Lewis Hamilton Vs Michael Schumacher - Who Is Better?

[MikeyC]

37chevy said:

A44RON said:

And why are posters still talking about the post-2010 Schumacher as if he was in his prime? It’s crazy. The fact he came out of a three year retirement to have a go in a different era shows some serious balls, and until Hamilton, Alonso or another Legend does something similar in the future and we see how that goes it’s a rather pointless comparison.

Well Lauda, Kimi, Prost all retired from F1, came back and did a better job than Schumacher on their return

A minor point (and I have the greatest repect for Mr Prost!) - but, Prost's 1993 WDC that he won, he had a massive car advantage
My metric is 1.35% in Quali (see my previous %'s on prev page) over the next best (on each race day) car
OK, he had to beat his younger teammate DH but then Hill had only a year under his belt

I agreed, Lauda did exceptionally well considering his age at the time (~35), but MSC was nearer 41 I think

[E34-3.2]

Good video about the relationship between Ferrari and the FIA.

https://youtu.be/73QqHdy6cFs

Edited by E34-3.2 on Friday 29th November 16:45

[RemarkLima]

paulguitar said:

TheDeuce said:

Yup. Two incredibly high achievers no doubt.

But one is more hero, the other more a bit fiendish. Whichever each person chooses as 'best' probably says more about that person than either driver

Agreed.

To some of us, integrity is still really, really important.

So Dick Darstardly vs Peter Perfect...

[mattikake]

RemarkLima said:

paulguitar said:

TheDeuce said:

Yup. Two incredibly high achievers no doubt.

But one is more hero, the other more a bit fiendish. Whichever each person chooses as 'best' probably says more about that person than either driver

Agreed.

To some of us, integrity is still really, really important.

So Dick Darstardly vs Peter Perfect...

D!ck v's cuunt?

[37chevy]

mattikake said:

RemarkLima said:

paulguitar said:

TheDeuce said:

Yup. Two incredibly high achievers no doubt.

But one is more hero, the other more a bit fiendish. Whichever each person chooses as 'best' probably says more about that person than either driver

Agreed.

To some of us, integrity is still really, really important.

So Dick Darstardly vs Peter Perfect...

D!ck v's cuunt?

Don’t think anyone is suggesting Lewis is Peter perfect but there are obvious differences about how far one driver was prepared to go to win

[A44RON]

sparta6 said:

A44RON said:

Schumacher beat Hakkinen in a fair fight in 2000 ,with no dodgy maneuvres, no cheating and no special Bridgestone tyres. And it was one of the best championship battles in history.

Sensational battle !
McLaren still had the edge and Mika was awesome.

Very much so and Schumacher beat him in a fair fight with no ramming, no cheating, no tyre advantages, no dodgy moves. But it doesn't fit certain individuals agenda on here.

Without the broken leg mishap at Silverstone '99 he probably would've won the title then too and increased his race win numbers.

[paulguitar]

A44RON said:

Very much so and Schumacher beat him in a fair fight with no ramming, no cheating, no tyre advantages, no dodgy moves. But it doesn't fit certain individuals agenda on here.

Not quite, the lap before Mika famously overtook him at Spa he nearly had him off the circuit, flat out, at Kemmel. It would have been a monstrous accident had Mika not managed to avoid it.

Mika took Michael to one side after that race and quietly informed him that he would never do anything like that to him again.

He never did.

Edited by paulguitar on Monday 2nd December 04:18

[A44RON]

MikeyC said:

37chevy said:

A44RON said:

And why are posters still talking about the post-2010 Schumacher as if he was in his prime? It’s crazy. The fact he came out of a three year retirement to have a go in a different era shows some serious balls, and until Hamilton, Alonso or another Legend does something similar in the future and we see how that goes it’s a rather pointless comparison.

Well Lauda, Kimi, Prost all retired from F1, came back and did a better job than Schumacher on their return

A minor point (and I have the greatest repect for Mr Prost!) - but, Prost's 1993 WDC that he won, he had a massive car advantage
My metric is 1.35% in Quali (see my previous %'s on prev page) over the next best (on each race day) car
OK, he had to beat his younger teammate DH but then Hill had only a year under his belt

I agreed, Lauda did exceptionally well considering his age at the time (~35), but MSC was nearer 41 I think

Prost only took one year out and was 38 when he came back into by far the best car for 1993. Raikkonen was 32 when he came back for 2012.... difference much

[A44RON]

paulguitar said:

A44RON said:

Very much so and Schumacher beat him in a fair fight with no ramming, no cheating, no tyre advantages, no dodgy moves. But it doesn't fit certain individuals agenda on here.

Not quite, the lap before Mika famously overtook him at Spa he nearly had him off the circuit, flat out, at Kemmel. It would have been a monstrous accident had Mika not managed to avoid it.

Mika took Michael to one side after that race and quietly informed him that he would never do anything like that to him again.

He never did.

Edited by paulguitar on Monday 2nd December 04:18

and Hakkinen rightfully won that race in a mega fight with arguably the best overtake we have ever seen

How about the rest of that season

[paulguitar]

A44RON said:

paulguitar said:

A44RON said:

Very much so and Schumacher beat him in a fair fight with no ramming, no cheating, no tyre advantages, no dodgy moves. But it doesn't fit certain individuals agenda on here.

Not quite, the lap before Mika famously overtook him at Spa he nearly had him off the circuit, flat out, at Kemmel. It would have been a monstrous accident had Mika not managed to avoid it.

Mika took Michael to one side after that race and quietly informed him that he would never do anything like that to him again.

He never did.

Edited by paulguitar on Monday 2nd December 04:18

and Hakkinen rightfully won that race in a mega fight with arguably the best overtake we have ever seen

How about the rest of that season

We're going back a bit here, and so I don't now remember every race in detail by any means, but I recall it being a great time for F1 and an excellent, hard-fought season.

