Lewis Hamilton (Vol. 2)

[angrymoby]

Bo_apex said:

You disagree with Niki Lauda.
Lauda blamed Hamilton for that mistake and gave him a talking to afterwards.
There's a video interview with Niki about it.

Rosberg himself says 50:50 ...& he should know

[greenarrow]

Bo_apex said:

paulguitar said:

Catatafish said:

Max, as said elsewhere, has had 6 years of not winning titles, and not many races. To have a chance to match Hamilton, he would have had to at least matched Hamilton's progress over the first 6 years in F1.

It's easy to forget how young Max is though. He started in F1 when he was 17!

Extremely young and he's won more than the other Red Bull drivers.
If the RB becomes a contender it would get very interesting.
I think Max would be splitting the Mercs frequently if he was in the Racing Point.

Max has got plenty of time. Lewis had only won 21 of his 92 races by age 28, so Max with his 9 wins at age 23 is in a good place to have a pop at the record.

I see David Coulthard has opened the debate about Lewis and his knighthood. Must admit its difficult to understand how Andy Murray with his 3 grand slam singles wins has got a knighthood, but Lewis with his soon to be 7 world championships and 92 wins hasn't. Andy Murray is younger than Lewis too....

[vaud]

greenarrow said:

I see David Coulthard has opened the debate about Lewis and his knighthood. Must admit its difficult to understand how Andy Murray with his 3 grand slam singles wins has got a knighthood, but Lewis with his soon to be 7 world championships and 92 wins hasn't. Andy Murray is younger than Lewis too....

True, but maybe he has been offered one and declined...

[IforB]

Hamilton is definitely worthy of a knighthood. There's no doubt about it at all, especially if you think about some of the other people who have been given them.

He is truly one of the best of all time in a massively competitive sport. If Knighthoods are about being world-class, he smashed through that years ago, let alone now.

[angrymoby]

greenarrow said:

Max has got plenty of time. Lewis had only won 21 of his 92 races by age 28, so Max with his 9 wins at age 23 is in a good place to have a pop at the record.

I see David Coulthard has opened the debate about Lewis and his knighthood. Must admit its difficult to understand how Andy Murray with his 3 grand slam singles wins has got a knighthood, but Lewis with his soon to be 7 world championships and 92 wins hasn't. Andy Murray is younger than Lewis too....

Both Hamilton (& Vettel) had one in the bag at 23 ...how long do you think it will be before Max is in a championship winning car? (i reckon 3 years)

That leaves him 10-12 years to beat whatever Hamilton achieves (x8 WDC's?) ...thats a tall order imo

[HustleRussell]

angrymoby said:

greenarrow said:

Max has got plenty of time. Lewis had only won 21 of his 92 races by age 28, so Max with his 9 wins at age 23 is in a good place to have a pop at the record.

I see David Coulthard has opened the debate about Lewis and his knighthood. Must admit its difficult to understand how Andy Murray with his 3 grand slam singles wins has got a knighthood, but Lewis with his soon to be 7 world championships and 92 wins hasn't. Andy Murray is younger than Lewis too....

Both Hamilton (& Vettel) had one in the bag at 23 ...how long do you think it will be before Max is in a championship winning car? (i reckon 3 years)

That leaves him 10-12 years to beat whatever Hamilton achieves (x8 WDC's?) ...thats a tall order imo

Who would've predicted Schumacher's records being surpassed within 15 years?

Maybe Hamilton's will stand for longer- they certainly should if FOM achieves its target of making F1 results much less predictable and the cars much closer together in performance.

Maybe we should hope that Hamilton remains the all time high scorer?

[anonymous-user]

angrymoby said:

Both Hamilton (& Vettel) had one in the bag at 23 ...how long do you think it will be before Max is in a championship winning car? (i reckon 3 years)

That leaves him 10-12 years to beat whatever Hamilton achieves (x8 WDC's?) ...thats a tall order imo

Moot point as I can't see any team totally dominating an entire era again. Not to say it won't happen, but it's such an outlier, it means the records are unlikely to be broken.

