Watching F1 on TV

Watching F1 on TV

Author
Discussion

TheDeuce

9,108 posts

31 months

Tuesday 16th February
quotequote all
Derek Smith said:
budgie smuggler said:
hehe

And in answer to the VPN question, no, I get almost identical throughput & no issues with dropouts. I'm with PIA.
Thanks for that. I'll give it a go.

I've been told Cyber Ghost is well recommended. Anyone with any experience?
I've been with expressVPN for years, very good. They also change their server IP's very often so the likes of iPlayer generally can't keep up so can't block them smile

All VPNs tended to be slow and flakey years ago, but most mainstream providers are really pretty decent now. I'm sure there is still some lag but not so much that I notice it.

Eric Mc

115,007 posts

230 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
Didn't PH once ban people from posting hints and tips on how to "cheat" in order to watch F1 live?

Have they changed their mind on this and now given the OK for people to openly discuss how to circumvent Sky's hold on live TV coverage of F1 in the UK?

Derek Smith

Original Poster:

39,227 posts

213 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
I checked up on this before posting.

Installing and using a VPN is not illegal in the UK.

Circumventing IP location blocking is not illegal.

I can see nothing wrong, either ethically or morally, in doing so.

Exige77

6,073 posts

156 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
TheDeuce said:
Derek Smith said:
budgie smuggler said:
hehe

And in answer to the VPN question, no, I get almost identical throughput & no issues with dropouts. I'm with PIA.
Thanks for that. I'll give it a go.

I've been told Cyber Ghost is well recommended. Anyone with any experience?
I've been with expressVPN for years, very good. They also change their server IP's very often so the likes of iPlayer generally can't keep up so can't block them smile

All VPNs tended to be slow and flakey years ago, but most mainstream providers are really pretty decent now. I'm sure there is still some lag but not so much that I notice it.
Another ExpressVPN user here. Pretty good.

Eric Mc

115,007 posts

230 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
Derek Smith said:
I checked up on this before posting.

Installing and using a VPN is not illegal in the UK.

Circumventing IP location blocking is not illegal.

I can see nothing wrong, either ethically or morally, in doing so.
I wasn't intending to discuss the legality. I was asking if Pistonheads had changed their approach to this topic.

TheDeuce

9,108 posts

31 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
Derek Smith said:
I checked up on this before posting.

Installing and using a VPN is not illegal in the UK.

Circumventing IP location blocking is not illegal.

I can see nothing wrong, either ethically or morally, in doing so.
I wasn't intending to discuss the legality. I was asking if Pistonheads had changed their approach to this topic.
I'd be very surprised if PH had any policy regarding the discussion of using VPN specifically, the site itself uses the same basic technologies for security - as we all ideally should.

There are also countless examples of needing to circumvent geo location using a VPN to legally gain access to content (iplayer etc) you are entitled to access but are prevented access due to over zealous digital rights management.

Discussing 'stealing' access to paid content via any method, with/without VPN being part of that method, is obviously something PH admin can't knowingly allow. That's not to say I'd hope to see good members outright banned if they lead a discussion to a grey area, there are less crude and equally effective ways to prevent any posts that could get PH in to hot water.

Derek Smith

Original Poster:

39,227 posts

213 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
TheDeuce said:
I'd be very surprised if PH had any policy regarding the discussion of using VPN specifically, the site itself uses the same basic technologies for security - as we all ideally should.

There are also countless examples of needing to circumvent geo location using a VPN to legally gain access to content (iplayer etc) you are entitled to access but are prevented access due to over zealous digital rights management.

Discussing 'stealing' access to paid content via any method, with/without VPN being part of that method, is obviously something PH admin can't knowingly allow. That's not to say I'd hope to see good members outright banned if they lead a discussion to a grey area, there are less crude and equally effective ways to prevent any posts that could get PH in to hot water.
It's not stealing. That's not a grey area.

I've got a good friend who's a lawyer. She is rarely definitive; even though I've known her for years, any comment on legal matters is normally couched in terms of source, or 'it seems', but with VPNs, she's about as specific as she gets. With regards to accessing foreign TV stations, it is accessing free to air, so it isn't paid.

It's fair to say that legislation drags behind modern innovations, but it has always been that way. A company, concerned that they are losing their ability to take money from the public, will fund a political party, or even two, and encourage them to legislate away another freedom from those it represents. Until then, enjoy.

I would point out that this is nothing new. A neighbour had a mobile dish, back in the day, and could access free to air broadcasts from satellites on the continent. It was instructive but not particularly useful for viewing F1 when it was free to air in the UK.

