JSF... get over it and return
Discussion
DocJock said:
I know JSF in 'real life'. He is a good bloke with no 'side' to him. He is very knowledgeable about cars, both racing and roadgoing. He is straight talking and doesn't tolerate BS, which upsets some people, especially those whose fragile egos don't like their errors being pointed out.
PH is poorer without his contributions.
Agree another knowledgeable contributor gone.PH is poorer without his contributions.
PhilAsia said:
MustangGT said:
DocJock said:
He is very knowledgeable about cars, both racing and roadgoing. He is straight talking and doesn't tolerate BS, which upsets some people, especially those whose fragile egos don't like their errors being pointed out.
PH is poorer without his contributions.
Whilst I do not know JSF personally I agree with this post.PH is poorer without his contributions.
Knowledgeable is great. It doesn't give you a get out clause to be an ignorant, arrogant arse. You can impart your knowledge without being offensive. If you disagree, it's better to disengage with whoever is winding you up, particularly in certain areas of this forum.
Just because you know your stuff doesn't mean you can't be respectful, even to the idiots.
Just because you know your stuff doesn't mean you can't be respectful, even to the idiots.
Stan the Bat said:
PhilAsia said:
MustangGT said:
DocJock said:
He is very knowledgeable about cars, both racing and roadgoing. He is straight talking and doesn't tolerate BS, which upsets some people, especially those whose fragile egos don't like their errors being pointed out.
PH is poorer without his contributions.
Whilst I do not know JSF personally I agree with this post.PH is poorer without his contributions.
Admin, take a second look at this one. You know full well he'll return if you have a respectful private conversation. It's pretty poor if you fail to make such an effort as admin of a commercially functioning F1 forum - just make an agreement with the person with actual F1 prep experience that you fell out with... Forget forum rules, this forum is a business.
F1 is growing as a sport. The F1 forum is stalling. Make good decisions about how you handle certain contributors.
I have to say, I've been looking around for a new F1 forum. Most threads here end in exactly the same tiresome acrimony. I'm not sure if it's the forum that has changed, or my age and tolerance, but if you're going to ban people for writing certain things, I'd rather ban people who add nothing but playground nonsense than people who add valuable insight but rub some folk up the wrong way.
HardtopManual said:
I have to say, I've been looking around for a new F1 forum. Most threads here end in exactly the same tiresome acrimony. I'm not sure if it's the forum that has changed, or my age and tolerance, but if you're going to ban people for writing certain things, I'd rather ban people who add nothing but playground nonsense than people who add valuable insight but rub some folk up the wrong way.
Thanks. That's my view too. Enough nonsense, either we have a dedicated and hardcore F1 forum or we don't. If we do, we don't ban people for comments that have no bearing on their ability to contribute. This is PH, it's supposed to be a car focused escape from normal PC life chatter. I've read PH for decades. I was signed up around 2002/3 and then deleted myself after some threats. Very nasty stuff. Anyway, I've seen a lot change over the years and moderation has become much, much stricter. I suppose this is due to the increasing likelihood of litigation against PH owners. But also they don't themselves want to be party to anything 'unsavoury'. For instance, any thread that mentions Donald Campbell or his boat is immediately taken down.
I see a lot of posters disappear, some are more obvious than others when they go. But rules are rules. I doubt you'll see JSF back, not as JSF anyway.
I see a lot of posters disappear, some are more obvious than others when they go. But rules are rules. I doubt you'll see JSF back, not as JSF anyway.
Jordie Barretts sock said:
Knowledgeable is great. It doesn't give you a get out clause to be an ignorant, arrogant arse. You can impart your knowledge without being offensive. If you disagree, it's better to disengage with whoever is winding you up, particularly in certain areas of this forum.
Just because you know your stuff doesn't mean you can't be respectful, even to the idiots.
But it gets increasingly tiresome when the the idiots keep posting nonsense even when someone knowledgeable has clearly demonstrated that they are wrong & do not know what they are talking about. After a couple of years or so the experts either crack up or give up & the idiots win - as they have on this sub forum. You can see it with Max Torque, Breadvan, JSF. Equus & ATGLaw just about hang on.Just because you know your stuff doesn't mean you can't be respectful, even to the idiots.
No forum like this ever rises in quality these days; they all degenerate as the knowledgeable leave & the idiots get concentrated in the diminishing pool of remaining contributors. if the mods cared they'd just look back at the number of posters on a couple of threads in the F1 sub forum saying "I'm off, it's too toxic" & make an effort to cull the worst offenders, but they don't & the result is a race thread that turns to rubbish even before qualifying has run.
Couldn't agree more.
The problem is, the idiots don't actually break the forum rules. Therefore there is not a lot the mods can do.
The issue is, they are like a Jack Russell after a rabbit, they just won't leave it alone and hound the expert/knowledgeable person off the entire forum. Discussion is great, disagreement is ok as long as you are mature enough to recognise it is just that, disagreeing over something and not the end of your social standing and life as you know it.
On another thread, someone described it as cognitive dissonance. Where people hate to be shown to be wrong, and have a baseless sense of entitlement which, when unrecognised leads to aggressive and confrontation behaviour. Hence why it is best to let them have the last word, and walk away.
The problem is, the idiots don't actually break the forum rules. Therefore there is not a lot the mods can do.
