustleRussell said:
mcholeboy_59 said:
Question is, would be want to go back to red bull, if asked?
A racing driver who declines a racing car which is a second a lap quicker and has the potential to fight for podiums and wins is no racing driver at all IMO.thegreenhell said:
It would be worth switching Gasly and Kvyat for a while, to give Gasly time to gain more experience and rebuild his confidence in a lower pressure environment.
I agree. And by giving Kvyat a second chance, it sets a precedent that demotion doesn't have to be the end to an F1 career. Hopefully that would mean that Gasley' confidence wouldn't be quite so badly destroyed as Kvyat's was.HustleRussell said:
mcholeboy_59 said:
Question is, would be want to go back to red bull, if asked?
A racing driver who declines a racing car which is a second a lap quicker and has the potential to fight for podiums and wins is no racing driver at all IMO.There's history..
Norfolkit said:
Not sure it's just Gasly who's fighting to keep his seat, Toto seemed really pissed off with Bottas this weekend, to compound his problems Mercedes have a ready made replacement just waiting for his shot.
Honestly, this place doesn't half surface some rubbish at times.Do you really think the guy who is second in the WDC (to his teammate) is at risk of losing his seat?
C70R said:
Norfolkit said:
Not sure it's just Gasly who's fighting to keep his seat, Toto seemed really pissed off with Bottas this weekend, to compound his problems Mercedes have a ready made replacement just waiting for his shot.
Honestly, this place doesn't half surface some rubbish at times.Do you really think the guy who is second in the WDC (to his teammate) is at risk of losing his seat?
Bottas has either the same or more poles as Hamilton (can't remember which) has won two races and, before Germany, had finished off the podium once - in Canada where he finished 4th.
These are not the results of a driver about to be dismissed.......
mcholeboy_59 said:
HustleRussell said:
mcholeboy_59 said:
Question is, would be want to go back to red bull, if asked?
A racing driver who declines a racing car which is a second a lap quicker and has the potential to fight for podiums and wins is no racing driver at all IMO.There's history..
It's essentially the same team - certainly the same owners (obviously) If he had a problem, it'd be present where he is now??
Norfolkit said:
Not sure it's just Gasly who's fighting to keep his seat, Toto seemed really pissed off with Bottas this weekend, to compound his problems Mercedes have a ready made replacement just waiting for his shot.
I don't see the problem with bottas. If you take Lewis out of the championship and Bottas was number 1 driver with a diddy someone always finishing behind him somewhere Botta would be on 225points. He has finished directly behind lewis almost every racePatch1875 said:
I like Gasly but it’s all happened too soon for him, he looked the worst driver on the grid at the start yesterday didn’t seem to have the ability to deal with the conditions.
Like to see him go back to Toro Rosso to properly develop as a driver.
To be fair both he and Max had serious power delivery issues - it was just Max recovered a bit and started fighting back. Like to see him go back to Toro Rosso to properly develop as a driver.
slipstream 1985 said:
I don't see the problem with bottas. If you take Lewis out of the championship and Bottas was number 1 driver with a diddy someone always finishing behind him somewhere Botta would be on 225points. He has finished directly behind lewis almost every race
That's a fair point. However, in several races he's finished really quite a long way behind Lewis. Lewis has been able to extend the gap to him on track at will. When he has been ahead of Lewis on track he's had him swarming all over him. There's a huge disparity in race pace generally. He's a quick driver and an excellent qualifier (much of the time), but the trend is for him to lose several tenths per lap on average in the race. He was way off Lewis' pace yesterday, who was not even driving especially well / had the sniffles / was at death's door.
Lewis was often a fair bit quicker than Rosberg on race day, but there were also many occasions where Nico was every bit as quick / a bit quicker. Incredibly underrated driver in terms of just how rapid he was, possibly because he's also shown himself to be sneaky as well as a bit clumsy /timid/dangerous wheel to wheel.
I personally don't think Ocon would fare much better though. Russell might, judging by his F2 pace, but who knows.
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