'kin Hell - just what is the point of modern f1?

[HustleRussell]

LukeBrown66 said:

HustleRussell said:

LukeBrown66 said:

the drivers are petulant cretins, the team bosses are not much better, the teams spend insane, embarrassing amounts of money on petulant schoolboys yet we are supposed to be impressed

You don't half come out with some tripe on here, but this is poor even for you.

Russel, great reply, add something huh Add something or ask a question, simply posting bhing is dull, pointless and adds zero. You might aswell have no posted anything.

f1 drivers are utterly petulant, have you heard the garbage they talk about, "oh he touched a white line, oh I could not take my line. Oh he moved over a little on the straight, he gave me no room.

Effing grow a pair and get on with in you utter nonces, it is about time this was all removed, real drivers race without damn radios and use their wits, experience and skill to plan moves, overtakes and pitstops.

And the less said about these so called team bosses the better, most of them simply seem to be guys that like being on the telly and use every example to try play a part that nobody really needs to see.

I ask you what you actually ENJOY about this sport. The racing is garbage, utter garbage,95& of passes are fake and manufactured the drivers are totally selfish and give literally nothing away to fans or the hanger on media, the teams go from being amazing to being tripe one season after the other with a few exceptions, the tracks are just twinkly lights and no challenge whatsoever.

I watched for a few laps yesterday and it was like watching an Esports race, every car looked the same, took the same lines, never moved, never did anything even slightly different, "Oh look sparks" Give me strength,

If you think this is great, I fear for you as if you watched anything truly decent you would probably explode.

I'm not going to talk you around, you're a lost cause. The stuff yoyu're coming out with is best described as diarrhoea- but the vitriol you're directing toward drivers in particular is entirely without basis in reality. We've never had more access to drivers, they've never been under more pressure to conduct themselves properly, the paddock has never been so talented nor probably so friendly.

[nickfrog]

HustleRussell said:

LukeBrown66 said:

the drivers are petulant cretins, the team bosses are not much better, the teams spend insane, embarrassing amounts of money on petulant schoolboys yet we are supposed to be impressed

You don't half come out with some tripe on here, but this is poor even for you.

Indeed. There have always been petulant drivers, that is a factor of the size of their ego, but by and large they are pretty level headed and the standards of team bosses has improved over the years IMO.

These 2 races weren't great tbh but it's early days.

I was born in 69 too and can remember some seriously boring and processional races in the 80s, 90s, 00s, etc...

[TTmonkey]

All these changes over the last few years “to make F1 carbon neutral yadda yadda” have simply made the sport about bending the rule book to find an advantage. And yet there are now more races around the world, and this circus does nothing to address being a green sport in anyway. All they’ve done is make the sport only winnable by the team that manages to find the best interpretation of ever confusing rules.

It’s become a farce. They’ve changed the cars so that they are not as susceptible to downforce issues as they close up with the car infront yet we still have a push to pass button to stall the rear wing and give a totally unfair advantage to the car behind now, surely that now has to go?

It’s become now you watch the first three laps, the race settles down to a procession, then the only hope of a major change is if there’s a technical problem or a crash.

The desert races are pointless, just there because of the money, no fans visible. It’s a vanity project by the oil rich nations.

[Sandpit Steve]

nickfrog said:

Indeed. There have always been petulant drivers, that is a factor of the size of their ego, but by and large they are pretty level headed and the standards of team bosses has improved over the years IMO.

These 2 races weren't great tbh but it's early days.

I was born in 69 too and can remember some seriously boring and processional races in the 80s, 90s, 00s, etc...

We all have very selective memories, when it comes to what happened years ago.

Take, for example, my earliest memory of “a brilliant F1 race”, the 1986 British GP, from Brands Hatch.

This is the result from that day:

[realjv]

It's F1, there are good years and there are bad years, same as it ever was. The only real difference between now and say 10, 20 or 30 years ago is the saturation coverage.

[vaud]

realjv said:

It's F1, there are good years and there are bad years, same as it ever was. The only real difference between now and say 10, 20 or 30 years ago is the saturation coverage.

And less cheating these days. And incredible reliability. Plus we don't see our heroes die on a Sunday afternoon.

[maz8062]

realjv said:

It's F1, there are good years and there are bad years, same as it ever was. The only real difference between now and say 10, 20 or 30 years ago is the saturation coverage.

The cost cap is the difference as is the ban on testing, both regulations are fundamental to motorsport and make it nigh on impossible to spend your way out of a hole. RBR have an advantage that is locked in until 2026. Mercedes had an advantage from 2014 but there were no regulations stopping a team from spending their way to catch up.

