Jamie Chadwick - First competitive female driver in F1?
Discussion
vulture1 said:
Sophia Flörsch
Dismal career record to be honest if she was a bloke no-one would give her a look in for anything f1 related.
If it raises awareness for girls to have a go at karting i see no problem. but i doubt it will.
That's true but she also suffered a lot of mechanical issues. If those were factored in then... she still wouldn't be good enough to climb to F2 tbh - but she has shown the ability to improve and is very self aware and self minded - she denounces the idea of W series which shows she has sod all interest in being a female racer, she just wants to be a racer, which I think is all any serious racer should care about.Dismal career record to be honest if she was a bloke no-one would give her a look in for anything f1 related.
If it raises awareness for girls to have a go at karting i see no problem. but i doubt it will.
I'm cautiously optimistic about her F3 campaign this season. If she can have mostly clean races, if she ends high end of the middle of the pack, then she's going to get some well deserved attention and support - potentially enough sponsorship to progress further.
She won't be part of the generation of female racers that could break F1 - no chance. I doubt even F2 unless she has grown massively in talent whilst we weren't watching. But as you suggest, she could be one of the first that captivates younger girls to 'do what Sophia does'. Most people would say that Jamie has already done that but I can't help thinking that any 7 year olds paying attention to a rising female star might lose interest when she gives up on her F1 goals and basically buggers off to become an obscure but well enough paid driver elsewhere. Sophia seems to want to be challenged by F3 and F3 want her. Thats a tad more inspirational in my book!
vulture1 said:
Sophia Flörsch
Dismal career record to be honest if she was a bloke no-one would give her a look in for anything f1 related.
If it raises awareness for girls to have a go at karting i see no problem. but i doubt it will.
Yet she outperformed Chadwick in FREC by some margin, and Chadwick is championed as some sort of talent.Dismal career record to be honest if she was a bloke no-one would give her a look in for anything f1 related.
If it raises awareness for girls to have a go at karting i see no problem. but i doubt it will.
Your comment about being blokes ring true though, how many claim Lappalainen, Henrion, Malvestiti, Guzman, Pesce etc are being denied opportunities? No one, now contrast that to the many puff pieces moaning about equally as crap female drivers not getting opportunities...
TheDeuce said:
she denounces the idea of W series which shows she has sod all interest in being a female racer, she just wants to be a racer, which I think is all any serious racer should care about.
How exactly does this show she has sod all interest exactly? Bearing in mind at the time of the first W Series "season" (styled like that because 6 races is not a season) she was competing in FREC which is actually a credible series. Why would she step back down to a F4 level series, especially a sub-standard one such as W Series?TheDeuce said:
I'm cautiously optimistic about her F3 campaign this season. If she can have mostly clean races, if she ends high end of the middle of the pack, then she's going to get some well deserved attention and support - potentially enough sponsorship to progress further.
This is pretty much the norm in F3. Even F3 Regional drivers take a season or two to get comfortable in F3 before they start to improve.TheDeuce said:
Most people would say that Jamie has already done
This is the power of propaganda. Jamie has actually achieved less than Sophia has yet were supposed to believe Jamie had a poor upbringing and money held her back despite being more privileged than Sophia .Sophia is the one that did better in FREC outscoring her by almost double, Sophia is the one got into F3 while Jamie was driving in a weaker than F4 series in which she was gifted a drive for being a woman. Chadwick getting a Indy Lights drive is the perfect example of rich woman privilege. Lance Stroll could have only dreamed of the opportunities she was given.TheDeuce said:
Sophia seems to want to be challenged by F3 and F3 want her. That's a tad more inspirational in my book!
Which surely has to be better than F3 wanting Jamie but Jamie not wanting F3 because it doesn't satisfy her pampered rich girl privilege expectation of top F3 team drives.df76 said:
Flörsch qualified 24th today, and Chadwick 17th in first Indy NXT practice. Not an ideal start to the season.
I would perhaps wait until they have both gone through qualifying to compare them... Based purely on these numbers though 24th out of a 31 cars field is better than 17th out of a 19 car field.Peacockantony said:
vulture1 said:
Sophia Flörsch
Dismal career record to be honest if she was a bloke no-one would give her a look in for anything f1 related.
