The House of Chaos - a mini-renovation thread
Discussion
That's right - thanks to lockdown-related overtime as a key worker, coupled with the inability to spunk money up the wall on car and plane related stuff, I've finally adulted and provisionally bought a house.
The legal eagles are currently going through the paperwork side of things, but barring any nasty surprises it ought to end up mine soon.
The current owners have decorated the place prior to selling, as you do, but there's a few things I'll be wanting to change, alter or improve so I thought I'd start a thread both to chart progress and ask for advice where needed.
The house itself is in a crescent/alcove, in the middle of a quiet estate near my work on the outskirts of Liverpool - the idea being that I can cycle to work and can almost pay the mortgage with my current spend on diesel and the MiseryFlow bridge tolls (currently I commute from the family home in South Cheshire).
The house is a good, solid 1960s Corporation house - every single internal wall is solid brick (!) which is somewhat of a contrast to the new-builds several friends have bought where you can practically see through the internal walls....
Importantly the houses in this road are all now privately owned by decent folk - the current owners are moving literally 10 doors down, to an end house with a 5x bigger garden... this tells me that there can't be anything drastically wrong with the area!
With a 2 car driveway (or 3 if I paved over the lawn) and plenty of visitor parking spaces around the "grass island" in the middle of the crescent, it's also ideal for when I have various PH friends over to visit (when I'm eventually allowed again).
Some pictures:
So, what needs doing to it then?
Well, first of all, the kitchen has been repainted but none of the hardware has been touched. Whilst the fridge and cooker are relatively new, the units and worktop look as though they date back to the 80s. I initially thought I would get away with replacing just the doors, however on closer inspection the insides of the units are all pretty grotty too, so I might as well rip the whole lot out and start from scratch. This is something I really wasn't aiming to do, however I have the benefit of my father having a lifetime's worth of contacts in the home improvements trade, and will luckily will be able to get a new kitchen done for a fraction of the retail. It does also allow me to modernise it somewhat, with a modern integrated over/hob and a single stack of drawers.
Due to the size of the kitchen, the freezer and washing machine will need to go in the utility room, as the previous owners had them (the photo from inside it is taken from where the machines would be). Currently though this is a mess of exposed pipes and cables everywhere, which I plan to neaten up by boxing them in. it would e way too much work to board or plaster out the room to neaten up the walls, but I do need to try and do something as they are horribly rough at the minute and will attract dust and dirt no end. The floor in there is also pretty minging and will want replacing with home heavy duty lino.
The second main priority is the toilet. Like seemingly a lot of houses of this era, there is no sink in the same room as the toilet itself. Personally I can't think of anything more grim than having to undo the door and saunter into the next room to wash your hands after having a good wipe
Unfortunately, here we hit a snag - the swing of the door is such that there is nowhere in the room to physically put a sink.
My plan therefore is to bin the solid door and replace it with a bifold door. This will then allow me to put a corner sink on the wall adjoining the bathroom, which means I can easily run pipes through the wall from the bathroom sink on the other side. It's not ideal, but because the walls and floor in both rooms are so nicely tiled already, I dont want to just knock them through.
So, my question is - do you have to install top and bottom tracks for a bifold door, or can you get free-hanging ones? My googling has been inconclusive on the matter and i'd appreciate some expert advice as even if they do exist, I imagine fitting them to line up properly will be "fun".
Finally for now - the back gate is well and truly knackered and rotten. Rather than another flimsy wood one, I have seen companies that do recycled plastic fence panels and gates, that look exactly like painted wood but with none of the maintenance. I imagine they are more solid form a security point of view too. However, they seem to be fearsomely expensive (about 350 quid for a 2m tall one!), so I would have to ask - are they really, really, worth it for the difference they make?
As we get further down the road, I shall be adding some more jobs I plan to do and no doubt will have some more questions. In the meantime, any advice would be gratefully received!
The legal eagles are currently going through the paperwork side of things, but barring any nasty surprises it ought to end up mine soon.
The current owners have decorated the place prior to selling, as you do, but there's a few things I'll be wanting to change, alter or improve so I thought I'd start a thread both to chart progress and ask for advice where needed.
