RB marshalling

RB marshalling

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Roofless Toothless

3,888 posts

104 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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I would have thought that as well as an apology, Red Bull should have been invited to make a substantial donation to the family of Paolo Gislimberti, killed at Monza in 2000.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Paolo_Gisli...




SmoothCriminal

3,897 posts

171 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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The marshalls should not just direct their vitriol at marko and horner but at massi aswell.

What business does he have over riding the marshal's post and giving green flag track clear when it's a red flag any other time.

Imagine they're on the track dealing with an incident and he pulls that stunt cos his boy max needs to complete a lap again.

Megaflow

7,843 posts

197 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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InformationSuperHighway said:
And people wonder why Max is as arrogant and aggressive as he is.

He is totally enabled by these clowns.

The team and leadership needs a shake up. It’s toxic.
Look at Vettel as well, IMO he was a complete tool at Red Bull, but since he left he seems to have become a throughly decent chap.

HocusPocus

Original Poster:

565 posts

73 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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Sandpit Steve said:
Not just Horner either, Marko followed up the comments about a “rogue marshal”, and David Couthard (still on RBR payroll) added his own on C4.
Had this been under UK MSA bluebook rules then Horner and Marko should
10.1.3. Treat all competitors, marshals and officials equally with respect.
10.2. For the purposes of these General Regulations Motorsport UK will not tolerate any form of abuse or aggression towards officials, marshals, spectators and competitors.
10.2.1. Motorsport UK and the National Court will impose the most stringent sanction against any transgression of 10.2 and may suspend all Licences (H.3.1.2) pending investigation and/or referral to the National Court.

Some UK CoCs would have suspended and invited a competitor to leave the paddock for the remainder of the event, and quite rightly too. So what example does Horner's little pep talk resulting in begrudging mealy mouthed apology followed by Marko's petrol on the fire set for mere mortals' motorsport? Not exactly the "most stringent sanction".

Smiljan

9,158 posts

169 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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Hopefully Horner will be banned from attending the remainder of the seasons races.

super7

1,050 posts

180 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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Maybe Red Bull would be interested in funding a few hundred professional marshall's travelling to each race and getting paid to do the job? Then they can all go on training courses and be indoctrinated into the Red Bull philosophy of marshalling...... stick out a yellow flag to anyone except a Red Bull?

It was only earlier this season that Red Bull successfully got Hamilton demoted three places for missing a very discrete stationary yellow.....

In my book, Marshall's have more information to them immediately than the FIA does. They are on the ground, on the corner, getting hit by the debris. Gasly's puncture and the resultant damage to the car to the point it pulled up on a straight is a slam-dunk Double Yellow. The FIA do not know if any debris has been thrown onto the racing line, whether a following car could get a cut from some carbon, resulting in it loosing control and hitting the stationary car....

Horner is seeing a resurgent Mercedes and he's stting himself. He moans about cheating with the Merc rear-wing, Toto just states he's putting a "Spicey" engine in for Jeddah. Isn't one of the first things to motivate a team by displaying a positive attitude? Horner is all "whingey spice" negative at the moment, Toto is all "power spice" positive!

Mercedes, Ferrari & Red Bull's budgets were all in the $400m ball park, before the Budget cap, whereby they are all on $145m. This should be a bonus for the "Privateer" Red Bull next year, as Mercedes and Ferrari can't spend their way out of a crisis and Red Bull can make more efficient $ per second use out of Newey.


MustangGT

9,195 posts

252 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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StevieBee said:
It's not though, is it.

Red Bull is as near to a privateer team you get these days, operating on significantly less budget fighting for both Championships against a corporate giant on near equal terms. Nobody else is close.
Do you know what the RB budget is? In previous years it has been the same or thereabouts as Mercedes and Ferrari. As of this year it is identical as they all have the same cap.

StevieBee

10,363 posts

227 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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MustangGT said:
StevieBee said:
It's not though, is it.

Red Bull is as near to a privateer team you get these days, operating on significantly less budget fighting for both Championships against a corporate giant on near equal terms. Nobody else is close.
Do you know what the RB budget is? In previous years it has been the same or thereabouts as Mercedes and Ferrari. As of this year it is identical as they all have the same cap.
Mark Hughes (I think) in Motor Sport a couple of years ago mentioned it being around two thirds of the traditional big teams. Will of course be more in line with others today but looking back at the team's evolution, the net result is that they have achieved significantly more than most with less money to do so.