If it raises awareness for girls to have a go at karting i see no problem. but i doubt it will.
Yet she outperformed Chadwick in FREC by some margin, and Chadwick is championed as some sort of talent.Dismal career record to be honest if she was a bloke no-one would give her a look in for anything f1 related.
If it raises awareness for girls to have a go at karting i see no problem. but i doubt it will.
Your comment about being blokes ring true though, how many claim Lappalainen, Henrion, Malvestiti, Guzman, Pesce etc are being denied opportunities? No one, now contrast that to the many puff pieces moaning about equally as crap female drivers not getting opportunities...
TheDeuce said:
she denounces the idea of W series which shows she has sod all interest in being a female racer, she just wants to be a racer, which I think is all any serious racer should care about.
How exactly does this show she has sod all interest exactly? Bearing in mind at the time of the first W Series "season" (styled like that because 6 races is not a season) she was competing in FREC which is actually a credible series. Why would she step back down to a F4 level series, especially a sub-standard one such as W Series?TheDeuce said:
I'm cautiously optimistic about her F3 campaign this season. If she can have mostly clean races, if she ends high end of the middle of the pack, then she's going to get some well deserved attention and support - potentially enough sponsorship to progress further.
This is pretty much the norm in F3. Even F3 Regional drivers take a season or two to get comfortable in F3 before they start to improve.TheDeuce said:
Most people would say that Jamie has already done
This is the power of propaganda. Jamie has actually achieved less than Sophia has yet were supposed to believe Jamie had a poor upbringing and money held her back despite being more privileged than Sophia .Sophia is the one that did better in FREC outscoring her by almost double, Sophia is the one got into F3 while Jamie was driving in a weaker than F4 series in which she was gifted a drive for being a woman. Chadwick getting a Indy Lights drive is the perfect example of rich woman privilege. Lance Stroll could have only dreamed of the opportunities she was given.TheDeuce said:
Sophia seems to want to be challenged by F3 and F3 want her. That's a tad more inspirational in my book!
Which surely has to be better than F3 wanting Jamie but Jamie not wanting F3 because it doesn't satisfy her pampered rich girl privilege expectation of top F3 team drives.df76 said:
Flörsch qualified 24th today, and Chadwick 17th in first Indy NXT practice. Not an ideal start to the season.
I would perhaps wait until they have both gone through qualifying to compare them... Based purely on these numbers though 24th out of a 31 cars field is better than 17th out of a 19 car field.In a nutshell:
- I think Jamie set her sights too low and played safe early, checked out and went for the steady income.
- I think Sophia is the real deal, at least in terms of the evolution of the female racer 'right now'.
- I think you're agreeing with me that F3 would have had Jamie but she didn't want to go there..? It's not clear if you're in agreement with me or not
But anyway, yes I think she knows she could have negotiated a seat quite easily but felt she wouldn't do well - so in terms of income it was safer to go the more commercial US route than be defeated in F3.
I basically think, as said previously, that Sophia is the purer racer - because a racer puts their life on the line in terms of outright danger and also the sacrifice of home life and family, they don't plot their racing career around what is the most likely way to fund a safe post racing life at Jamie's age.
Jamie won what is technically the lowest F1 affiliated tier of sport 3 times over, then took the funds to buy a house - in case racing doesn't work out beyond that point. All very sensible. Too sensible for a driver destined to climb higher. Sophia is far more exciting than that imo.
TheDeuce said:
I'm cautiously optimistic about her F3 campaign this season. If she can have mostly clean races, if she ends high end of the middle of the pack, then she's going to get some well deserved attention and support - potentially enough sponsorship to progress further.
But what about all the guys who are going to finish ahead of her that get zero publicity and will probably never go any further, is that just tough because you are not female?And lets be honest, she could have all the sponsorship in the world but she is still never going to win anything.
I hate to say it, but the sum total of her talent's seems to be looking good in racing overalls for Instagram.
She won't progress further until she actually beats someone, that is the inconvenient truth.
Joey Deacon said:
But what about all the guys who are going to finish ahead of her that get zero publicity and will probably never go any further, is that just tough because you are not female?
And lets be honest, she could have all the sponsorship in the world but she is still never going to win anything.