Schumacher had history with Mika (and many other drivers) going all the way back to F3. That made it extra sweet, Mika was a straightforward, thoroughly likeable and fair driver, a class act both on and off the track.

I always respected MS's ability (how could you not?) but he's just got way too many black marks in his book to overlook. It's frustrating because he was so good that really there was no need for it.

[Graveworm]

Alonso was asked if Hamilton was better than Schumacher yesterday. He replied that he is "At least equal to"

[E-bmw]

A44RON said:

Without the broken leg mishap at Silverstone '99 he probably would've won the title then too and increased his race win numbers.

And without McLaren fuelling Lewis too short at Brazil in his rookie year he would have likely won in his rookie year, and now been equal to Schooey's 7 titles

If it weren't for Nico's slightly questionable tactics in his title winning season Lewis would likely have won that one to, and would now be on 8 titles.

Oh for "what ifs".

[Exige77]

Graveworm said:

Alonso was asked if Hamilton was better than Schumacher yesterday. He replied that he is "At least equal to"

And as I’ve said a few times, Hamilton’s career is not over yet. He keeps pumping in great performances while this thread is running.

Yesterday might not have been that exciting but what a performance !!

Not a foot wrong, fast, controlled, taking care of his tyres, on original 3 power trains allowed, pole, fastest lap, lap record and great way to finish the season.

This is a man (and team) and the very top of their profession.

[sparta6]

Exige77 said:

And as I’ve said a few times, Hamilton’s career is not over yet. He keeps pumping in great performances while this thread is running.

Yesterday might not have been that exciting but what a performance !!

Not a foot wrong, fast, controlled, taking care of his tyres, on original 3 power trains allowed, pole, fastest lap, lap record and great way to finish the season.

This is a man (and team) and the very top of their profession.

Great result for sure.

Bottas, plum last to 4th.
Mercedes remains THE car to have.

[37chevy]

sparta6 said:

Great result for sure.

Bottas, plum last to 4th.
Mercedes remains THE car to have.

To be fair the Ferrari or red bull could have gotten back to the top 5 too...

[mattikake]

paulguitar said:

A44RON said:

paulguitar said:

A44RON said:

Very much so and Schumacher beat him in a fair fight with no ramming, no cheating, no tyre advantages, no dodgy moves. But it doesn't fit certain individuals agenda on here.

Not quite, the lap before Mika famously overtook him at Spa he nearly had him off the circuit, flat out, at Kemmel. It would have been a monstrous accident had Mika not managed to avoid it.

Mika took Michael to one side after that race and quietly informed him that he would never do anything like that to him again.

He never did.

Edited by paulguitar on Monday 2nd December 04:18

and Hakkinen rightfully won that race in a mega fight with arguably the best overtake we have ever seen

How about the rest of that season

We're going back a bit here, and so I don't now remember every race in detail by any means, but I recall it being a great time for F1 and an excellent, hard-fought season.

Schumacher had history with Mika (and many other drivers) going all the way back to F3. That made it extra sweet, Mika was a straightforward, thoroughly likeable and fair driver, a class act both on and off the track.

I always respected MS's ability (how could you not?) but he's just got way too many black marks in his book to overlook. It's frustrating because he was so good that really there was no need for it.

To be clear, the F3 history with Mika was at Macau. Mika won race 1 from pole, race 2 Mika found himself behind Schumacher and upon overtaking, Schumacher simply shoved him into the wall on the main straight. I remember Mika getting out throwing his steering wheel on the floor. He wasn't slightly impressed...

Schumacher repeated the same in spa only mika backed out of it before he put him on the grass. How the pro-schumi camp can call this a "fair" fight, and "no dodgy moves" i find truly staggering. He cheated, again, and dangerously, again.

Fine squeeze someone to the edge of the track, but not beyond it or move to deny space BEFORE the other driver gets there, but don't do both. Dirt, cheat, ram.

At least mika got to use zonta with relative ease to show Schumacher's distinctly average battling skills. (The move to take zonta on the inside by Schumacher was as plain as it was obvious)

[sparta6]

37chevy said:

sparta6 said:

Great result for sure.

Bottas, plum last to 4th.
Mercedes remains THE car to have.

To be fair the Ferrari or red bull could have gotten back to the top 5 too...

Perhaps - but not with Bottas behind the wheel

[macdeb]

Exige77 said:

Graveworm said:

Alonso was asked if Hamilton was better than Schumacher yesterday. He replied that he is "At least equal to"

And as I’ve said a few times, Hamilton’s career is not over yet. He keeps pumping in great performances while this thread is running.

Yesterday might not have been that exciting but what a performance !!

Not a foot wrong, fast, controlled, taking care of his tyres, on original 3 power trains allowed, pole, fastest lap, lap record and great way to finish the season.

This is a man (and team) and the very top of their profession.

easily as equal and in my eyes Hamilton is the greater. If you take the championship the Schumacker cheated Hill out of (yes, Cheated) they would now be equal championships.

[MikeyC]

macdeb said:

If you take the championship the Schumacker cheated Hill out of (yes, Cheated) they would now be equal championships.

There's an interesting thread on G P Rejects if you can be bothered
A poster ibsey (not the OP, but someone who who starts posting near the bottom of P1) writes some of his findings after reading lots of articles from that year.
He has subsequently written a book about that year.

I should add he's not a particular fan of Mr Schumacher, Senna or Hill ...
Sadly, most of the YT video links have gone, but it makes interesting reading none the less

[vdn]

Alonso knows that Lewis is a legend in the making; saying he's at least equal to MS when he hasn't even retired yet.

But; there's a few armchair experts on PH who know better!