Drink drive killer, please help!!
Discussion
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Just to reiterate what a few people have already suggested - contacting ALL of the media outlets who covered her story originally (easily found through Google News) may result in them running something which will bring more attention to this issue.
Not much time left but you never know - it's worth knocking an email out to everyone, really.
Also Twitter - there are plenty of folks on there who'll champion a cause and retweet...
Not much time left but you never know - it's worth knocking an email out to everyone, really.
Also Twitter - there are plenty of folks on there who'll champion a cause and retweet...
I've just been told that the court will allow the family to present the petition as part of their impact statement at the hearing (having previously been told they were too late to submit one), so the more signatures the better. This all may actually have some small effect on things so thanks to all who've taken the time to sign 
In response to 10PS & as stated before, there are one hell of a lot of 'what ifs' with regards to the reasons cited for requesting early release which we will not know for sure until nearer the hearing. I understand that there can be significant reasons but surely if every parent was able to cite dependents as a means of reducing their sentence then the legal system would rapidly descend into farce?! Where is the deterrent factor if you know you can behave this irresponsibly to the point of killing someone and only get 6 months if you can manage to tick the correct boxes? Surely if dependents are involved they should be either looked after by family or taken into care for the duration of the sentence?
Having read and been quite affected by your prison diary in the past it seems pretty clear to me that how a person reacts and their actions after the event is almost as important as the event itself. This woman has done everything she possibly could to avoid taking responsibility for her actions from the moment she chose to get behind the wheel in the state she was in to the moment that she finally pleaded guilty after dragging the family & friends through 6 months of hell. Even now, unless an unbelievably good reason comes to light she is still doing the same thing to us! Most of us just want her to shut up and serve her sentence in a similar way to how you have managed to. Is that really too much to ask of her?
In response to 10PS & as stated before, there are one hell of a lot of 'what ifs' with regards to the reasons cited for requesting early release which we will not know for sure until nearer the hearing. I understand that there can be significant reasons but surely if every parent was able to cite dependents as a means of reducing their sentence then the legal system would rapidly descend into farce?! Where is the deterrent factor if you know you can behave this irresponsibly to the point of killing someone and only get 6 months if you can manage to tick the correct boxes? Surely if dependents are involved they should be either looked after by family or taken into care for the duration of the sentence?
Having read and been quite affected by your prison diary in the past it seems pretty clear to me that how a person reacts and their actions after the event is almost as important as the event itself. This woman has done everything she possibly could to avoid taking responsibility for her actions from the moment she chose to get behind the wheel in the state she was in to the moment that she finally pleaded guilty after dragging the family & friends through 6 months of hell. Even now, unless an unbelievably good reason comes to light she is still doing the same thing to us! Most of us just want her to shut up and serve her sentence in a similar way to how you have managed to. Is that really too much to ask of her?
Normally, dependants are considered when the sentence is decided - there's no mention in the news whether she has kids/a partner/a job or whatever so we've no idea of the circumstances.
What bothers me - and why I signed and promoted the link as much as I could - is that she clearly hasn't taken-in what she's done and she thinks can be wheedle her way out of it.
6 years for killing someone is not enough (a friend of mine is serving 20 for driving a car FFS!) - 6 MONTHS is insulting not just to the family and friends of the victim, but to the entire concept of justice.
All she's doing is wasting court time (and thus public money) - there's no doubt she was guilty, her sentence already showed more leniency than she appears to deserve, any further protestation should be met with a firm "Get Back in your Cell and come out when you've grasped a tiny part of what you've done eh?"
What bothers me - and why I signed and promoted the link as much as I could - is that she clearly hasn't taken-in what she's done and she thinks can be wheedle her way out of it.
6 years for killing someone is not enough (a friend of mine is serving 20 for driving a car FFS!) - 6 MONTHS is insulting not just to the family and friends of the victim, but to the entire concept of justice.
All she's doing is wasting court time (and thus public money) - there's no doubt she was guilty, her sentence already showed more leniency than she appears to deserve, any further protestation should be met with a firm "Get Back in your Cell and come out when you've grasped a tiny part of what you've done eh?"
johnpeat said:
Just to reiterate what a few people have already suggested - contacting ALL of the media outlets who covered her story originally (easily found through Google News) may result in them running something which will bring more attention to this issue.
Not much time left but you never know - it's worth knocking an email out to everyone, really.
Also Twitter - there are plenty of folks on there who'll champion a cause and retweet...