The house itself is in a crescent/alcove, in the middle of a quiet estate near my work on the outskirts of Liverpool - the idea being that I can cycle to work and can almost pay the mortgage with my current spend on diesel and the MiseryFlow bridge tolls (currently I commute from the family home in South Cheshire).
The house is a good, solid 1960s Corporation house - every single internal wall is solid brick (!) which is somewhat of a contrast to the new-builds several friends have bought where you can practically see through the internal walls....
Importantly the houses in this road are all now privately owned by decent folk - the current owners are moving literally 10 doors down, to an end house with a 5x bigger garden... this tells me that there can't be anything drastically wrong with the area!
With a 2 car driveway (or 3 if I paved over the lawn) and plenty of visitor parking spaces around the "grass island" in the middle of the crescent, it's also ideal for when I have various PH friends over to visit (when I'm eventually allowed again).
Some pictures:
So, what needs doing to it then?
Well, first of all, the kitchen has been repainted but none of the hardware has been touched. Whilst the fridge and cooker are relatively new, the units and worktop look as though they date back to the 80s. I initially thought I would get away with replacing just the doors, however on closer inspection the insides of the units are all pretty grotty too, so I might as well rip the whole lot out and start from scratch. This is something I really wasn't aiming to do, however I have the benefit of my father having a lifetime's worth of contacts in the home improvements trade, and will luckily will be able to get a new kitchen done for a fraction of the retail. It does also allow me to modernise it somewhat, with a modern integrated over/hob and a single stack of drawers.
Due to the size of the kitchen, the freezer and washing machine will need to go in the utility room, as the previous owners had them (the photo from inside it is taken from where the machines would be). Currently though this is a mess of exposed pipes and cables everywhere, which I plan to neaten up by boxing them in. it would e way too much work to board or plaster out the room to neaten up the walls, but I do need to try and do something as they are horribly rough at the minute and will attract dust and dirt no end. The floor in there is also pretty minging and will want replacing with home heavy duty lino.
The second main priority is the toilet. Like seemingly a lot of houses of this era, there is no sink in the same room as the toilet itself. Personally I can't think of anything more grim than having to undo the door and saunter into the next room to wash your hands after having a good wipe
Unfortunately, here we hit a snag - the swing of the door is such that there is nowhere in the room to physically put a sink.
My plan therefore is to bin the solid door and replace it with a bifold door. This will then allow me to put a corner sink on the wall adjoining the bathroom, which means I can easily run pipes through the wall from the bathroom sink on the other side. It's not ideal, but because the walls and floor in both rooms are so nicely tiled already, I dont want to just knock them through.
So, my question is - do you have to install top and bottom tracks for a bifold door, or can you get free-hanging ones? My googling has been inconclusive on the matter and i'd appreciate some expert advice as even if they do exist, I imagine fitting them to line up properly will be "fun".
Finally for now - the back gate is well and truly knackered and rotten. Rather than another flimsy wood one, I have seen companies that do recycled plastic fence panels and gates, that look exactly like painted wood but with none of the maintenance. I imagine they are more solid form a security point of view too. However, they seem to be fearsomely expensive (about 350 quid for a 2m tall one!), so I would have to ask - are they really, really, worth it for the difference they make?
As we get further down the road, I shall be adding some more jobs I plan to do and no doubt will have some more questions. In the meantime, any advice would be gratefully received!
as to the whb in the loo
why not look at a toilet with a basin in the top of the cistern?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2in1-Cloakroom-Space-Sa...
why not look at a toilet with a basin in the top of the cistern?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2in1-Cloakroom-Space-Sa...
There is easily enough room to but a basin (sinks are kitchens and utility rooms...) in that toilet. Under the window, in the corner behind the door, open the door outwards or move the door along the wall. You don’t need to open the door fully flush with the wall it currently opens onto and basins can be as little as 150mm deep.
Thanks for the replies everyone!
I'm not seriously contemplating paving over the lawn, however I am tempted to embed plastic grids in it so that a car can be parked on it if needed without ruining it.
