Formula 1 Pre-season Testing February 2020

[NRS]

Supersam83 said:

Holy poop!

Bottas sets a 1:15.732!

Pole position and lap record is 1:15.406

Mercedes Benz have created a monster!

Or they really screwed up, and since everyone thinks they take it easy in testing they are absolutely pushing it. This means the other teams panic, and try and do a big improvement as they think they're so far behind, so waste resources instead of doing more realistic upgrades/testing....


Perhaps!

[Durzel]

Mr Pointy said:

Durzel said:

It’s still (supposed to be) a competitive sport though, and at this level any significant development of tech leading to an advantage is going to have a disproportionate effect on the other teams (i.e. they could go from having a fair shake of the dice to having no chance at all save for retirements).

I would tend to agree that the governing body needs to keep runaway development in check to try and make it a level playing field, or at least try to.

On the one hand you have to hand it to Merc for coming up with this. Any of the other teams could’ve done something similar, or indeed different, but didn’t. If it falls within the rules then it should be allowed. On the other hand the sport, or at least the spectacle for a layperson, does not need another season of total Mercedes dominance.

This is nonsense: it's a competitive team sport & Mercedes are the best team. They've come up with a (possibly) brilliant engineering solution which is what F1 is supposed to be about.

By your argument Liverpool should be made to play with 10 men to give the others a chance.

I think that argument is specious really.

If you read what I wrote I said that if it falls within the rules then it should absoutely be allowed, and that every other team could've invented something similar, or different, but didn't. I'm not asking for any kind of sanction on Mercedes so your Liverpool 10 men argument is a straw man.

I'm saying - again - that the spectacle to a layperson, one who doesn't care about what whizz bang new feature is on a car but wants to see a number of drivers in the mix all with a shout of winning, it could be diminished and it would be yet another year where that has happened. As kambites eruditely put it - I'm talking about the people who care about the 10%, the drivers, more than the cars.

I would disagree on the whole "teams came back at Mercedes after about 6 races" too. I tend to think that people want to manufacture competitiveness because they find it embarassing to try and justify the naked truth of one team dominating. Whenever it has mattered Mercedes have been consistently dominant. You can point to the odd occasion where their car wasn't particularly suited to a particular track, but the trend throughout the last season was that they were the team to beat at every race. Disagreeing with that is frankly trying to distort history. I've yet to hear anyone tell me how journeyman Bottas went from pre-Mercedes being pretty much in the wilderness to suddenly turning in 1-3rd places at Merc.

Once again, for the cheap seats, yes you have to applaud Mercedes and they should not be hamstrung because others haven't been as capable or innovative as them. Doesn't stop it diminishing the spectacle in my opinion as a casual viewer. Tuning in to each race with it being Mercedes to lose does not a thrilling spectacle make.

[anonymous-user]

kambites said:

As the BBC point out on their blog, Hamilton managed a 1:16.9 on hards (a tyre five grades harder than the ultra-softs Bottas used for the 1:15.7) at the start of a long stint on the first day, which is arguably more ominous. Either way Mercedes look to have made a big step on from last year. Lets hope others have managed to do the same.

It's a surprise that they're showing their cards this early - it might just be they're not afraid of the other teams and still have a buffer or extra engine modes remaining untouched.

The assumption made currently is that Ferrari are nowhere, and the engine issue this morning means it's a catastrophe and they should just throw in the towel for the season. In reality, they've not put in a huge number of laps, speed trap readings are low, and the mood seems somewhat tempered. It could be they've monumentally got it wrong, or they're playing the long game, they know what they're sat on, and not wanting to show it.

It looks a similar story at Red Bull - excellent mileage, no hiccups, but no grandstanding lap times. It's an interesting one; the worry at Ferrari will be that if they aren't where they thought they'd be, Racing Point could sneak into that pecking order - there's a possibility that the top 3 become Merc, Red Bull and Racing Point, with Ferrari scratching their hands, wondering what happened, and why McLaren are nearly snapping at their heels.

My hope is that Red Bull have an answer for Merc, and have a car that can challenge over the course of a season, otherwise Hamilton's going to have a relatively easy year on the way to WDC #7, and the only hard fought racing for position will be in the midfield.

[kambites]

Durzel said:

I would disagree on the whole "teams came back at Mercedes after about 6 races" too. .

IMO the lack of competition at the front last year was nothing to do with the engineering in the cars and everything do to with how the teams operated (or failed to operate) at the race weekends. Personally I think Ferrari, overall, had the best car last year; even if they didn't, they certainly had the fastest car in qualifying trim.

