Black Mercedes.
Discussion
jimothyc said:
The incoming cost caps are going to inevitably lead to a reduction in head count at most of the teams and nowhere more so than Mercedes. In a performance driven pursuit like F1 there's not going to be scope to carry any fat at all. Every single person in the team is going to have to be the absolute best at what they do. I doubt they will want to be carrying apprentices or inexperienced staff, everyone will need to have demonstrable experience and an impeccable track record.
There isn't a ready pool of applicants available for them to recruit. You don't win F1 titles by hiring the most diverse team, you hire the most talented and experienced.
If Mercedes are serious about improving diversity, they're going to have to start with education programmes at secondary school level to try and drive more minorities into engineering degrees. They are then going to have to follow this up with investment into other forms of motor sport where these graduates can cut their teeth before they can even consider hiring them.
This is going to take a lot of investment over a long period of time. Considering there were questions asked over Mercedes long term commitment to F1 this year. I'm not sure we'll ever get to see the fruits of this endeavour. Ultimately I fear this is nothing more than a marketing exercise.
Lewis did say before the race that the initiative was about education and it will take a long time to impact diversity within the team.There isn't a ready pool of applicants available for them to recruit. You don't win F1 titles by hiring the most diverse team, you hire the most talented and experienced.
If Mercedes are serious about improving diversity, they're going to have to start with education programmes at secondary school level to try and drive more minorities into engineering degrees. They are then going to have to follow this up with investment into other forms of motor sport where these graduates can cut their teeth before they can even consider hiring them.
This is going to take a lot of investment over a long period of time. Considering there were questions asked over Mercedes long term commitment to F1 this year. I'm not sure we'll ever get to see the fruits of this endeavour. Ultimately I fear this is nothing more than a marketing exercise.
The Mercedes initiative is about asking questions about 'why' certain groups are underrepresented. O think it's highly likely that the answer will largely prove to be education and career choices ahead of Mercedes actually choosing who to hire. So yes, I think it's likely an education initiative could result... Of course it may simply be that certain groups, for whatever reason, are simply less inclined to apply themselves to subjects that could later lead them to an F1 career. Sometimes when you find a problem, you realise it's not actually a 'problem' as such, and there is nothing to fix. But it's worth asking the questions in the first place anyway.
The question shouldn't be why are they doing this now, it's why some people weren't doing this 10 or more years ago if (apparently) they've known about this problem for so long.
Bandwagon jumping and throwing words about is easy, doing practical things because you made your own choice is much more valuable.
Bandwagon jumping and throwing words about is easy, doing practical things because you made your own choice is much more valuable.
Drawweight said:
vdn said:
You’ve not disagreed with anything I’ve said from what I can see.
You seem, like many, to be confusing lowering the bar - to a diversity drive to inspire and make clear that people who might otherwise not feel a particular field is for them, can be.
I already said that nobody in their right mind would like that someone got a job just because of their race or sex or other. In actual fact; I don’t think you should have done what you did... it’s the wrong way to create diversity and not what any bonafide org / or Lewis in this case / F1, etc is pushing for. Can’t you see the difference as it is as clear as can be, no?
This is where Mercedes are going to find it tricky.You seem, like many, to be confusing lowering the bar - to a diversity drive to inspire and make clear that people who might otherwise not feel a particular field is for them, can be.
I already said that nobody in their right mind would like that someone got a job just because of their race or sex or other. In actual fact; I don’t think you should have done what you did... it’s the wrong way to create diversity and not what any bonafide org / or Lewis in this case / F1, etc is pushing for. Can’t you see the difference as it is as clear as can be, no?
If they are looking for ethnic minorities as drivers/mechanics/developers or whatever and the field they have to choose from is predominantly white what can they do?
As has been stated above it needs to be tackled at the grass roots or to continue the metaphor even before the crop is sown.
Schools, colleges, universities must encourage diversity.
From memory there was a big push not too many years ago to get women to consider careers which were predominantly male.
This has had some success although it still has a long way to go.
