RE: OAP drivers: a liability?

RE: OAP drivers: a liability?

Tuesday 13th March 2012

OAP drivers: a liability?

Should older drivers face greater restrictions? A Government body suggests they should



Older drivers need to take a refresher course once they reach a certain age. Not exactly a controversial statement, but this advice to the Government has come from the Parliamentary Advisory Council for Transport Safety, or PACTS.

Mild-mannered where Brake is hysterical and far more influential within the corridors of power, PACTS could see this one pushed through.

We all know the dangers of elderly drivers. If we need reminding, there's that shot of 93-year-old Jack Higgs' Fiesta resting upside on PistonHeader Family Guy's Porsche 993 back in 2008.

Or how about footage of an 84-year-old woman in Philidelphia driving the wrong way upan interstate in 2010.

But at the same time we all fear the day we'd have to permanently hand over the keys for our own safety. Not that we'll be forced to. In the UK, you have to reapply for your licence every three years after turning 70. But here's no test, no medical, just a declaration from yourself that, yep, I'm still an A1 wheelsmith.

We can't go on like this, reckons PACTS. As a country we're getting older, with one in six now aged over 65, with one in four predicted in 2050. We're hanging onto our licences longer too. Back in 1975, only 15 per cent of people over 70 kept their licences. As of 2010, it was over half.

Japan is our crystal ball. The ageing population over there has turned the Toyko motor show into the equivalent of a Motability exhibition, with a huge array of gadgets and converted vehicles to keep older people driving.

Given all that, the PACTS idea of a mandatory course makes sense. "It would be a refresher course to outline difficulties they face and suggest ways they could make it easier to drive more safely," said a PACTS spokeswoman.

The role model is the SAGE course in Gloucestershire, where older drivers voluntarily sign themselves up for the £30, hour-long monitored drive. Or they can be referred to by the police or (brave) relatives.

PACTS points out the speed awareness course network could easily be adapted to include the older drivers, but is nicely concerned about drivers getting ominous looking letters through the door from the local camera partnership. "It's vital that the course providers are seen as a non-threatening organisation."

It all sounds very sensible, this author having personal experience of the family split following the attempt to prise the keys to a Peugeot 106 from a 94-year-old relative last year. An official thumbs down on safety grounds would have saved a lot of additional heartache.

So what do you think? Mandatory courses sound like a good idea? Or does the government need to go further still?

Author
Discussion

dapearson

Original Poster:

4,310 posts

224 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
I posted this on another thread a while back, but it seems fitting to post it again here.

Worst piece of bad driving i've seen was an old lady pulling out of a lay-by in front of me a couple of years ago.

It was the sort of long lay-by that's separated from the dual carriageway by chevrons. I saw ahead that she was starting to move forward from where she was parked, but there was time for me to stay in the inside lane and i would be past before she exited from the junction at the end of the lay-by.

Unfortunately that's not what she did. She turned immediately right ACROSS the chevrons and into my path!

I swerved into the outside lane, resulting in a tyre squealing slide at 70mph. I gathered it up, and then sat in the inside lane at 50 mph, cursing old people. No doubt she was "tutting" to herself at the hooligan that hadn't pulled over for her un-indicated and dangerous 90 degree turn into dual carriageway traffic.

TheOrangePeril

778 posts

180 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
IMO there should be mandatory refresher courses for all ages, not just OAPs! Considering the pathetic ease with which you can get a license in the UK, there should really be a re-test or refresher every ten years, increasing to a more concise period for older drivers. A lot of bad habits form in the first ten-twenty years of driving which are then further exacerbated by ageing issues in the last ten-twenty years.

Generally a good idea, but we shouldn't discount the huge numbers of younger bad drivers that could also benefit from refreshers in this vein.

325Ti

391 posts

146 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
I think it's a good idea.
Many older people are still perfectly safe on the roads, but there are some who are a danger to themselves and others around them.
Also very important if the 80 mph speed limit on motorways is passed

cbrbiker13

12 posts

147 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
My Granddad's both 78 were driving when they shouldn't be, one in a B-Class Mercedes that did everything for him, the other in a really old Polo that shouldn't have been, in the end unfortunately one died, not as a result of a car accident. The other had the car taken from him by family...
At the end of the day people will say it's common sense, but I wouldn't want someone telling me what to do with my licence after paying my dues for years...

y2blade

56,097 posts

215 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
FIL and MIL are both over retirement age, Both are shockingly bad drivers!!!
yet my dear old Nan driving in her 80s and is a cracking driver.

Not all old people are st behind the wheel.

RESSE

5,699 posts

221 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
Our local paper has been running a similar (same?) story recently:

http://www.expressandstar.com/news/2012/03/12/call...

Anubis

1,029 posts

179 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
Agree that some sort of test (medical and driving) needs to be put into place for the seniors.