This season's saving grace could be that Redbull have a competitive car from the off and, unlike Ferrari, are actually capable of making the most of it. Or who knows, maybe this year Ferrari will even manage to go the odd weekend without doing something stupid.

[London424]

NFC 85 Vette said:

kambites said:

As the BBC point out on their blog, Hamilton managed a 1:16.9 on hards (a tyre five grades harder than the ultra-softs Bottas used for the 1:15.7) at the start of a long stint on the first day, which is arguably more ominous. Either way Mercedes look to have made a big step on from last year. Lets hope others have managed to do the same.

It's a surprise that they're showing their cards this early - it might just be they're not afraid of the other teams and still have a buffer or extra engine modes remaining untouched.

The assumption made currently is that Ferrari are nowhere, and the engine issue this morning means it's a catastrophe and they should just throw in the towel for the season. In reality, they've not put in a huge number of laps, speed trap readings are low, and the mood seems somewhat tempered. It could be they've monumentally got it wrong, or they're playing the long game, they know what they're sat on, and not wanting to show it.

It looks a similar story at Red Bull - excellent mileage, no hiccups, but no grandstanding lap times. It's an interesting one; the worry at Ferrari will be that if they aren't where they thought they'd be, Racing Point could sneak into that pecking order - there's a possibility that the top 3 become Merc, Red Bull and Racing Point, with Ferrari scratching their hands, wondering what happened, and why McLaren are nearly snapping at their heels.

My hope is that Red Bull have an answer for Merc, and have a car that can challenge over the course of a season, otherwise Hamilton's going to have a relatively easy year on the way to WDC #7, and the only hard fought racing for position will be in the midfield.

It’ll be interesting because looking at the race sims from Hamilton and Verstappen it’s not looking pretty.

https://twitter.com/f1debrief/status/1230827514949...

[Mellow Yellow]

Sandpit Steve said:

1:15.7 now, 3/10ths away from last years pole time! This Mercedes is a monster.

Most unlike Mercedes, in pre-season testing. Over the last couple of years I've wondered if they've been sandbagging a bit in the championship, just doing enough to win without making it look too easy. Think about it; if they did a McLaren 1988, dominating every race, something would be done to even things out. Could this be a case of a last hurrah before they revert to being an engine supplier? Total domination for the whole season, showing what they are really capable of, Lewis passing Schumi's race win record and matching his DWC's, it'd be a nice way to bow out.

[TheDeuce]

Munter said:

TheDeuce said:

Sandpit Steve said:

1:15.7 now, 3/10ths away from last years pole time! This Mercedes is a monster.

Indeed. And this is the start of their testing efforts too. Astonishing stuff.

Well. I'd say they are at least 1/2 way through their planned program given how well things have gone on track, rather than at the start. That said...if there's more to come in the next test. Could this years car be pushing a second faster than last year! Eek

Sorry I meant at the start of them pushing the car - traditionally a last day of week one activity. Although I was/am wondering if a few teams might not start to push until next week now testing is shortened?

And I actually do believe they're in with a shot of a second off last year. The car looks planted and the drivers relaxed. Looks like a very well polished product in (nearly) the final stage of it's evolution.

[Durzel]

kambites said:

Durzel said:

I would disagree on the whole "teams came back at Mercedes after about 6 races" too. .

IMO the lack of competition at the front last year was nothing to do with the engineering in the cars and everything do to with how the teams operated (or failed to operate) at the race weekends. Personally I think Ferrari, overall, had the best car last year; even if they didn't, they certainly had the fastest car in qualifying trim.

This season's saving grace could be that Redbull have a competitive car from the off and, unlike Ferrari, are actually capable of making the most of it. Or who knows, maybe this year Ferrari will even manage to go the odd weekend without doing something stupid.

I think how teams operate is a function of how well their cars perform, though.

There is an undeniable benefit of the serenity that comes from being in a dominant position. You can progressively iterate on your platform, rather than constantly try and revolutionise it, throwing the kitchen sink at it, to catch up. That feeling of surehandedness spreads out across the team and enables people to breathe.

I'm not saying Mercedes didn't have to work hard to maintain their edge throughout the year, but that other teams who are on the back foot have a desperation about them, they have to constantly shift position, trying new unproven, drastic things to try and close the gap.

I know people like to rag on Ferrari's apparent hopelessness - and that certainly contributed to stealing losses from the jaws of victory - but I would give them the benefit of the doubt that their development and mood was a lot more ragged than Mercedes because of their circumstances.