Surely the same principles can be applied to ethnic minorities. You don’t need to lower the bar or introduce positive discrimination. Just get enough interested in that particular branch of employment and the good will rise to the surface as should be.
If you advertise a job and you get 50 applicants. 25 white and 25 black it’s a lot easier to create a diverse company than if it’s 48 white and 2 black.
pquinn said:
The question shouldn't be why are they doing this now, it's why some people weren't doing this 10 or more years ago if (apparently) they've known about this problem for so long.
Bandwagon jumping and throwing words about is easy, doing practical things because you made your own choice is much more valuable.
isn't that a rather convenient way of doing nothing about anything?Bandwagon jumping and throwing words about is easy, doing practical things because you made your own choice is much more valuable.
angrymoby said:
pquinn said:
The question shouldn't be why are they doing this now, it's why some people weren't doing this 10 or more years ago if (apparently) they've known about this problem for so long.
Bandwagon jumping and throwing words about is easy, doing practical things because you made your own choice is much more valuable.
isn't that a rather convenient way of doing nothing about anything?Bandwagon jumping and throwing words about is easy, doing practical things because you made your own choice is much more valuable.
angrymoby said:
pquinn said:
The question shouldn't be why are they doing this now, it's why some people weren't doing this 10 or more years ago if (apparently) they've known about this problem for so long.
Bandwagon jumping and throwing words about is easy, doing practical things because you made your own choice is much more valuable.
isn't that a rather convenient way of doing nothing about anything?Bandwagon jumping and throwing words about is easy, doing practical things because you made your own choice is much more valuable.
pquinn said:
It's more about asking why some people who've become so vocal recently have done sod all for so long then suddenly think they should be seen as a leader on this.
because their full time jobs aren't as civil rights activists or civil rights organisations & as such, spend most of their time in their own bubbles?& i'd hardly call either Mercedes or Hamilton as 'leaders' on the issues of race/diversity apart from within the bubble that is F1 (& it should be obvious as to why that is)
pquinn said:
angrymoby said:
pquinn said:
The question shouldn't be why are they doing this now, it's why some people weren't doing this 10 or more years ago if (apparently) they've known about this problem for so long.
Bandwagon jumping and throwing words about is easy, doing practical things because you made your own choice is much more valuable.
isn't that a rather convenient way of doing nothing about anything?Bandwagon jumping and throwing words about is easy, doing practical things because you made your own choice is much more valuable.
F1 isn’t diverse. F1 looks to become more so. The current climate lends itself to doing just that. Hamilton, as an aside, has spoken about diversity in motorsport for years.
vdn said:
faa77 said:
sparta6 said:
We both know why you cannot answer the Chinese question, but don't worry I won't tell anyone
You are wearing a very old belief system which also failed Corbyn.
Once you leave Uni and start building new businesses and creating new jobs in the real world you might, just might, begin to see how outdated your automatic assumptions really are
So you and Sparta; the naive village idiots, as it were; cannot understand that, whilst practically speaking; career paths can be open for all; the reality is that people from certain sectors of society may not see it as a bonafide option; both / or either, consciously or subconsciously. And there is a chicken and egg loop that occurs; wherein kids, young adults, adults; not seeing themselves represented in any given field; feel it's not for them. It takes mavericks like Lewis and his father to break the mould; and suffer the racism / ignorance along the way, knowing that that's just going to be a part of the equation; to hopefully lay foundations that might see results in a generation or two.
Now, in your bubble's; I know that it's a simple equation... can someone go into a career of their choosing? Yes. End of discussion. All the diversity stuff is nonsense, and virtue signalling, woke, b
ks.But in the real world where nuance, unconscious bias, conscious bias and all that it brings, affect real world decisions and choices; there are fields that remain relatively insular and can seek to let the next generation know that they are welcome. The chicken and egg cycle can be broken and diversity follows.
Now; does this mean that ANY of us like the idea of people getting into positions, because of their skin colour alone? No. I reckon we'd all be on the same page re' that. In a perfect world; that would never happen / would never have happened.