PH can, of course, do what it wants, as long as it is not proscribed by law, and remove any posts they wish, although perhaps not for any reason. The same, however, goes for us. As a general – but not dependable – rule, if it is not banned, it is allowed.

Fundoreen

2,241 posts

48 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
Solution to this seems to be find cheapest country in the world to subscribe to F1 player. Move there during the F1 season.
Its probably sunny as well.

Eric Mc

115,007 posts

230 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
TheDeuce said:
I'd be very surprised if PH had any policy regarding the discussion of using VPN specifically, the site itself uses the same basic technologies for security - as we all ideally should.

There are also countless examples of needing to circumvent geo location using a VPN to legally gain access to content (iplayer etc) you are entitled to access but are prevented access due to over zealous digital rights management.

Discussing 'stealing' access to paid content via any method, with/without VPN being part of that method, is obviously something PH admin can't knowingly allow. That's not to say I'd hope to see good members outright banned if they lead a discussion to a grey area, there are less crude and equally effective ways to prevent any posts that could get PH in to hot water.
So, PH doesn't mind if you do it one way but do mind when you do the same thing using a different method.

That makes sense.

It's not WHAT you do but the WAY that you do it.

Sounds like a song.

TheDeuce

9,108 posts

31 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
TheDeuce said:
I'd be very surprised if PH had any policy regarding the discussion of using VPN specifically, the site itself uses the same basic technologies for security - as we all ideally should.

There are also countless examples of needing to circumvent geo location using a VPN to legally gain access to content (iplayer etc) you are entitled to access but are prevented access due to over zealous digital rights management.

Discussing 'stealing' access to paid content via any method, with/without VPN being part of that method, is obviously something PH admin can't knowingly allow. That's not to say I'd hope to see good members outright banned if they lead a discussion to a grey area, there are less crude and equally effective ways to prevent any posts that could get PH in to hot water.
So, PH doesn't mind if you do it one way but do mind when you do the same thing using a different method.

That makes sense.

It's not WHAT you do but the WAY that you do it.

Sounds like a song.
I think you've got it a bit back to front. stealing is stealing, regardless the method and PH will no doubt not tolerate too much in the way of 'how to guides'.

That doesn't mean there is anything wrong with discussing the practical and legitimate uses of a VPN on the forum.

Eric Mc

115,007 posts

230 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
Is watching F1 live on TV in the UK OK outside of Sky or Now TV?

TheDeuce

9,108 posts

31 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
Is watching F1 live on TV in the UK OK outside of Sky or Now TV?
Depends on the conditions of viewing set by whichever source you're watching - and the legality of that source of course.

If you're referring to the practice of aligning one's dish to pick up overseas transmissions, that really is a grey area as who is in the wrong? If their signal is making it in to a territory in which Sky pay for exclusive rights then I suppose that's a problem for Sky to deal with... But it's really just a limit of satellite TV technology. There are no rules saying all streams have to be encrypted, and those that are not will fall beyond and become watchable by those outside of their target audience.

aston80

192 posts

6 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
snotrag said:
I must admit I avoided NowTV (and sky!) for years but this year I buckled at the promise of 3 or even 4 races a month at times. I've been really happy, and actually very happy with what I paid for.

I am tempted to cancel it from now until March when the season starts, but I'm currently on a deal at £25p/m (Sky sports only) until Oct 2021.

What is everyone paying? Reckon its worth me paying another £75 between now and March to probably not use it, or try and get another deal in March?

How much is everyone else paying for NowTV?
I'm paying Sky £33/month for sports, entertainment, documentaries, boxsets, HD.

Edited by aston80 on Wednesday 17th February 16:37

2 sMoKiN bArReLs

26,331 posts

200 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
I watched six hours of classic Brazilian GP on Sunday. hehe

The Sky offering is good off season too!

Derek Smith

Original Poster:

39,227 posts

213 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
TheDeuce said:
Depends on the conditions of viewing set by whichever source you're watching - and the legality of that source of course.

If you're referring to the practice of aligning one's dish to pick up overseas transmissions, that really is a grey area as who is in the wrong? If their signal is making it in to a territory in which Sky pay for exclusive rights then I suppose that's a problem for Sky to deal with... But it's really just a limit of satellite TV technology. There are no rules saying all streams have to be encrypted, and those that are not will fall beyond and become watchable by those outside of their target audience.
I'm not so sure it is grey any more.

There was a challenge in civil courts over this. Memories fade, but to the best of my recollection, a pub turned its dish to the continent, and paid for access in that country, which was substantially lower than that in the UK. I think it was challenged on the grounds that something for sale in one part of the EU cannot be sold at a higher price in a different part (subject to minor cost implications). It seems that the pub - the action was funded by a collection of pubs - might have won, but there was an appeal threatened by Sky. Can't have governments telling them what they can and cannot do. It was Murdoch's job to tell governments.