Edited by StevieBee on Tuesday 23 November 11:34

honda_exige

3,397 posts

178 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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No criticism of Kimi for consistently aggressively pushing and shouting at marshals trying to help him?

Are you guys more aggrieved about this than the very marshal at the centre of it?


super7

1,050 posts

180 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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The Marshall didn't do anything wrong........ The RB team management are the issue here!

Smiljan

9,158 posts

169 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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Exactly, it's a bit bizarre going on about Kimi in a thread about Red Bull management trying to manipulate marshalling by calling them useless.

AW111

7,316 posts

105 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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Smiljan said:
Exactly, it's a bit bizarre going on about Kimi in a thread about Red Bull management trying to manipulate marshalling by calling them useless.
Yeah, but the poster is honda_exige, who is a rabid anti-Lewis, pro-Max fanboy.
Don't expect sense from him on this subject, just deflection.

rampageturke

1,393 posts

134 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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AW111 said:
Yeah, but the poster is honda_exige, who is a rabid anti-Lewis, pro-Max fanboy.
Don't expect sense from him on this subject, just deflection.
as opposed to getting sense from pro-lewis, anti-max fanboys. which there are plenty

cant wait for the glory hunters to disappear

honda_exige

3,397 posts

178 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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AW111 said:
Smiljan said:
Exactly, it's a bit bizarre going on about Kimi in a thread about Red Bull management trying to manipulate marshalling by calling them useless.
Yeah, but the poster is honda_exige, who is a rabid anti-Lewis, pro-Max fanboy.
Don't expect sense from him on this subject, just deflection.
The irony of describing me as rabid while on this hilarious thread of hyenas attempting to feast on a single chicken nugget.

He made an error, it's done move on. Marshal has accepted the apology but somehow you guys are white knighting on his behalf? Pathetic.

Interesting posting by the guy above on the regs? How any times should Kimi have been barred from a race for showing aggression towards a Marshal by now if you're going down that path?

None obviously. But the guy above I assume believes that he should've been.

On the previous topics I've agreed that Max should've been penalised in Brazil and I agree that Horner got the deserved punishment for his comments. But you guys are so busy mutually masturbating each others RB hate boners you've lost sight of all reasonableness. Shame really.

AW111

7,316 posts

105 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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What about those of us who aren't Lewis fans, but are fed up with all the Red Bullst from Marko and Horner?

PhilAsia

274 posts

47 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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SmoothCriminal said:
The marshalls should not just direct their vitriol at marko and horner but at massi aswell.

What business does he have over riding the marshal's post and giving green flag track clear when it's a red flag any other time.

Imagine they're on the track dealing with an incident and he pulls that stunt cos his boy max needs to complete a lap again.
Plus 1 ^^^

PhilAsia

274 posts

47 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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It's not about Max though is it?

It is about safety being undermined by Masi (if proven) and Horner castigating a volunteer that is doing their Marshalling correctly.

AW111

7,316 posts

105 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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PhilAsia said:
It's not about Max though is it?

It is about safety being undermined by Masi (if proven) and Horner castigating a volunteer that is doing their Marshalling correctly.
Exactly. This is nothing to do with Max.

He wasn't the one who badmouthed the marshalls then made a grudging "sorry you got offended" non-apology.

nickfrog

15,489 posts

189 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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AW111 said:
Exactly. This is nothing to do with Max.

He wasn't the one who badmouthed the marshalls then made a grudging "sorry you got offended" non-apology.
Exactly. It wasn't an apology at all. It was his usual passive aggressive style. And then he claims he is a straight shooter when he has been demonstrating for the past 15 years that he really isn't.

I feel sorry for Max to have to work and being influenced by these two.

budgie smuggler

4,433 posts

131 months

Tuesday 23rd November
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honda_exige said:
Interesting posting by the guy above on the regs? How any times should Kimi have been barred from a race for showing aggression towards a Marshal by now if you're going down that path?

None obviously. But the guy above I assume believes that he should've been.

On the previous topics I've agreed that Max should've been penalised in Brazil and I agree that Horner got the deserved punishment for his comments. But you guys are so busy mutually masturbating each others RB hate boners you've lost sight of all reasonableness. Shame really.
I actually think Kimi should have had a bking for that.

In any case i think it's reasonable to have higher expectations for Horner making a considered comment during an interview compared to a driver that has just got out of the car.