John, I'm not sure I'm the one who should get the media involved although I started this petition thread with Wayne's family's approval. I will suggest it to them, however and offer to assist if needed...Not much time left but you never know - it's worth knocking an email out to everyone, really.
Also Twitter - there are plenty of folks on there who'll champion a cause and retweet...
Zed32 said:
John, I'm not sure I'm the one who should get the media involved although I started this petition thread with Wayne's family's approval. I will suggest it to them, however and offer to assist if needed...
It's certainly worth updating the petition to mention that it can be submitted as part of the parole hearing - I'll admit involving the media might not be the best idea (it seldom is!!) without the family being aware of it tho - that's your call ofc.I assume you've posted this in other forums? (or that other PHers will have done this??) - bring in the other big car and bike sites and you could easily push that petition over 4/5K sigs - get Twitter onboard and you could double that easily.
Signed and hope she doesnt get considered for earlier release. Shameful.
One posters comments on this thread is also shameful. This woman deliberately drink drove, deliberately didnt stop at the scene of the accident. When drink driving she could have stopped at any point, it wasnt a momentary lapse or accidental. She doesnt need an apologist.
One posters comments on this thread is also shameful. This woman deliberately drink drove, deliberately didnt stop at the scene of the accident. When drink driving she could have stopped at any point, it wasnt a momentary lapse or accidental. She doesnt need an apologist.
Hmm. Whilst I totally deplore drink driving, and would never do it myself (especially as I'm teetotal) I think that 10PS is providing a bit of valuable moderation to this very one sided thread.
Whilst of course it is awful that this poor guy died on the roads and it should not have happened, I'm still surprised and slightly saddened by the types of responses this thread seems to be getting. Saying drink drivers should get the death penalty is probably straying pretty far into the realms of keyboard warriorism IMO especially considering the number of voters who voted for political parties who claim to be 'progressive' in the UK.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a motorcyclist myself, and I'm aware of the risks involved. I would not want those risks made any worse by people being irresponsible. However, people sometimes do things that they wouldn't ordinarily otherwise do. If you read the reports in the Swindon Farmers Market weekly or whatever the newspaper is called, she had been on a night out, had an argument with her partner and thought she was OK to drive. It was wrong and she should not have done it. However, it was the decision of a moment, It was not a pre meditated act. She did not intend to take this poor chap's life. I'd like to think that if there is an afterlife, and it were me involved, that I wouldn't hold a grudge.
The question of early release due to hardship is of course a thorny one. On the face of it she probably should serve her sentence because she did take a life. However, we don't know the full details of said hardship, and being this isn't something we hear about a lot in the news, and the Sun doesn't regularly lambast the court system for letting crims out because they found prison a bit hard, I suspect the reasons behind the appeal are probably exceptional.
To reiterate, I do despise drink drivers, especially habitual ones however, I find the tone of some of the responses in this thread a little difficult to stomach, despite me fitting into the Daily Mail reading Conservative voting motorcyclist demographic. So, by any standards my political views are pretty right wing, but I still think that some of the views expressed in this thread are a little extreme, *especially* considering that none of us actually know the full facts.
Whilst of course it is awful that this poor guy died on the roads and it should not have happened, I'm still surprised and slightly saddened by the types of responses this thread seems to be getting. Saying drink drivers should get the death penalty is probably straying pretty far into the realms of keyboard warriorism IMO especially considering the number of voters who voted for political parties who claim to be 'progressive' in the UK.
Don't get me wrong, I'm a motorcyclist myself, and I'm aware of the risks involved. I would not want those risks made any worse by people being irresponsible. However, people sometimes do things that they wouldn't ordinarily otherwise do. If you read the reports in the Swindon Farmers Market weekly or whatever the newspaper is called, she had been on a night out, had an argument with her partner and thought she was OK to drive. It was wrong and she should not have done it. However, it was the decision of a moment, It was not a pre meditated act. She did not intend to take this poor chap's life. I'd like to think that if there is an afterlife, and it were me involved, that I wouldn't hold a grudge.
The question of early release due to hardship is of course a thorny one. On the face of it she probably should serve her sentence because she did take a life. However, we don't know the full details of said hardship, and being this isn't something we hear about a lot in the news, and the Sun doesn't regularly lambast the court system for letting crims out because they found prison a bit hard, I suspect the reasons behind the appeal are probably exceptional.