My own grandfather, who at the grand age of 70 still thinks he is right in everything he does driving wise. It's everyone else that is wrong. rolleyes

Apparently everyone drives too fast (saying this whilst doing 45 on a 60mph A road), others headlights are either too bright or too dark (despite the fact he has bad vision) and leaves braking right up until the last minute because he cannot see the junction and his reaction times are slower than a sloths - he's my grandfather and we all love him very much but we run like hell to grab his keys when he says he's "just popping to the shop".

Driving is something he shouldn't be doing and he knows it deep down inside; i'm sure he isn't alone. Unfortunately some people just don't know when to quit until a bad accident involving innocent people happens. frown



Edited by Anubis on Tuesday 13th March 12:01

theJT

313 posts

185 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
I'm sort of agreed that there ought to be mandatory refresher courses for everyone, regardless of age - they just need to make sure they're not as random as the actual driving test can be. I got failed once for not having a crash (don't ask!). An ex-girlfriend of mine passed despite mounting the curb during her test... twice. She wasn't even doing any manoeuvres, just driving along.

Stew2000

2,776 posts

178 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
Driving instructors have to take refresher courses every few years. so why not everyone?

davepoth

29,395 posts

199 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
Obviously ability does drop as we age; but I wonder how much of it is just down to being terrible drivers and not having any ability in reserve to lose?

Lowtimer

4,286 posts

168 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
TheOrangePeril said:
IMO there should be mandatory refresher courses for all ages, not just OAPs! Considering the pathetic ease with which you can get a license in the UK, there should really be a re-test or refresher every ten years, increasing to a more concise period for older drivers. A lot of bad habits form in the first ten-twenty years of driving which are then further exacerbated by ageing issues in the last ten-twenty years.

Generally a good idea, but we shouldn't discount the huge numbers of younger bad drivers that could also benefit from refreshers in this vein.
I don't normally quote a whole post, but in this case I support every word.

robinessex

11,057 posts

181 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
The most dangerous nut in a car is the one driving it. We have to have our cars MOT every year for safety reasons, yet not the driver !! Considering that 99% of drivers can't drive correctly (BSM qualified driving instructor by the way), It's about time ALL drivers were tested every 5yrs, and to really stir things up, graduated licenses which relate your experience and competence to the power of the car you drive. PS. 64 years old, and I can see where I'm going, it's all those bloody vegatable drivers that get in my way that's the problem!!

mwstewart

7,596 posts

188 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
Seems like more oppression and regulation!

theJT

313 posts

185 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
@doogz: She's written off 2 cars since then too... maybe more by now, I've not spoken to her in a few years (thankfully) I have absolutely no idea how she passed, becuase in all the time I knew her she never gave any evidence of being able to drive at all.

I'll be honest tho, it doesn't surprize me that much. My experience of the driving test was that it had basically no connection to how you actually drove, and was entirely down to whatever mood the examiner was in at the time. The Motorcycling one seemed far more sensible - but possibly I just got better examiners when I took that.

WCZ

10,521 posts

194 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
old people on the road scare the crap out of me, it's an absolute joke just how bad some are at driving, they are such a danger.

PaulMoor

3,209 posts

163 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
cbrbiker13 said:
At the end of the day people will say it's common sense, but I wouldn't want someone telling me what to do with my licence after paying my dues for years...
Unfortunatly that is part of the problem. People feeling they have "right" to drive.

My mother is a nurse working with the elderly and apparently when people do have to give medical evidence or have a notifiable condition doctors are loathed to stop anyone driving, dispite the danger they pose. These are people who are incapable of living alone (They need a nursing home - diffrent to a care home) yet are seen as fit to drive.

However I agree that being "old" dose not make you a bad driver, and bad drivers can be of any age.

DP1

258 posts

221 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
It is time that something was done. I had to talk my dad into stopping driving as he could hardly move, had to put his oxygen cylinder behind the seat and still thought he was safe!

Last year my friends niece was killed when some old duffer drove onto the pavement (throttle pressed instead of brake) and crushed her into a shop window. He'd already had a crash the week before, the police told him not to drive but could not stop him.

Stew2000

2,776 posts

178 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
theJT said:
I'll be honest tho, it doesn't surprize me that much. My experience of the driving test was that it had basically no connection to how you actually drove, and was entirely down to whatever mood the examiner was in at the time.
I sort of agree with this. It took about 5 times for me to pass my test.
Either too cautious or too dangerous.

Biker's Nemesis

38,637 posts

208 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
fk me! Another tax on the way.

STiG911

1,210 posts

167 months

Tuesday 13th March 2012
quotequote all
dapearson said:
Unfortunately that's not what she did. She turned immediately right ACROSS the chevrons and into my path!

I swerved into the outside lane, resulting in a tyre squealing slide at 70mph. I gathered it up, and then sat in the inside lane at 50 mph, cursing old people. No doubt she was "tutting" to herself at the hooligan that hadn't pulled over for her un-indicated and dangerous 90 degree turn into dual carriageway traffic.
This is the main problem - old people might not appear to be a bad risk as thay have hardly any accidents, but how many do they cause?!