But the drive for diversity is bigger than that and about a far bigger picture.
Now, as grown ups; I'd assume you'd get all of this but I'm reminded that many people exist in bubbles and have no real reason to step outside them. It's not unique and is quite common. Some might even say it's the generic non-learned stand point.
1.
When Naomi (Campbell) first broke into mainstream we were delighted but not surprised as we knew her from the times spent hanging together in South London.
Some 7 or 8 months later there was a significant uplift in new black candidates, both male and female, knocking on the industry doors. We susbequently worked with several other black models, both male and female, since that mainstream breakthrough by Naomi.
CUT TO: Motorsport.
Hamilton broke through into mainstream 15 years ago.
But there hasn't been a significant uplift of black candidates knocking on the industry doors.
In a sector where it's all about gaining 0.01 of a second, you would think 15 years is enough time for motivated black talent to step forward into their chosen career and begin knocking on doors.
Equal Opportunity and Discrimination Laws have been in situ for many years.
In the UK at least.
Could it simply be down to different interests, or lack of motivation perhaps ?
I do realise however that humans can find it easier to sit back and blame something else. A particular Government of the day is usually a good place to start.
2.
Your command of prose and punctuation has room for improvement.
See you soon
sparta6 said:
Ok vdn, as an employer myself I can see you're still struggling and in consideration of others who may be jaded, I will keep this brief.
1.
When Naomi (Campbell) first broke into mainstream we were delighted but not surprised as we knew her from the times spent hanging together in South London.
Some 7 or 8 months later there was a significant uplift in new black candidates, both male and female, knocking on the industry doors. We susbequently worked with several other black models, both male and female, since that mainstream breakthrough by Naomi.
CUT TO: Motorsport.
Hamilton broke through into mainstream 15 years ago.
But there hasn't been a significant uplift of black candidates knocking on the industry doors.
In a sector where it's all about gaining 0.01 of a second, you would think 15 years is enough time for motivated black talent to step forward into their chosen career and begin knocking on doors.
Equal Opportunity and Discrimination Laws have been in situ for many years.
In the UK at least.
Could it simply be down to different interests, or lack of motivation perhaps ?
I do realise however that humans can find it easier to sit back and blame something else. A particular Government of the day is usually a good place to start.
2.
Your command of prose and punctuation has room for improvement.
See you soon
are you seriously drawing a comparison to an industry & a particular role within in it, where the only apparent discernible talent is if they are photogenic?1.
When Naomi (Campbell) first broke into mainstream we were delighted but not surprised as we knew her from the times spent hanging together in South London.
Some 7 or 8 months later there was a significant uplift in new black candidates, both male and female, knocking on the industry doors. We susbequently worked with several other black models, both male and female, since that mainstream breakthrough by Naomi.
CUT TO: Motorsport.
Hamilton broke through into mainstream 15 years ago.
But there hasn't been a significant uplift of black candidates knocking on the industry doors.
In a sector where it's all about gaining 0.01 of a second, you would think 15 years is enough time for motivated black talent to step forward into their chosen career and begin knocking on doors.
Equal Opportunity and Discrimination Laws have been in situ for many years.
In the UK at least.
Could it simply be down to different interests, or lack of motivation perhaps ?
I do realise however that humans can find it easier to sit back and blame something else. A particular Government of the day is usually a good place to start.
2.
Your command of prose and punctuation has room for improvement.
See you soon
you haven't just compared an apple to orange, you've compared an apple to a flower
vdn said:
This from the individual who cannot work out what a diversity drive is for. What's embarrassing is that you need such things explaining on an internet forum; what sort of bubble do you exist in? ... the real world is awaiting your arrival. Sort of
So you and Sparta; the naive village idiots, as it were; cannot understand that, whilst practically speaking; career paths can be open for all; the reality is that people from certain sectors of society may not see it as a bonafide option; both / or either, consciously or subconsciously. And there is a chicken and egg loop that occurs; wherein kids, young adults, adults; not seeing themselves represented in any given field; feel it's not for them. It takes mavericks like Lewis and his father to break the mould; and suffer the racism / ignorance along the way, knowing that that's just going to be a part of the equation; to hopefully lay foundations that might see results in a generation or two.