(Unless, of course, someone finds out Mercedes have been cheating throughout the whole hybrid era)

[IforB]

angrymoby said:

greenarrow said:

Max has got plenty of time. Lewis had only won 21 of his 92 races by age 28, so Max with his 9 wins at age 23 is in a good place to have a pop at the record.

I see David Coulthard has opened the debate about Lewis and his knighthood. Must admit its difficult to understand how Andy Murray with his 3 grand slam singles wins has got a knighthood, but Lewis with his soon to be 7 world championships and 92 wins hasn't. Andy Murray is younger than Lewis too....

Both Hamilton (& Vettel) had one in the bag at 23 ...how long do you think it will be before Max is in a championship winning car? (i reckon 3 years)

That leaves him 10-12 years to beat whatever Hamilton achieves (x8 WDC's?) ...thats a tall order imo

Max could do it. However, I think it is unlikely. He simply hasn't got the chance to beat Hamilton right now and that is not going to change in the near future either.

He's good, but Hamilton + Merc = unbeatable at the moment.

[Halmyre]

greenarrow said:

Bo_apex said:

paulguitar said:

Catatafish said:

Max, as said elsewhere, has had 6 years of not winning titles, and not many races. To have a chance to match Hamilton, he would have had to at least matched Hamilton's progress over the first 6 years in F1.

It's easy to forget how young Max is though. He started in F1 when he was 17!

Extremely young and he's won more than the other Red Bull drivers.
If the RB becomes a contender it would get very interesting.
I think Max would be splitting the Mercs frequently if he was in the Racing Point.

Max has got plenty of time. Lewis had only won 21 of his 92 races by age 28, so Max with his 9 wins at age 23 is in a good place to have a pop at the record.

I see David Coulthard has opened the debate about Lewis and his knighthood. Must admit its difficult to understand how Andy Murray with his 3 grand slam singles wins has got a knighthood, but Lewis with his soon to be 7 world championships and 92 wins hasn't. Andy Murray is younger than Lewis too....

Murray is first (male) Briton to win a Grand Slam since 1936, first Briton to win an Olympic Gold in men's tennis since 1908 (and the only player to have won two Olympic golds) and part of the first British Davis Cup team to win since 1936. These are significant achievements, and Murray has gained them through his own physical efforts.

By contrast, Hamilton's achievements will be seen as being partly down to technology, the proportion of the 'partly' being open to debate. But if he keeps his nose clean and is prepared to wait for 29 years, as Stewart did, or 38 years, as Moss did, he might get the summons to the palace.

Sirs: Stewart, Moss, Brabham
CBE: Mansell, Surtees
OBE: Stewart, Clark, Moss, Surtees, Hill G., Hill D., Brabham
MBE: Button, Hamilton, Surtees

[Jerham]

I thought it would never happen because of the whole tax avoidance thing.

[Bo_apex]

MarkwG said:

Bo_apex said:

HustleRussell said:

Bo_apex said:

Yup.
Hamilton also has some red mist moments.
Barcelona 2016 for instance.
Everyone is human.

? Barcelona where Rosberg realized he was in the wrong engine mode and desperately drove at the inside of the track on a line which was not at all similar to the normal racing line to block Hamilton, who had seen him de-rating and already committed to the inside move?

I'd suggest you'd have to go much further back to find an example of a Hamilton 'red mist' moment, and you'll find nothing like the Vettel Baku sideswipe etc.

You disagree with Niki Lauda.
Lauda blamed Hamilton for that mistake and gave him a talking to afterwards.
There's a video interview with Niki about it.

Lauda actually said it was more Lewis than Nico, so a shared responsibility. He also said that Lewis's mistake was going inside, rather than outside when it was clear Nico was down of power. The "talking to" was a discussion with both of them, followed by an invite to Lewis to discuss it further to understand Laudas position.

That's right.
Hamilton was impatient, a bit of red mist clouded his judgement. Happens to everyone.