Scrump

13,437 posts

123 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
Didn't PH once ban people from posting hints and tips on how to "cheat" in order to watch F1 live?

Have they changed their mind on this and now given the OK for people to openly discuss how to circumvent Sky's hold on live TV coverage of F1 in the UK?
The rules haven’t changed:
Do not post any copyright-protected material without permission including streaming sports content. If in doubt, don't post it.
Do not post links to sites that supply illegal download material.

TheDeuce

9,108 posts

31 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
Derek Smith said:
TheDeuce said:
Depends on the conditions of viewing set by whichever source you're watching - and the legality of that source of course.

If you're referring to the practice of aligning one's dish to pick up overseas transmissions, that really is a grey area as who is in the wrong? If their signal is making it in to a territory in which Sky pay for exclusive rights then I suppose that's a problem for Sky to deal with... But it's really just a limit of satellite TV technology. There are no rules saying all streams have to be encrypted, and those that are not will fall beyond and become watchable by those outside of their target audience.
I'm not so sure it is grey any more.

There was a challenge in civil courts over this. Memories fade, but to the best of my recollection, a pub turned its dish to the continent, and paid for access in that country, which was substantially lower than that in the UK. I think it was challenged on the grounds that something for sale in one part of the EU cannot be sold at a higher price in a different part (subject to minor cost implications). It seems that the pub - the action was funded by a collection of pubs - might have won, but there was an appeal threatened by Sky. Can't have governments telling them what they can and cannot do. It was Murdoch's job to tell governments.
That's a bit different as the pub probably broke the terms of the agreement they had with the overseas broadcaster (not that the broadcaster would care I wouldn't have thought). I can see why Sky wouldn't have wanted such a precedent set though!

In the case of someone using their dish to pick up a FTV foreign broadcast, there is no agreement that such a person has entered in to which they're breaking. They're not asking 'whoever' to transmit in the direction of their house are they? Until it's declared illegal to own a satellite dish and point it wherever you wish then I can't see what recourse a private homeowner could face. That's what I meant as a grey area - it can't be 100% right and proper that a person is receiving an F1 feed beyond the country that broadcast it and paid for the rights to do so. But there is nothing to be done about it that I can see..

Deesee

5,110 posts

48 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
I use F1 tv for a second screen, there’s a choice of the pit lane channel, on boards and a decent driver tracker. I watch the race on Sky Q.

You can get F1 tv pro on the uk App Store, it’s 60.00£ pa, if you don’t want to watch live and watch the sessions on a delay, the 22.00£ pa pack also works

You will need a decent VPN (I use Nord), as you can not watch the race live if your IP is in the UK, however you can watch it immediately afterwards and still have full functionality in splitting the screen, going on board with any driver etc. It’s a decent service.

There is talk that they are going to add TV pro to sky Q, which would be great, as at the moment im paying for for F1 twice!!

What I don’t agree with is illegal/pirated streams.

ben5575

4,017 posts

186 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
PDP76 said:
I’m going a different way this year.
PS3 no longer supports sky go so had to look at other methods. One of which I’ve tested and works.
Fire stick and :cough: :cough: iptv provider £40 a year and gets me a lot of channels inc sky f1
+1. I've heard it works very well with an android T95 box as well.

TheDeuce

9,108 posts

31 months

Wednesday 17th February
quotequote all
Deesee said:
I use F1 tv for a second screen, there’s a choice of the pit lane channel, on boards and a decent driver tracker. I watch the race on Sky Q.

You can get F1 tv pro on the uk App Store, it’s 60.00£ pa, if you don’t want to watch live and watch the sessions on a delay, the 22.00£ pa pack also works

You will need a decent VPN (I use Nord), as you can not watch the race live if your IP is in the UK, however you can watch it immediately afterwards and still have full functionality in splitting the screen, going on board with any driver etc. It’s a decent service.

There is talk that they are going to add TV pro to sky Q, which would be great, as at the moment im paying for for F1 twice!!

What I don’t agree with is illegal/pirated streams.
You still have to accept the T&C's to use the app and buy the subscription though... And if you red the T&C's in full I'm sure you will find that the £60pa is for certain territories only - so whilst you can pay the sub via the app store and then use a VPN so that F1TV don't realise they're dealing with a UK viewer, you may well still be technically breaking the agreement you accepted the terms of.

BUT... then comes another grey area. F1TV themselves are surely breaking their own agreements with SKY and other exclusive rights holders by using sales channels to sell subs that offer them to people in territories that they have already sold exclusive rights to which should prevent the sale of an F1TV subscription being offered in the first place.