Now, in your bubble's; I know that it's a simple equation... can someone go into a career of their choosing? Yes. End of discussion. All the diversity stuff is nonsense, and virtue signalling, woke, bks.
But in the real world where nuance, unconscious bias, conscious bias and all that it brings, affect real world decisions and choices; there are fields that remain relatively insular and can seek to let the next generation know that they are welcome. The chicken and egg cycle can be broken and diversity follows.
Now; does this mean that ANY of us like the idea of people getting into positions, because of their skin colour alone? No. I reckon we'd all be on the same page re' that. In a perfect world; that would never happen / would never have happened.
But the drive for diversity is bigger than that and about a far bigger picture.
Now, as grown ups; I'd assume you'd get all of this but I'm reminded that many people exist in bubbles and have no real reason to step outside them. It's not unique and is quite common. Some might even say it's the generic non-learned stand point.
Awwww bless, you actually think a majority of the country share your views? That's so cute.So you and Sparta; the naive village idiots, as it were; cannot understand that, whilst practically speaking; career paths can be open for all; the reality is that people from certain sectors of society may not see it as a bonafide option; both / or either, consciously or subconsciously. And there is a chicken and egg loop that occurs; wherein kids, young adults, adults; not seeing themselves represented in any given field; feel it's not for them. It takes mavericks like Lewis and his father to break the mould; and suffer the racism / ignorance along the way, knowing that that's just going to be a part of the equation; to hopefully lay foundations that might see results in a generation or two.
Now, in your bubble's; I know that it's a simple equation... can someone go into a career of their choosing? Yes. End of discussion. All the diversity stuff is nonsense, and virtue signalling, woke, b
ks.But in the real world where nuance, unconscious bias, conscious bias and all that it brings, affect real world decisions and choices; there are fields that remain relatively insular and can seek to let the next generation know that they are welcome. The chicken and egg cycle can be broken and diversity follows.
Now; does this mean that ANY of us like the idea of people getting into positions, because of their skin colour alone? No. I reckon we'd all be on the same page re' that. In a perfect world; that would never happen / would never have happened.
But the drive for diversity is bigger than that and about a far bigger picture.
Now, as grown ups; I'd assume you'd get all of this but I'm reminded that many people exist in bubbles and have no real reason to step outside them. It's not unique and is quite common. Some might even say it's the generic non-learned stand point.
Find an area (with average house price below £700,000) who share your views and then tell me who's living in the bubble.
Oh and I never said I don't understand what a diversity drive is, I asked why one is needed. I guess comprehension isn't your strongest point?
Europa1 said:
I think the question being asked is given that, in theory, a career path is open. why are there not more people from a BAME background taking it - that seems to me to be the question the Mercedes initiative is trying to answer. As are parts of the engineering profession as a whole. Mercedes F1 are about average for female representation at 12%, but the profession is trying to change that. At 3% BAME, they're behind the profession, and they want to known why.
Because..........Certain groups gravitate away/towards certain jobs/sports/interests.
Why do you/Mercedes feel the need to label this a problem? Perhaps it's not a problem? Perhaps they don't care because they don't want to do this career? Do men complain about becoming nurses? I don't think so.
Europa1 said:
Why are people trying to denigrate their efforts?
Because positive discrimination is still discrimination. Unfortunately the law which the Labour (surprise surprise) Government passed allows being discriminated against if you're in the majority. However, morally it's still discrimination.angrymoby said:
sparta6 said:
Ok vdn, as an employer myself I can see you're still struggling and in consideration of others who may be jaded, I will keep this brief.
1.
When Naomi (Campbell) first broke into mainstream we were delighted but not surprised as we knew her from the times spent hanging together in South London.
Some 7 or 8 months later there was a significant uplift in new black candidates, both male and female, knocking on the industry doors. We susbequently worked with several other black models, both male and female, since that mainstream breakthrough by Naomi.