Re kitchens - I contemplated ex display, but luckily I can get a fully tailored one so cheaply that it isn't worth the extra hassle of trying to make a generic one fit.
I'm intrigued on the bathroom door - please tell me more about why a Bi-fold won't work properly/ wont be suitable?
I have looked at swapping the door 180 degrees, it is certainly a good idea however I'd need to measure the arc to see if it would give enough extra room (the room is only as wide as the open door). There is also the thought that it may be a bit odd having to walk in, press yourself into the corner than shut the door again to get to the toilet? Unfortunately having the door open outwards isn't practical because it is right at the top of the stairs and so would be a major safety issue (and would apparently be picked up on by a survey of the next people to buy the house).
However, having the door sliding is a consideration, obviously a bit more work than bifold but still very doable. Can someone tell e please how it works with a sliding one - how does it latch, and does it fit in the existing frame or stand adjacent to it?
I'm not seriously contemplating paving over the lawn, however I am tempted to embed plastic grids in it so that a car can be parked on it if needed without ruining it.
Re kitchens - I contemplated ex display, but luckily I can get a fully tailored one so cheaply that it isn't worth the extra hassle of trying to make a generic one fit.
I'm intrigued on the bathroom door - please tell me more about why a Bi-fold won't work properly/ wont be suitable?
I have looked at swapping the door 180 degrees, it is certainly a good idea however I'd need to measure the arc to see if it would give enough extra room (the room is only as wide as the open door). There is also the thought that it may be a bit odd having to walk in, press yourself into the corner than shut the door again to get to the toilet? Unfortunately having the door open outwards isn't practical because it is right at the top of the stairs and so would be a major safety issue (and would apparently be picked up on by a survey of the next people to buy the house).
However, having the door sliding is a consideration, obviously a bit more work than bifold but still very doable. Can someone tell e please how it works with a sliding one - how does it latch, and does it fit in the existing frame or stand adjacent to it?
ChemicalChaos said:
So, what needs doing to it then?
Well, first of all, the kitchen has been repainted but none of the hardware has been touched. Whilst the fridge and cooker are relatively new, the units and worktop look as though they date back to the 80s. I initially thought I would get away with replacing just the doors, however on closer inspection the insides of the units are all pretty grotty too, so I might as well rip the whole lot out and start from scratch. This is something I really wasn't aiming to do, however I have the benefit of my father having a lifetime's worth of contacts in the home improvements trade, and will luckily will be able to get a new kitchen done for a fraction of the retail. It does also allow me to modernise it somewhat, with a modern integrated over/hob and a single stack of drawers.
Due to the size of the kitchen, the freezer and washing machine will need to go in the utility room, as the previous owners had them (the photo from inside it is taken from where the machines would be). Currently though this is a mess of exposed pipes and cables everywhere, which I plan to neaten up by boxing them in. it would e way too much work to board or plaster out the room to neaten up the walls, but I do need to try and do something as they are horribly rough at the minute and will attract dust and dirt no end. The floor in there is also pretty minging and will want replacing with home heavy duty lino.
The second main priority is the toilet. Like seemingly a lot of houses of this era, there is no sink in the same room as the toilet itself. Personally I can't think of anything more grim than having to undo the door and saunter into the next room to wash your hands after having a good wipe
Unfortunately, here we hit a snag - the swing of the door is such that there is nowhere in the room to physically put a sink.
My plan therefore is to bin the solid door and replace it with a bifold door. This will then allow me to put a corner sink on the wall adjoining the bathroom, which means I can easily run pipes through the wall from the bathroom sink on the other side. It's not ideal, but because the walls and floor in both rooms are so nicely tiled already, I dont want to just knock them through.
So, my question is - do you have to install top and bottom tracks for a bifold door, or can you get free-hanging ones? My googling has been inconclusive on the matter and i'd appreciate some expert advice as even if they do exist, I imagine fitting them to line up properly will be "fun".
Finally for now - the back gate is well and truly knackered and rotten. Rather than another flimsy wood one, I have seen companies that do recycled plastic fence panels and gates, that look exactly like painted wood but with none of the maintenance. I imagine they are more solid form a security point of view too. However, they seem to be fearsomely expensive (about 350 quid for a 2m tall one!), so I would have to ask - are they really, really, worth it for the difference they make?