If this first mover advantages continues in between regulation changes, there’ll be more of them to level the field.

[Muzzer79]

LukeBrown66 said:

f1 drivers are utterly petulant, have you heard the garbage they talk about, "oh he touched a white line, oh I could not take my line. Oh he moved over a little on the straight, he gave me no room.

Effing grow a pair and get on with in you utter nonces, it is about time this was all removed, real drivers race without damn radios and use their wits, experience and skill to plan moves, overtakes and pitstops.

And the less said about these so called team bosses the better, most of them simply seem to be guys that like being on the telly and use every example to try play a part that nobody really needs to see.

I ask you what you actually ENJOY about this sport. The racing is garbage, utter garbage,95& of passes are fake and manufactured the drivers are totally selfish and give literally nothing away to fans or the hanger on media, the teams go from being amazing to being tripe one season after the other with a few exceptions, the tracks are just twinkly lights and no challenge whatsoever.

I watched for a few laps yesterday and it was like watching an Esports race, every car looked the same, took the same lines, never moved, never did anything even slightly different, "Oh look sparks" Give me strength,

If you think this is great, I fear for you as if you watched anything truly decent you would probably explode.

Why do you watch it? Even for a few laps? Are you expecting something different from your perception of petulant drivers who are nannied?

Also; why are you so prolific on an internet forum group dedicated to a sport you despise so much?

Genuine questions

[vaud]

maz8062 said:

The cost cap is the difference as is the ban on testing, both regulations are fundamental to motorsport and make it nigh on impossible to spend your way out of a hole. RBR have an advantage that is locked in until 2026. Mercedes had an advantage from 2014 but there were no regulations stopping a team from spending their way to catch up.

If this first mover advantages continues in between regulation changes, there’ll be more of them to level the field.

But the model means the rear teams can catch up - look at Aston Martin?

[InformationSuperHighway]

For me, I have one major gripe at the moment.. DRS is too powerful.

We know it was designed to enable more passing opportunities but it now is going too far. There are literally zero real ‘battles’. No corner but corner, side by side classics.. just open the wing and sail past.

I think DRS should be reversed.

If you are outside of 1 second gap, you get DRS to help you catch up. But then within 1 second you lose it to go side by side and battle to get past.

Other than DRS I’m loving F1 more than ever, mainly due to the ‘access all areas’ style of media and so much behind the scenes content. None of which we had before Liberty arrived.

[Marc p]

nickfrog said:

Indeed. There have always been petulant drivers, that is a factor of the size of their ego, but by and large they are pretty level headed and the standards of team bosses has improved over the years IMO.

These 2 races weren't great tbh but it's early days.

I was born in 69 too and can remember some seriously boring and processional races in the 80s, 90s, 00s, etc...

Although I was born 2 decades later than yourself, I have watched lots of races from the 70’s and 80’s and I agree completely, F1 seasons have always gone up and down like a yo-yo in regards to viewer entertainment.

First couple of races this season have been a bit boring, however (even as a life long Ferrari fan), I’m loving Alonso’s performance this season, it’s unlikely but I’d love to see him take the chequered flag this season.

There are more and more rules and regs coming in to close up the field and try to stop the big money teams having a monopoly. I do appreciate the spend cap to create fairness, teams will always be looking for new innovations or ways to bend the rules to gain an advantage, but that’s been the case for decades, anyone remember the Lotus 79 with its game changing ground effects?

One thing I would like to be brought in (although I can’t see it happening), is to ban communications between the driver and crew.

Edited by Marc p on Monday 20th March 15:59

[CrgT16]

For is not about the racing being better in the old days… it wasn’t! We had dominant years with Ferrari, with McLaren, with Williams, etc.

The cars are much more technical and the development is to an insane level so the margins to differentiate them are smaller and smaller.

We have a good driver line up and great cars but little drama both on track or outside it. That drama be it mechanical or personality made the good old days more interesting.

We perhaps need more simple regulation, less aero, no DRS. More loose rules to encourage technical development. The problem is with the regulator. What we see is a product of those regulations.

I stopped watching entire races these days, follow F1 loosely but hope that at some point they become more interesting again.

For me it’s about the ultimate speed and the tech development which has stalled a bit.

For pure driver racing any single make championship will beat f1 hands down but for me F1 is much more than that. Miss some drama!

[SturdyHSV]

TTmonkey said:

All these changes over the last few years “to make F1 carbon neutral yadda yadda” have simply made the sport about bending the rule book to find an advantage.

All they’ve done is make the sport only winnable by the team that manages to find the best interpretation of ever confusing rules.

It’s become now you watch the first three laps, the race settles down to a procession, then the only hope of a major change is if there’s a technical problem or a crash.