CUT TO: Motorsport.
Hamilton broke through into mainstream 15 years ago.
But there hasn't been a significant uplift of black candidates knocking on the industry doors.
In a sector where it's all about gaining 0.01 of a second, you would think 15 years is enough time for motivated black talent to step forward into their chosen career and begin knocking on doors.
Equal Opportunity and Discrimination Laws have been in situ for many years.
In the UK at least.
Could it simply be down to different interests, or lack of motivation perhaps ?
I do realise however that humans can find it easier to sit back and blame something else. A particular Government of the day is usually a good place to start.
2.
Your command of prose and punctuation has room for improvement.
See you soon
are you seriously drawing a comparison to an industry & a particular role within in it, where the only apparent discernible talent is if they are photogenic?1.
When Naomi (Campbell) first broke into mainstream we were delighted but not surprised as we knew her from the times spent hanging together in South London.
Some 7 or 8 months later there was a significant uplift in new black candidates, both male and female, knocking on the industry doors. We susbequently worked with several other black models, both male and female, since that mainstream breakthrough by Naomi.
CUT TO: Motorsport.
Hamilton broke through into mainstream 15 years ago.
But there hasn't been a significant uplift of black candidates knocking on the industry doors.
In a sector where it's all about gaining 0.01 of a second, you would think 15 years is enough time for motivated black talent to step forward into their chosen career and begin knocking on doors.
Equal Opportunity and Discrimination Laws have been in situ for many years.
In the UK at least.
Could it simply be down to different interests, or lack of motivation perhaps ?
I do realise however that humans can find it easier to sit back and blame something else. A particular Government of the day is usually a good place to start.
2.
Your command of prose and punctuation has room for improvement.
See you soon
you haven't just compared an apple to orange, you've compared an apple to a flower
My bad.
faa77 said:
Europa1 said:
I think the question being asked is given that, in theory, a career path is open. why are there not more people from a BAME background taking it - that seems to me to be the question the Mercedes initiative is trying to answer. As are parts of the engineering profession as a whole. Mercedes F1 are about average for female representation at 12%, but the profession is trying to change that. At 3% BAME, they're behind the profession, and they want to known why.
Because..........Certain groups gravitate away/towards certain jobs/sports/interests.
Why do you/Mercedes feel the need to label this a problem? Perhaps it's not a problem? Perhaps they don't care because they don't want to do this career? Do men complain about becoming nurses? I don't think so.
Europa1 said:
Why are people trying to denigrate their efforts?
Because positive discrimination is still discrimination. Unfortunately the law which the Labour (surprise surprise) Government passed allows being discriminated against if you're in the majority. However, morally it's still discrimination.They've been very clear that their plan is to research why they're not get applicants from the widest possible pool and see what they can do to encourage that to happen. They've said they'll continue to hire the very best people, so who knows, the staff demographic may or may not change.
rscott said:
Good job Mercedes aren't suggesting they're going to implement positive discrimination then.
They've been very clear that their plan is to research why they're not get applicants from the widest possible pool and see what they can do to encourage that to happen. They've said they'll continue to hire the very best people, so who knows, the staff demographic may or may not change.
Just because they say that doesn't mean they won't. Hardly going to announce it, are they? (Although some stupid organisations have)They've been very clear that their plan is to research why they're not get applicants from the widest possible pool and see what they can do to encourage that to happen. They've said they'll continue to hire the very best people, so who knows, the staff demographic may or may not change.
This all smells like Mercedes being worried Lewis won't re-sign and doing all this to appease him.
faa77 said:
vdn said:
This from the individual who cannot work out what a diversity drive is for. What's embarrassing is that you need such things explaining on an internet forum; what sort of bubble do you exist in? ... the real world is awaiting your arrival. Sort of
So you and Sparta; the naive village idiots, as it were; cannot understand that, whilst practically speaking; career paths can be open for all; the reality is that people from certain sectors of society may not see it as a bonafide option; both / or either, consciously or subconsciously. And there is a chicken and egg loop that occurs; wherein kids, young adults, adults; not seeing themselves represented in any given field; feel it's not for them. It takes mavericks like Lewis and his father to break the mould; and suffer the racism / ignorance along the way, knowing that that's just going to be a part of the equation; to hopefully lay foundations that might see results in a generation or two.