As we get further down the road, I shall be adding some more jobs I plan to do and no doubt will have some more questions. In the meantime, any advice would be gratefully received!
If you don't want to knock though the WC and bathroom, your only real option is to look at a combined WC/cistern sink as someone mentioned above. Well, first of all, the kitchen has been repainted but none of the hardware has been touched. Whilst the fridge and cooker are relatively new, the units and worktop look as though they date back to the 80s. I initially thought I would get away with replacing just the doors, however on closer inspection the insides of the units are all pretty grotty too, so I might as well rip the whole lot out and start from scratch. This is something I really wasn't aiming to do, however I have the benefit of my father having a lifetime's worth of contacts in the home improvements trade, and will luckily will be able to get a new kitchen done for a fraction of the retail. It does also allow me to modernise it somewhat, with a modern integrated over/hob and a single stack of drawers.
Due to the size of the kitchen, the freezer and washing machine will need to go in the utility room, as the previous owners had them (the photo from inside it is taken from where the machines would be). Currently though this is a mess of exposed pipes and cables everywhere, which I plan to neaten up by boxing them in. it would e way too much work to board or plaster out the room to neaten up the walls, but I do need to try and do something as they are horribly rough at the minute and will attract dust and dirt no end. The floor in there is also pretty minging and will want replacing with home heavy duty lino.
The second main priority is the toilet. Like seemingly a lot of houses of this era, there is no sink in the same room as the toilet itself. Personally I can't think of anything more grim than having to undo the door and saunter into the next room to wash your hands after having a good wipe
Unfortunately, here we hit a snag - the swing of the door is such that there is nowhere in the room to physically put a sink.
My plan therefore is to bin the solid door and replace it with a bifold door. This will then allow me to put a corner sink on the wall adjoining the bathroom, which means I can easily run pipes through the wall from the bathroom sink on the other side. It's not ideal, but because the walls and floor in both rooms are so nicely tiled already, I dont want to just knock them through.
So, my question is - do you have to install top and bottom tracks for a bifold door, or can you get free-hanging ones? My googling has been inconclusive on the matter and i'd appreciate some expert advice as even if they do exist, I imagine fitting them to line up properly will be "fun".
Finally for now - the back gate is well and truly knackered and rotten. Rather than another flimsy wood one, I have seen companies that do recycled plastic fence panels and gates, that look exactly like painted wood but with none of the maintenance. I imagine they are more solid form a security point of view too. However, they seem to be fearsomely expensive (about 350 quid for a 2m tall one!), so I would have to ask - are they really, really, worth it for the difference they make?
As we get further down the road, I shall be adding some more jobs I plan to do and no doubt will have some more questions. In the meantime, any advice would be gratefully received!
A sliding door is a non-starter unless you have a wall-pocket for it to go into. Forget about a bi-fold door - they are crap even with top and bottom tracks, much less just a top track. It will break in 3 months and you will regret it - trust me.
Sounds like you have the kitchen sorted via your old man - use basic Ikea carcasses (which last for ages) and spend more on the doors/ironmongery.
You say that boarding out the utility room is too much work, but just plan out what you could do by fixing 2x2" timbers to the existing, and quickly boarding over. Guessing it would be easier and quicker. Don't need a full plaster coat in a utility room, just skim it and paint.
To answer your question on the £350/m plastic gate/fence - no!! Total nonsense - the only reason it could be judged better than a timber fence is if it was harder to scale and it isn't. As long as you are prepared to coat your timber fence every couple of years with the current equivalent of creosote you'll be on the same level. Money would be better spent planting a Hawthorn hedge along the fence line and cultivating it, plus a decent set of heat/movement triggered spotlights and CCTV system.
Timber or plastic, anyone who wants to get over a 6ft fence will do so, all we can do is discourage them with spiky plants, lights and CCTV.
Also, if you can afford it, don't do lino in the utility. Spend a bit extra if you can on some levelling screed and either clay tiles, or if you can push it, Welsh slate. You won't regret it.