Combine that with Vettel who seems to fall apart at the slightest pressure now, and Hamilton who is super consistent, and you have a perfect storm.

Ferrari's only saving grace, really and in my opinion, is LeClerc. He's been a bit of a revelation and may well be their only way out of the darkness if Hamilton doesn't join them (what a season that would be, particularly if Ferrari still have a weaker car).

[anonymous-user]

Mellow Yellow said:

Most unlike Mercedes, in pre-season testing. Over the last couple of years I've wondered if they've been sandbagging a bit in the championship, just doing enough to win without making it look too easy. Think about it; if they did a McLaren 1988, dominating every race, something would be done to even things out. Could this be a case of a last hurrah before they revert to being an engine supplier? Total domination for the whole season, showing what they are really capable of, Lewis passing Schumi's race win record and matching his DWC's, it'd be a nice way to bow out.

Technically there's no way it could be punished in subsequent years[1] - the size of the regulation changes on chassis and aero next year mean the whole thing's reset anyway. If they had been holding back historically, they could throw the kitchen sink at it this year, win say 18-20 races, and the only fallout will be reduced viewer figures for Liberty Media as it might become somewhat more predictable than in previous seasons. As much as the teams say they love the sport, it's a business, and they're all there to win.

If that indeed is the case, the other teams might well pull the plug on 2020 development early. Of course the big teams are already on to next year's car with the resources able to develop two philosophies in tandem.

[1] The closest example I can think would be the change between 2004 and 2005, when the tyre change regulations changed and the Ferrari that had dominated 2004, was handicapped in 2005 because of how it had been designed (small fuel tank, splash & dash pit stops and tyre changes, sprinting each stint).

[kambites]

Durzel said:

Ferrari's only saving grace, really and in my opinion, is LeClerc. He's been a bit of a revelation and may well be their only way out of the darkness if Hamilton doesn't join them (what a season that would be, particularly if Ferrari still have a weaker car).

He made his fair share of mistakes last year too, although one could argue it's far more forgivable in such a young driver.

[Durzel]

Agreed.

[ajprice]

The Mercedes steering is clear for this year, FIA have updated the 2021 rules to bar it from next year. Racing Point will assess cost v benefit, Haas probably won't bother and will concentrate on other things.

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/148363/racing-po...

[Zoobeef]

Question will be, will a team rush a design through which fails at some point in the first few races

[Graveworm]

The Mattia Binotto readout is interesting. Looks like Redbull need to be bringing their game from Melbourne.

[TheDeuce]

Graveworm said:

The Mattia Binotto readout is interesting. Looks like Redbull need to be bringing their game from Melbourne.

That was the most downbeat summary possible from Binotto. Ten points for honesty but crushing for the red fans.

As that was read out, down the pit lane Haas watches their second driver bin their car, again.

[London424]

TheDeuce said:

Graveworm said:

The Mattia Binotto readout is interesting. Looks like Redbull need to be bringing their game from Melbourne.

That was the most downbeat summary possible from Binotto. Ten points for honesty but crushing for the red fans.

As that was read out, down the pit lane Haas watches their second driver bin their car, again.

Any link to what was said?

[TheDeuce]

London424 said:

TheDeuce said:

Graveworm said:

The Mattia Binotto readout is interesting. Looks like Redbull need to be bringing their game from Melbourne.

That was the most downbeat summary possible from Binotto. Ten points for honesty but crushing for the red fans.

As that was read out, down the pit lane Haas watches their second driver bin their car, again.

Any link to what was said?

No, but the comments were significant so it won't be long until the quotes are all over the net.

In a nutshell: "we're not as fast as Mercedes and we don't expect to be as fast at the start of the season, maybe we can catch them at the end."

There goes that battle for 2020 then

[StevieBee]

I’m I don’t buy into the whole sand-bagging / hiding your hand thing. This week and next are the only testing the teams get before the season. In years past, teams could hire any circuit and test all they liked. But it’s all now concentrated in these two weeks during which, at some point, you have to see what your car can really do otherwise there’s little point turning up to test. They can hide things to an extent but I doubt to a level that would swerve anyone for long.

[Sandpit Steve]

Zoobeef said:

Question will be, will a team rush a design through which fails at some point in the first few races

That’s a fair point. I imagine that the FIA will want to see a new crash test and a thorough engineering inspection of any other cars implementing a similar system during the season.

[super7]

DAS banned already for 2021.....

What a pile of st!!!