Now, in your bubble's; I know that it's a simple equation... can someone go into a career of their choosing? Yes. End of discussion. All the diversity stuff is nonsense, and virtue signalling, woke, bks.
But in the real world where nuance, unconscious bias, conscious bias and all that it brings, affect real world decisions and choices; there are fields that remain relatively insular and can seek to let the next generation know that they are welcome. The chicken and egg cycle can be broken and diversity follows.
Now; does this mean that ANY of us like the idea of people getting into positions, because of their skin colour alone? No. I reckon we'd all be on the same page re' that. In a perfect world; that would never happen / would never have happened.
But the drive for diversity is bigger than that and about a far bigger picture.
Now, as grown ups; I'd assume you'd get all of this but I'm reminded that many people exist in bubbles and have no real reason to step outside them. It's not unique and is quite common. Some might even say it's the generic non-learned stand point.
Awwww bless, you actually think a majority of the country share your views? That's so cute.So you and Sparta; the naive village idiots, as it were; cannot understand that, whilst practically speaking; career paths can be open for all; the reality is that people from certain sectors of society may not see it as a bonafide option; both / or either, consciously or subconsciously. And there is a chicken and egg loop that occurs; wherein kids, young adults, adults; not seeing themselves represented in any given field; feel it's not for them. It takes mavericks like Lewis and his father to break the mould; and suffer the racism / ignorance along the way, knowing that that's just going to be a part of the equation; to hopefully lay foundations that might see results in a generation or two.
Now, in your bubble's; I know that it's a simple equation... can someone go into a career of their choosing? Yes. End of discussion. All the diversity stuff is nonsense, and virtue signalling, woke, b
ks.But in the real world where nuance, unconscious bias, conscious bias and all that it brings, affect real world decisions and choices; there are fields that remain relatively insular and can seek to let the next generation know that they are welcome. The chicken and egg cycle can be broken and diversity follows.
Now; does this mean that ANY of us like the idea of people getting into positions, because of their skin colour alone? No. I reckon we'd all be on the same page re' that. In a perfect world; that would never happen / would never have happened.
But the drive for diversity is bigger than that and about a far bigger picture.
Now, as grown ups; I'd assume you'd get all of this but I'm reminded that many people exist in bubbles and have no real reason to step outside them. It's not unique and is quite common. Some might even say it's the generic non-learned stand point.
Find an area (with average house price below £700,000) who share your views and then tell me who's living in the bubble.
Oh and I never said I don't understand what a diversity drive is, I asked why one is needed. I guess comprehension isn't your strongest point?
You’ve literally got it back to front... I didn’t say the majority shared my views. I said that YOUR view was the generic one.
Keep up at the back.
And I explained why a diversity drive is seen as needed... by seemingly every notable person and org’ in modern F1.
Things are moving in the direction I think they should - and are moving away from the way you think things should be. Gets your goat doesn’t it
faa77 said:
rscott said:
Good job Mercedes aren't suggesting they're going to implement positive discrimination then.
They've been very clear that their plan is to research why they're not get applicants from the widest possible pool and see what they can do to encourage that to happen. They've said they'll continue to hire the very best people, so who knows, the staff demographic may or may not change.
Just because they say that doesn't mean they won't. Hardly going to announce it, are they? (Although some stupid organisations have)They've been very clear that their plan is to research why they're not get applicants from the widest possible pool and see what they can do to encourage that to happen. They've said they'll continue to hire the very best people, so who knows, the staff demographic may or may not change.
This all smells like Mercedes being worried Lewis won't re-sign and doing all this to appease him.
sparta6 said:
Ok vdn, as an employer myself I can see you're still struggling and in consideration of others who may be jaded, I will keep this brief.