I hate to say it, but the sum total of her talent's seems to be looking good in racing overalls for Instagram.
She won't progress further until she actually beats someone, that is the inconvenient truth.
Seems harsh.. I'm not suggesting Floersch is the next Verstappen/Hamilton or anything but she did beat 9 guys in the F3 feature race in Bahrain (6 in the sprint race) including both her teammates. So maybe she isn't a world-beating talent who's going to go all the way to the top, but do you have any belittling comments about her teammates? Perhaps about their looks?And lets be honest, she could have all the sponsorship in the world but she is still never going to win anything.
I hate to say it, but the sum total of her talent's seems to be looking good in racing overalls for Instagram.
She won't progress further until she actually beats someone, that is the inconvenient truth.
KaraK said:
Seems harsh.. I'm not suggesting Floersch is the next Verstappen/Hamilton or anything but she did beat 9 guys in the F3 feature race in Bahrain (6 in the sprint race) including both her teammates. So maybe she isn't a world-beating talent who's going to go all the way to the top, but do you have any belittling comments about her teammates? Perhaps about their looks?
So she managed to get a 22nd and 20th place? As for her team mates, both of thems are absolutely useless and are only racing because their dad is a multi millionaire?Ive said this before somewhere, but I do wonder if there is a biological and neurological barrier between women and men in terms of risk? I mean, the technicalities of driving a racing car, from a BTCC car to an Indycar, are the same for men and women. They all know how to operate the car, know racing lines, understand weight transfer, traction etc.
Could it be down the 'the edge?' That extra bit of risk that a younger male biologically has that makes him slightly faster, slightly closer to the limit, less self preservation?
Could it be down the 'the edge?' That extra bit of risk that a younger male biologically has that makes him slightly faster, slightly closer to the limit, less self preservation?
I watched the indy lights (under it's new name) on the Sky F1 channel. You couldn't get a worse debut if you tried, crashed multiple times and well off the pace, other rookies were bang on the pace and up the front.
St Pete is a st street circuit, so was probably intimidating after the very wide and safe circuits used by FW, so lets see how she does next before writing her off. She is with one of the top teams, so no excuses there.
St Pete is a st street circuit, so was probably intimidating after the very wide and safe circuits used by FW, so lets see how she does next before writing her off. She is with one of the top teams, so no excuses there.
Annoying to watch people get priority and publicity purely on their sex
As much as the ladies mentioned are probably a better driver than 99% of the posters on PH they are being promoted above their ability levels purely because they have vaginas.
I identify as a woman can I have a btcc seat please if I strut round the paddock in heels and a wig when out the car ?
As much as the ladies mentioned are probably a better driver than 99% of the posters on PH they are being promoted above their ability levels purely because they have vaginas.
I identify as a woman can I have a btcc seat please if I strut round the paddock in heels and a wig when out the car ?
Broken record sorry.
there is nothing stopping a woman getting to the top.
The talent pool is tiny, a hundredth the size of the male talent pool. That's the only issue. The ONLY issue.
Eventually a female karter will come through and be on the pace, she will vault up through karts and into a few single seater races and then be in F1.
Every team is waiting for this, it just has not even slightly happened yet.
there is nothing stopping a woman getting to the top.
The talent pool is tiny, a hundredth the size of the male talent pool. That's the only issue. The ONLY issue.
Eventually a female karter will come through and be on the pace, she will vault up through karts and into a few single seater races and then be in F1.
Every team is waiting for this, it just has not even slightly happened yet.
There are definitely physicality issues in some levels of racing. Not insurmountable, but there is a scientific difference in upper body physiology between men and women.
However, the reason the ‘record is broken’ is because this, and the associated threads, are purely ‘bar room banter’, populated by male opinions.
Some of the male contributors have balanced views, but others are intrenched in their traditional beliefs.
Any discussion about women can really only have meaningful credibility with female contributions.
And they probably have better things to do than visit here.
However, the reason the ‘record is broken’ is because this, and the associated threads, are purely ‘bar room banter’, populated by male opinions.
Some of the male contributors have balanced views, but others are intrenched in their traditional beliefs.
Any discussion about women can really only have meaningful credibility with female contributions.
And they probably have better things to do than visit here.
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