Good luck!!
ChemicalChaos said:
That's right - thanks to lockdown-related overtime as a key worker, coupled with the inability to spunk money up the wall on car and plane related stuff, I've finally adulted and [b]provisionally bought a house.
The legal eagles are currently going through the paperwork side of things, but barring any nasty surprises it ought to end up mine soon.[/b]
How did this go CC, is it yours or is it still going through the process?The legal eagles are currently going through the paperwork side of things, but barring any nasty surprises it ought to end up mine soon.[/b]
ChemicalChaos said:
I'm intrigued on the bathroom door - please tell me more about why a Bi-fold won't work properly/ wont be suitable?
Because any internal bi-fold will leave an exposed gap on two plains, the centre split and below. You can fit one, but anyone on your landing and stairs is going to hear whatever you're doing in there.LaurasOtherHalf said:
ChemicalChaos said:
I'm intrigued on the bathroom door - please tell me more about why a Bi-fold won't work properly/ wont be suitable?
Because any internal bi-fold will leave an exposed gap on two plains, the centre split and below. You can fit one, but anyone on your landing and stairs is going to hear whatever you're doing in there.After looking around I went for the wickes one £70 or there about, door and track, but even when fitted correctly it doesn’t sit flush in the lining, we had the same issue years ago on a new build site that had them on cupboards where they should only be IMO but again all of them were playing up after a few weeks.
Certainly no good for a heavy use door way.
OzzyR1 said:
ChemicalChaos said:
That's right - thanks to lockdown-related overtime as a key worker, coupled with the inability to spunk money up the wall on car and plane related stuff, I've finally adulted and [b]provisionally bought a house.
The legal eagles are currently going through the paperwork side of things, but barring any nasty surprises it ought to end up mine soon.[/b]
How did this go CC, is it yours or is it still going through the process?The legal eagles are currently going through the paperwork side of things, but barring any nasty surprises it ought to end up mine soon.[/b]
The answer is, very slowly!
A few days after accepting my offer, the vendors went on holiday abroad for a month, making contact rather difficult.
Since they have returned, their solicitors still seem to be operating with the speed of an amputee sloth on valium. My solictors sent them a virtual kick in the arse last week, I hope to recieve the initial drafts next week along with a proper survey finally being carried out.
Promised Land said:
LaurasOtherHalf said:
ChemicalChaos said:
I'm intrigued on the bathroom door - please tell me more about why a Bi-fold won't work properly/ wont be suitable?
Because any internal bi-fold will leave an exposed gap on two plains, the centre split and below. You can fit one, but anyone on your landing and stairs is going to hear whatever you're doing in there.After looking around I went for the wickes one £70 or there about, door and track, but even when fitted correctly it doesn’t sit flush in the lining, we had the same issue years ago on a new build site that had them on cupboards where they should only be IMO but again all of them were playing up after a few weeks.
Certainly no good for a heavy use door way.
I need to go back and measure up to see if having the door open inwards is a possibilty. If not, it looks like I will be looking at the idea of a cistern sink.
I've spent this afternoon furniture browsing online. I started looking at washing machines, freezers and sofas etc...... I may or may not have ended up looking at art deco cocktail cabinets, display cases for all my models, and shotgun cabinets
ST12AT said:
There is easily enough room to but a basin (sinks are kitchens and utility rooms...) in that toilet. Under the window, in the corner behind the door, open the door outwards or move the door along the wall. You don’t need to open the door fully flush with the wall it currently opens onto and basins can be as little as 150mm deep.
This. You can get very small basins that will work. For hand washing only you really don't need much space at all.I remember seeing one basin that was designed to be built into a stud wall so that it projected only a few inches into the room.
ChemicalChaos said:
I've spent this afternoon furniture browsing online. I started looking at washing machines, freezers and sofas etc...... I may or may not have ended up looking at art deco cocktail cabinets, display cases for all my models, and shotgun cabinets
Well that's the thing Mat, it's all very well having grand plans but you've got to live in it too! Our pile is my lifetime's work, first thing I did was fit the home cinema though (well, after fixing the heating and hot water)!
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