It's been that way for what, 50 years at least?

It has always been about the best interpretation of increasingly confusing rules. It has always been about finding an advantage within those rules.

It has always been somewhat of a procession in the middle whilst the strategies play out unless there's a crash or a technical problem.

That is exactly how the sport has always been?

Look at the finishing order from 1986 above. It's in car performance order, there's the same gap as there was in Saudi between 1 and 2, but the rest of the field is up to 13 laps behind, even if you ignore the comical amount of retirements. Halcyon days indeed.

[P. ONeill]

Muzzer79 said:

Why do you watch it? Even for a few laps? Are you expecting something different from your perception of petulant drivers who are nannied?

I intended to watch the start of yesterday’s race but forgot. Heard the result sometime yesterday evening. Only real surprise was Alonso. I missed the first race of the season altogether. I think those of us of a certain age have just got bored. There is no real excitement for the average viewer any more and I would assume the viewing figures would show this.

I have tickets for Belgium and will go more for the occasion than the actual race.

[Marc p]

InformationSuperHighway said:

I think DRS should be reversed.

If you are outside of 1 second gap, you get DRS to help you catch up. But then within 1 second you lose it to go side by side and battle to get past.

Personally, I think that would be a great idea!

In addition to my wanting of a removal of radio contact between driver and crew. I’d personally love to see a relaxation of penalties, I feel too many drivers are hesitant to go for overtakes in the fear that they could make contact and have penalties thrown at them. Personally, I’d say contact shouldn’t result in penalties, unless a driver is seen to maliciously cause an accident.

[Marc p]

nickfrog said:

Indeed. There have always been petulant drivers, that is a factor of the size of their ego, but by and large they are pretty level headed and the standards of team bosses has improved over the years IMO.

These 2 races weren't great tbh but it's early days.

I was born in 69 too and can remember some seriously boring and processional races in the 80s, 90s, 00s, etc...

Although I was born 2 decades later than yourself, I have watched lots of races from the 70’s and 80’s and I agree completely, F1 seasons have always gone up and down like a yo-yo in regards to viewer entertainment.

First couple of races this season have been a bit boring, however (even as a life long Ferrari fan), I’m loving Alonso’s performance this season, it’s unlikely but I’d love to see him the chequered flag this season.

There are more and more rules and regs coming in to close up the field and try to stop the big money teams having a monopoly. I do appreciate the spend cap to create fairness, teams will always be looking for new innovations or ways to bend the rules to gain an advantage, but that’s been the case for decades, anyone remember the Lotus 79 with its game changing ground effects?

One thing I would like to be brought in (although I can’t see it happening), is to ban communications between the driver and crew.

[vaud]

Marc p said:

One thing I would like to be brought in (although I can’t see it happening), is to ban communications between the driver and crew.

Won't happen due to safety. Always have to be able to get feedback on conditions, or inform a driver of a hazard.

One option would be to effectively ban the large hubs back at base by banning pit crew>base communications, so they just have the number of people at the track with a cap on numbers. Or limit the amount of data that could be sent back to base per race.

[anonymous-user]

Exactly, it is hardly a new thing look at the 1992 Season. Mansell qualified for the British grand prix nearly two seconds ahead of his team mate, and nearly 3 seconds ahead of Aryron Senna in Third.

2.74 seconds over one lap quicker than Ayrton Senna!

[nickfrog]

Marc p said:

nickfrog said:

Indeed. There have always been petulant drivers, that is a factor of the size of their ego, but by and large they are pretty level headed and the standards of team bosses has improved over the years IMO.

These 2 races weren't great tbh but it's early days.

I was born in 69 too and can remember some seriously boring and processional races in the 80s, 90s, 00s, etc...

Although I was born 2 decades later than yourself (...)

I feel so much better now

[thiscocks]

Muzzer79 said:

shaunroche said:

I have been spending too much time recently watching 1970's and 1980's F1 on youtube with the likes of Mansell battling his team mate Piquet as an example of the standard of the Sport at that time.

It's a fallacy to think that 70's/80's F1 was all action.

There were a lot of properly boring races, with high attrition, teams at the back who were way off the pace and dominant cars up front. Let's not forget the infamous 1988 McLarens which won every race apart from one.

This was interspersed with very memorable moments over the decade(s)

I will agree regarding 2023 to date - I recorded yesterday's race and skipped through 90% of it. If you're not a fan of the dominant team, it makes for a dull 2 hours.....

Quite, I have certainly sat through much duller races than this one. Enjoying at least seeing a different team up there. Not enjoying the pathetic state of the stewardship.