Christian Horner
Discussion
Derek Smith said:
deadslow said:
732NM said:
deadslow said:
732NM said:
deadslow said:
I bet Ron, looking back, wishes he had handled 2007 differently. And won both championships.
Ron did nothing wrong. Unfortunately he was in the hands of a
who hated him and wished him ruined. Blame that on a certain persons attempt at blackmail.
I don't think he managed the situation very well.
If it had later surfaced, and Alonso, as he did with the Mosley-led enquiry, was promised full immunity for anything he did wrong if he put Dennis away, he'd have suffered an even bigger catastrophe. I would assume Dennis did what he did under legal advice. Once Alonso made the accusation, Dennis had no option but to inform the FIA.
Alonso wasn’t contrite, he was making a play.
No doubt he’d have used the shadow of it to get what he wanted further down the line.
Think about it, if you ran your own business, any business and an employee said he found fraudulent activity, threatened to report it but then backtracked and said he’d be quiet about it, would you trust them under any circumstances?
I certainly wouldn’t.
Derek Smith said:
I rather liked that about Dennis. I was once taken to the pits at Silverstone to meet him and all he did was grunt, this in the days when Senna hadn't signed a contract. When I returned to the hospitality area and spoke to the person who organised it, he said that McLaren was nearly a second off the pace. I was lucky to get a grunt. And that, I think, described him. The team's performance defined his mood. When Mosley attacked him, and got McL disqualified, I wondered if Dennis would try something to undermine Mosley.
I spoke with Dennis at the Goodwood FoS where he was going to drive the #1 McL F1 car up the hill. He was friendly, welcoming and chatty. He seemed to be a very pleasant chap, but I would not try to get his team disqualified from the championship.
After Alonso's disloyalty in 2007, betrayal I heard it described as, although I wouldn't go that far - I'd go further, when Alonso was without a team in 2015 (after a disagreement with a team principle - some people never learn) Dennis took him back because he thought he'd be good for the team. The team was everything.
Also met Ron twice. Congenial and seemed like a nice man if somewhat robotic and scripted. Huge respect for his achievements. I'm sure his public persona at the time necessitated an aloof persona. Apparently he's quite funny behind the scenes. And he has certainly helped many many McLaren employees with medical bills and personal issues away from the limelight. I haven't heard similar about other TPs.I spoke with Dennis at the Goodwood FoS where he was going to drive the #1 McL F1 car up the hill. He was friendly, welcoming and chatty. He seemed to be a very pleasant chap, but I would not try to get his team disqualified from the championship.
After Alonso's disloyalty in 2007, betrayal I heard it described as, although I wouldn't go that far - I'd go further, when Alonso was without a team in 2015 (after a disagreement with a team principle - some people never learn) Dennis took him back because he thought he'd be good for the team. The team was everything.
cgt2 said:
Also met Ron twice. Congenial and seemed like a nice man if somewhat robotic and scripted. Huge respect for his achievements. I'm sure his public persona at the time necessitated an aloof persona. Apparently he's quite funny behind the scenes. And he has certainly helped many many McLaren employees with medical bills and personal issues away from the limelight. I haven't heard similar about other TPs.
It seems he was an enthusiast of the sport. In the #1 McLaren, he was all smiles and excitement. I get that feeling with a number of other TPs, but not for Horner. I don't know if it is my dislike for the bloke colouring my perception.I suspect most of us must, sometimes, take an 'instant' dislike to someone on little evidence. I know I do. I try to fight it normally, and can mostly. Horner; I just can't be bothered.
Muzzer79 said:
This
Alonso wasn’t contrite, he was making a play.
No doubt he’d have used the shadow of it to get what he wanted further down the line.
Think about it, if you ran your own business, any business and an employee said he found fraudulent activity, threatened to report it but then backtracked and said he’d be quiet about it, would you trust them under any circumstances?
I certainly wouldn’t.
I do run my own business, and have called the police on a single occasion due to the actions of an employee.Alonso wasn’t contrite, he was making a play.
No doubt he’d have used the shadow of it to get what he wanted further down the line.
Think about it, if you ran your own business, any business and an employee said he found fraudulent activity, threatened to report it but then backtracked and said he’d be quiet about it, would you trust them under any circumstances?
I certainly wouldn’t.
Did Ron have a choice? Once he knew Coughlan was designing the Macca from the Fez tech design book, no, he did not. He needed to meet it head on. He could have tried to cut the cancer out internally, but Ferrari were unravelling it from the other end and it would probably all come out. It is the knowledge of the cheating which made Ron's actions inevitable, not a threat from Alonso. Indeed, had Ron decided to keep schtum, his reputation and legacy would have been tarnished forever.
My problem with 2007 is that McLaren were clearly not well managed. That buck stops with Ron. In a well run championship contending team the drivers do not run to the stewards to get a penalty for their team-mate, and the design team do not steal the tech book from a rival. Ron has some responsibility. He was not a victim. The team were cheating, and the drivers were at war. A bad period for McLaren, with no heroes.
deadslow said:
I do run my own business, and have called the police on a single occasion due to the actions of an employee.