To reiterate, I do despise drink drivers, especially habitual ones however, I find the tone of some of the responses in this thread a little difficult to stomach, despite me fitting into the Daily Mail reading Conservative voting motorcyclist demographic. So, by any standards my political views are pretty right wing, but I still think that some of the views expressed in this thread are a little extreme, *especially* considering that none of us actually know the full facts.
Just to add to the mix on here,We all ( well I think most reasonable people)would deem Murder as being the most serious crime there is ( and yes I know there are degrees of murder,depending on the circumstances).
As a former Police Officer I do know all the definitions of the charges and what each part of each carefully put word of each definition means.
If this woman had shot or knifed the victim to death for no apparent reason I'm sure the sentence she would have received would have been a lot more severe than the sentence she did receive even if she used the ' I was drunk ' excuse/reason in her defence.
Well technically she used her car as a weapon to kill the victim, she knew it was wrong to drive the car when drunk just as she would know it was wrong to have a gun or knife.The end result was the same,the victim was dead.
I think the sentences should be similar for causing death whilst driving and maybe not murder ( intent to kill) but certainly manslaughter ( no intent to kill).
The maximum sentence for murder and manslaughter are the same,or used to be,Life imprisonment.
Although the families of the victim and the perpetrator are both innocent and had no choice in the crime and will both suffer as a result of the sentence for different obvious reasons, it sends out the wrong message by releasing her early after such a short period of time, because the family of the victim should be given much more consideration than the family of the woman because she is still alive albeit incarcerated.
Justice would definately not be served by letting her out after 6 months or even a year.
I think there should be a minimum sentence which must be served before release can even be considered.It's the only part of the american system I like.
The minimum sentence should be decided on by more qualified people than me but the principle of having a minimum sentence should be discussed.
Sorry if I've bored you but it's just my thoughts.
As a former Police Officer I do know all the definitions of the charges and what each part of each carefully put word of each definition means.
If this woman had shot or knifed the victim to death for no apparent reason I'm sure the sentence she would have received would have been a lot more severe than the sentence she did receive even if she used the ' I was drunk ' excuse/reason in her defence.
Well technically she used her car as a weapon to kill the victim, she knew it was wrong to drive the car when drunk just as she would know it was wrong to have a gun or knife.The end result was the same,the victim was dead.
I think the sentences should be similar for causing death whilst driving and maybe not murder ( intent to kill) but certainly manslaughter ( no intent to kill).
The maximum sentence for murder and manslaughter are the same,or used to be,Life imprisonment.
Although the families of the victim and the perpetrator are both innocent and had no choice in the crime and will both suffer as a result of the sentence for different obvious reasons, it sends out the wrong message by releasing her early after such a short period of time, because the family of the victim should be given much more consideration than the family of the woman because she is still alive albeit incarcerated.
Justice would definately not be served by letting her out after 6 months or even a year.
I think there should be a minimum sentence which must be served before release can even be considered.It's the only part of the american system I like.
The minimum sentence should be decided on by more qualified people than me but the principle of having a minimum sentence should be discussed.
Sorry if I've bored you but it's just my thoughts.
Edited by iluvminis on Thursday 8th September 00:18
I find it strange that all posters seem to support the proposal. Can I first say that of course I have enormous sympathy for the family and friends of the deceased? Having said that, nothing can bring him back. I do not believe that the views of victims should be a pertinent factor in deciding sentences - I consider that should be a job for the courts. And I don't understand why harsher treatment for the perpetrator should make the family and friends feel better.
I also consider that six months in prison is a very significant sentence. I have only ever known well one prisoner, but he was in gaol for two months; after that he suffered a nervous breakdown, and his life was significantly damaged by the experience. I don't really believe that this woman would come out of prison a better person if she was made to spend longer inside.
I don't mind what the court should decide is fair in this case; but I think the court should consider far more detail than is available in this thread, and should decide on the basis of the woman's circumstances, and of how her sentence compares with other sentences given for similar offences.
I also consider that six months in prison is a very significant sentence. I have only ever known well one prisoner, but he was in gaol for two months; after that he suffered a nervous breakdown, and his life was significantly damaged by the experience. I don't really believe that this woman would come out of prison a better person if she was made to spend longer inside.
I don't mind what the court should decide is fair in this case; but I think the court should consider far more detail than is available in this thread, and should decide on the basis of the woman's circumstances, and of how her sentence compares with other sentences given for similar offences.
Is the only offence of which she has been convicted death by careless driving? I don't know any driver who has never been guilty of careless driving. Drink driving does not generally carry a prison sentence. Why should the penalty be so disproportionately larger because of the outcome?
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