1.
When Naomi (Campbell) first broke into mainstream we were delighted but not surprised as we knew her from the times spent hanging together in South London.
Some 7 or 8 months later there was a significant uplift in new black candidates, both male and female, knocking on the industry doors. We susbequently worked with several other black models, both male and female, since that mainstream breakthrough by Naomi.
CUT TO: Motorsport.
Hamilton broke through into mainstream 15 years ago.
But there hasn't been a significant uplift of black candidates knocking on the industry doors.
In a sector where it's all about gaining 0.01 of a second, you would think 15 years is enough time for motivated black talent to step forward into their chosen career and begin knocking on doors.
Equal Opportunity and Discrimination Laws have been in situ for many years.
In the UK at least.
Could it simply be down to different interests, or lack of motivation perhaps ?
I do realise however that humans can find it easier to sit back and blame something else. A particular Government of the day is usually a good place to start.
2.
Your command of prose and punctuation has room for improvement.
See you soon
You keep saying you’ll see me soon. Are you a stalker, a spy or a fantasist. I reckon the latter 1.
When Naomi (Campbell) first broke into mainstream we were delighted but not surprised as we knew her from the times spent hanging together in South London.
Some 7 or 8 months later there was a significant uplift in new black candidates, both male and female, knocking on the industry doors. We susbequently worked with several other black models, both male and female, since that mainstream breakthrough by Naomi.
CUT TO: Motorsport.
Hamilton broke through into mainstream 15 years ago.
But there hasn't been a significant uplift of black candidates knocking on the industry doors.
In a sector where it's all about gaining 0.01 of a second, you would think 15 years is enough time for motivated black talent to step forward into their chosen career and begin knocking on doors.
Equal Opportunity and Discrimination Laws have been in situ for many years.
In the UK at least.
Could it simply be down to different interests, or lack of motivation perhaps ?
I do realise however that humans can find it easier to sit back and blame something else. A particular Government of the day is usually a good place to start.
2.
Your command of prose and punctuation has room for improvement.
See you soon
As for motorsport and F1... the powers that be, teams and almost every notable figure are all agreement... a diversity drive is a good thing.
Must sting.
You think it’s a bad thing; you’ve made that clear... for reasons you can’t properly explain but then, that’s no surprise given you’re comparing being a model to being involved in motorsport.
You’ve been hanging around with models for too long and it’s rubbed off. Thick as two short.
vdn said:
You keep saying you’ll see me soon. Are you a stalker, a spy or a fantasist. I reckon the latter
As for motorsport and F1... the powers that be, teams and almost every notable figure are all agreement... a diversity drive is a good thing.
Must sting.
You think it’s a bad thing; you’ve made that clear... for reasons you can’t properly explain but then, that’s no surprise given you’re comparing being a model to being involved in motorsport.
You’ve been hanging around with models for too long and it’s rubbed off. Thick as two short.
Honestly can't believe you are still interacting with these two. I do however admire your persistence. As for motorsport and F1... the powers that be, teams and almost every notable figure are all agreement... a diversity drive is a good thing.
Must sting.
You think it’s a bad thing; you’ve made that clear... for reasons you can’t properly explain but then, that’s no surprise given you’re comparing being a model to being involved in motorsport.
You’ve been hanging around with models for too long and it’s rubbed off. Thick as two short.
vdn said:
You’ve literally got it back to front... I didn’t say the majority shared my views. I said that YOUR view was the generic one.
No, you said "bubble":vdn said:
You really, truly, are a part of the problem and you're a lost cause. Seems odd that all of F1 are on board with it, but people like you are not. Does it ever make you wonder? You could just stick to the easy path and assume that EVERYONE else is wrong and there's nothing to see here. It's called a bubble and you wouldn't want it popped, I can tell.
referring to the phrase "living in a bubble", implying I live in my own deluded, sheltered world, away from reality.So, you implied you're outside of my bubble and the majority agrees with you.
Not very good at this, are you?
Edited by faa77 on Monday 6th July 22:00
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