Did Ron have a choice? Once he knew Coughlan was designing the Macca from the Fez tech design book, no, he did not. He needed to meet it head on. He could have tried to cut the cancer out internally, but Ferrari were unravelling it from the other end and it would probably all come out. It is the knowledge of the cheating which made Ron's actions inevitable, not a threat from Alonso. Indeed, had Ron decided to keep schtum, his reputation and legacy would have been tarnished forever.
My problem with 2007 is that McLaren were clearly not well managed. That buck stops with Ron. In a well run championship contending team the drivers do not run to the stewards to get a penalty for their team-mate, and the design team do not steal the tech book from a rival. Ron has some responsibility. He was not a victim. The team were cheating, and the drivers were at war. A bad period for McLaren, with no heroes.
You need to educate yourself about all of that bDid Ron have a choice? Once he knew Coughlan was designing the Macca from the Fez tech design book, no, he did not. He needed to meet it head on. He could have tried to cut the cancer out internally, but Ferrari were unravelling it from the other end and it would probably all come out. It is the knowledge of the cheating which made Ron's actions inevitable, not a threat from Alonso. Indeed, had Ron decided to keep schtum, his reputation and legacy would have been tarnished forever.
My problem with 2007 is that McLaren were clearly not well managed. That buck stops with Ron. In a well run championship contending team the drivers do not run to the stewards to get a penalty for their team-mate, and the design team do not steal the tech book from a rival. Ron has some responsibility. He was not a victim. The team were cheating, and the drivers were at war. A bad period for McLaren, with no heroes.
ks you posted. Again. deadslow said:
My problem with 2007 is that McLaren were clearly not well managed. That buck stops with Ron. In a well run championship contending team the drivers do not run to the stewards to get a penalty for their team-mate, and the design team do not steal the tech book from a rival. Ron has some responsibility. He was not a victim. The team were cheating, and the drivers were at war. A bad period for McLaren, with no heroes.
How about drivers dads lobbying the stewards ?
HTP99 said:
ThingsBehindTheSun said:
PRO5T said:
He’d have to turn up somewhere else. I wonder if Geri speaks any Italian?
I suspect that if he gets sacked he will also be receiving divorce papers soon after. I am sure the only reason she stood by him after the recent scandal is for the glamour of the F1 lifestyle. MustangGT said:
deadslow said:
732NM said:
You need to educate yourself about all of that bks you posted. Again.
thanks for the helpful advice ks you posted. Again. 
richhead said:
I also was surprised that she stuck with him, maybe the spice girls didnt make as much money as we think.
A few tens of millions, at the high end for a manufactured group but not the hundreds of millions the top rock bands have made. They’re allegedly doing some more concerts next year, which is usually a sign they need more money! Ditto with Horny, he’s a salaryman albeit a very well paid one - someone suggested £7m/year when the scandal started last year - which he needs to be to keep his wife in dresses, handbags, and private planes.
732NM said:
deadslow said:
I do run my own business, and have called the police on a single occasion due to the actions of an employee.
Did Ron have a choice? Once he knew Coughlan was designing the Macca from the Fez tech design book, no, he did not. He needed to meet it head on. He could have tried to cut the cancer out internally, but Ferrari were unravelling it from the other end and it would probably all come out. It is the knowledge of the cheating which made Ron's actions inevitable, not a threat from Alonso. Indeed, had Ron decided to keep schtum, his reputation and legacy would have been tarnished forever.
My problem with 2007 is that McLaren were clearly not well managed. That buck stops with Ron. In a well run championship contending team the drivers do not run to the stewards to get a penalty for their team-mate, and the design team do not steal the tech book from a rival. Ron has some responsibility. He was not a victim. The team were cheating, and the drivers were at war. A bad period for McLaren, with no heroes.
You need to educate yourself about all of that bDid Ron have a choice? Once he knew Coughlan was designing the Macca from the Fez tech design book, no, he did not. He needed to meet it head on. He could have tried to cut the cancer out internally, but Ferrari were unravelling it from the other end and it would probably all come out. It is the knowledge of the cheating which made Ron's actions inevitable, not a threat from Alonso. Indeed, had Ron decided to keep schtum, his reputation and legacy would have been tarnished forever.
My problem with 2007 is that McLaren were clearly not well managed. That buck stops with Ron. In a well run championship contending team the drivers do not run to the stewards to get a penalty for their team-mate, and the design team do not steal the tech book from a rival. Ron has some responsibility. He was not a victim. The team were cheating, and the drivers were at war. A bad period for McLaren, with no heroes.
ks you posted. Again. Sandpit Steve said:
richhead said:
I also was surprised that she stuck with him, maybe the spice girls didnt make as much money as we think.
A few tens of millions, at the high end for a manufactured group but not the hundreds of millions the top rock bands have made. They’re allegedly doing some more concerts next year, which is usually a sign they need more money! Ditto with Horny, he’s a salaryman albeit a very well paid one - someone suggested £7m/year when the scandal started last year - which he needs to be to keep his wife in dresses, handbags, and private planes.
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