The issue is, they are like a Jack Russell after a rabbit, they just won't leave it alone and hound the expert/knowledgeable person off the entire forum. Discussion is great, disagreement is ok as long as you are mature enough to recognise it is just that, disagreeing over something and not the end of your social standing and life as you know it.
On another thread, someone described it as cognitive dissonance. Where people hate to be shown to be wrong, and have a baseless sense of entitlement which, when unrecognised leads to aggressive and confrontation behaviour. Hence why it is best to let them have the last word, and walk away.
Jordie Barretts sock said:
(Snipped)The problem is, the idiots don't actually break the forum rules. Therefore there is not a lot the mods can do.
Well there is, you can just have a "Don't be an Asshole" rule but then of course you rely on the mods being reasonable & consistent & to have a directive from the PH owners to raise the quality of the boards, not just to keep the web traffic numbers up.I think PH is a fantastic resource with a depth & breadth of knowledge that is unrivalled on any other forum & it's sad to see some it's best contributors leaving.
Mr Pointy said:
Well there is, you can just have a "Don't be an Asshole" rule but then of course you rely on the mods being reasonable & consistent & to have a directive from the PH owners to raise the quality of the boards, not just to keep the web traffic numbers up.
I think PH is a fantastic resource with a depth & breadth of knowledge that is unrivalled on any other forum & it's sad to see some it's best contributors leaving.
Problem is JSF broke your suggested rule quite often. I think PH is a fantastic resource with a depth & breadth of knowledge that is unrivalled on any other forum & it's sad to see some it's best contributors leaving.
Yep. One person's being an a
hole is another person's dealing with idiots.
PH started as a forum. You could say and do pretty much anything. There was a thread (long gone) of being caught in the act of sex. It was hilarious. It got revived a few years ago and deleted. Not the sort of thread we want on PH. Now it is a platform for selling cars and a bit of journalism. The forum is a side show. Cargurus want to sell cars, not provide a forum where you can fix your TVR with a clothes peg and a 50p piece. They have no interest in a knowledgeable F1 contributor to the forum.
hole is another person's dealing with idiots. PH started as a forum. You could say and do pretty much anything. There was a thread (long gone) of being caught in the act of sex. It was hilarious. It got revived a few years ago and deleted. Not the sort of thread we want on PH. Now it is a platform for selling cars and a bit of journalism. The forum is a side show. Cargurus want to sell cars, not provide a forum where you can fix your TVR with a clothes peg and a 50p piece. They have no interest in a knowledgeable F1 contributor to the forum.
Edited by Jordie Barretts sock on Wednesday 22 March 12:00
The idea that someone will make a return all sheepish and tearfully greatful is laughable. Maybe in the old days when things like this were done in private.
The internet has evolved so badly that across the board people that were bursting to put their ideas out there on there own platforms have gone away as its no longer viable and they are lumped into some sort of zoo on facebook/twitter/this place...
Instead it looks like a lot of content will just be produced by AI based on all the dross,chatter and speculation. Some of the F1 articles read like someone clueless about the sport has written them so its probably already here.
The internet has evolved so badly that across the board people that were bursting to put their ideas out there on there own platforms have gone away as its no longer viable and they are lumped into some sort of zoo on facebook/twitter/this place...
Instead it looks like a lot of content will just be produced by AI based on all the dross,chatter and speculation. Some of the F1 articles read like someone clueless about the sport has written them so its probably already here.
595Heaven said:
Problem is JSF broke your suggested rule quite often.
John wasn't an AH- he was just brusque & didn't suffer foolsmaybe that doesn't translate well to non UK'ers ...but if you did find him an AH, good luck conversing with anyone 'northern' or any medical professional (particularly surgeons)
angrymoby said:
595Heaven said:
Problem is JSF broke your suggested rule quite often.
John wasn't an AH- he was just brusque & didn't suffer foolsmaybe that doesn't translate well to non UK'ers ...but if you did find him an AH, good luck conversing with anyone 'northern' or any medical professional (particularly surgeons)
HardtopManual said:
I have to say, I've been looking around for a new F1 forum. Most threads here end in exactly the same tiresome acrimony. I'm not sure if it's the forum that has changed, or my age and tolerance, but if you're going to ban people for writing certain things, I'd rather ban people who add nothing but playground nonsense than people who add valuable insight but rub some folk up the wrong way.
It would be better if you don't take sides and treat it like a football match. Just because another poster might not like your favourite driver, there is no need to get all upset about it.You might be more of the problem if you get upset about what other people write.
Read it, move on, ignore anything you don't agree with and don't engage in topics or things that will upset you. It's not difficult.
The problem with that is that Gen X cannot accept they are wrong. The only view that matters is theirs. If they are proved wrong, they will repeat their assertion in a different way and keep on doing so until they have their own way. It isn't just a forum thing.
I agree, incredibly tiresome.
I agree, incredibly tiresome.
Jordie Barretts sock said:
The problem with that is that Gen X cannot accept they are wrong. The only view that matters is theirs. If they are proved wrong, they will repeat their assertion in a different way and keep on doing so until they have their own way. It isn't just a forum thing.
I agree, incredibly tiresome.
If you consult NP&E you might have to expand your age range by about 50 years in either direction. I agree, incredibly tiresome.
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