[thegreenhell]

Jerham said:

I thought it would never happen because of the whole tax avoidance thing.

Like Sir Jackie Stewart who spent most of his career living in Switzerland to avoid tax? Tax rates were much, much higher back then, though.

[paulguitar]

Bo_apex said:

That's right.
Hamilton was impatient, a bit of red mist clouded his judgement. Happens to everyone.

It happens to Hamilton demonstrably less than most other drivers, particularly at the very sharp end. That's one of his greatest strengths.

Your oft-repeated example is not even a very good one, the protagonists themselves were prepared to share the blame.

[Cpb1702]

Brits love a loser!

We all love Gazza. Won nothing, drunk, cheat and wife beater. Lewis is a Brit, came from nothing, doesn’t cheat, has amazing talent. The best of all time in his sport. We don’t have that many of that standing we should cherish him.

[Bo_apex]

paulguitar said:

Bo_apex said:

That's right.
Hamilton was impatient, a bit of red mist clouded his judgement. Happens to everyone.

It happens to Hamilton demonstrably less than most other drivers, particularly at the very sharp end. That's one of his greatest strengths.

Your oft-repeated example is not even a very good one, the protagonists themselves were prepared to share the blame.

He's certainly improved since his McLaren days of regular contact with Massa & co.
Almost Prost-esq now

[paulguitar]

Bo_apex said:

He's certainly improved since his McLaren days of regular contact with Massa & co.
Almost Prost-esq now

He had that season in 2011 where he appeared to be drawn to Massa like a magnet! I think he's learned from his mistakes and worked exceptionally hard at improving in every area. That is certainly what his colleagues at Mercedes say.

[vdn]

paulguitar said:

Bo_apex said:

He's certainly improved since his McLaren days of regular contact with Massa & co.
Almost Prost-esq now

He had that season in 2011 where he appeared to be drawn to Massa like a magnet! I think he's learned from his mistakes and worked exceptionally hard at improving in every area. That is certainly what his colleagues at Mercedes say.

Merc team personnel have said he’s obsessive over every detail, looking to maximise every angle. His work ethic is unrivalled by all accounts, which is surprising as he might easily be able to take his foot off the gas, as it were.

[MarkwG]

Bo_apex said:

MarkwG said:

Bo_apex said:

HustleRussell said:

Bo_apex said:

Yup.
Hamilton also has some red mist moments.
Barcelona 2016 for instance.
Everyone is human.

? Barcelona where Rosberg realized he was in the wrong engine mode and desperately drove at the inside of the track on a line which was not at all similar to the normal racing line to block Hamilton, who had seen him de-rating and already committed to the inside move?

I'd suggest you'd have to go much further back to find an example of a Hamilton 'red mist' moment, and you'll find nothing like the Vettel Baku sideswipe etc.

You disagree with Niki Lauda.
Lauda blamed Hamilton for that mistake and gave him a talking to afterwards.
There's a video interview with Niki about it.

Lauda actually said it was more Lewis than Nico, so a shared responsibility. He also said that Lewis's mistake was going inside, rather than outside when it was clear Nico was down of power. The "talking to" was a discussion with both of them, followed by an invite to Lewis to discuss it further to understand Laudas position.

That's right.
Hamilton was impatient, a bit of red mist clouded his judgement. Happens to everyone.

It does, but that's not the only interpretation: he saw the opportunity to pass, but chose the wrong side to pass on. If he'd gone left & succeeded, then everyone would be applauding...they're paid to race, after all.

[Halmyre]

thegreenhell said:

Jerham said:

I thought it would never happen because of the whole tax avoidance thing.

Like Sir Jackie Stewart who spent most of his career living in Switzerland to avoid tax? Tax rates were much, much higher back then, though.

That might explain the delay in Stewart's knighthood; he's been back in the UK for a few years now.

[anonymous-user]

Didn't Stewart get special dispensation to come back to the UK for Clark's funeral without getting clobbered for tax? Or did I dream that?