Cars with best steering wheel feedback
Discussion
doogz said:
Dr Interceptor said:
doogz said:
They also went on fire, didn't they? The electric pump overheat IIRC?
Hydraulic pump... yes could overheat in very rare cases... Chances are as all the MK1 MINIs are now six years old minimum, if they've lasted for six years without combusting, they should be okay.http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=RC32...
C.A.R. said:
To answer your question, anything without power-steering will qualify highest.
[rant] I think everyone should experience a car with no power-assisted-steering at a young 'driving age'. The trouble with modern cars is that they are over-assisted, in nearly every application. This means your overall sensation of speed and traction / grip is impaired.
If you put a new driver used to driving modern cars in a non PAS-equipped car from the 90s they would probably think it was broken as they can't steer with their little finger.
Another reason why older cars = better
The steering feel from an Evora is perfectly acceptable even though they have PAS. The GT86 isn't bad either.[rant] I think everyone should experience a car with no power-assisted-steering at a young 'driving age'. The trouble with modern cars is that they are over-assisted, in nearly every application. This means your overall sensation of speed and traction / grip is impaired.
If you put a new driver used to driving modern cars in a non PAS-equipped car from the 90s they would probably think it was broken as they can't steer with their little finger.
Another reason why older cars = better
Bad PAS feels dreadful, good PAS feels good.
I'm trying to think of a car with non-assisted steering that felt bad, but I don't think I've driven anything with dreadful steering that wasn't PAS (yes Chevy Impala, I'm looking at you).
As an example of unassisted terrible steering, try an MGB. Another car for the list of those that have power assisted steering and good steering feel is a Lotus Excel.
OP, do please bear in mind that at this stage you are not very experienced with cars. Insurance will probably confine you to something a bit mundane for a while, but you can gain driving experience and sample more interesting cars later.
OP, do please bear in mind that at this stage you are not very experienced with cars. Insurance will probably confine you to something a bit mundane for a while, but you can gain driving experience and sample more interesting cars later.
nottyash said:
renrut said:
MR2 mk1. Amazing. I'd imagine an Elise would be very similar but better.
I miss mine
I reckon the mk3 was slightly better, even with electric power steering. It's about as close to a go kart as I have owned.I miss mine
davebem said:
Teocali said:
Best car I have had for steering feedback that may be insurable for a new driver, even the standard one is good fun.
Basically any car without ePAS is a good bet.
Older honda civics are great too, as are 205's but hurt on insurance. As mentioned basic MINI too
PS Good tyres , sorted suspension (new bushes, ball joints and even driveshafts) and tracking really help feel, not always sorted on budget cars
Leins said:
g3org3y said:
Find the E30 has vastly superior feel to the later E36
Yep, a world of difference in terms of steering feel between my E30 and E46 too. But the E46 counters with a much quicker steering rack
Slink said:
the 207 I drove on my lessons had brilliant steering wheel feel and could always tell where the wheel were and what way they were pointing just from the feedback from the steering wheel.
WHAT?! Not sure if serious.The 207s steering is bloody awful! You don't so much turn into a corner, as guess the required amount of lock, turn, curse, correct, curse some more. It's loose, floppy, the rack is too slow. My sister had a go in mine last week and her only comment was on how unnervingly light and unpleasantly floppy the steering was.
If I could change just one thing about that car, the steering would be it! I hate it! It's awful!
Captain Muppet said:
C.A.R. said:
To answer your question, anything without power-steering will qualify highest.
[rant] I think everyone should experience a car with no power-assisted-steering at a young 'driving age'. The trouble with modern cars is that they are over-assisted, in nearly every application. This means your overall sensation of speed and traction / grip is impaired.
If you put a new driver used to driving modern cars in a non PAS-equipped car from the 90s they would probably think it was broken as they can't steer with their little finger.
Another reason why older cars = better
The steering feel from an Evora is perfectly acceptable even though they have PAS. The GT86 isn't bad either.[rant] I think everyone should experience a car with no power-assisted-steering at a young 'driving age'. The trouble with modern cars is that they are over-assisted, in nearly every application. This means your overall sensation of speed and traction / grip is impaired.
If you put a new driver used to driving modern cars in a non PAS-equipped car from the 90s they would probably think it was broken as they can't steer with their little finger.
Another reason why older cars = better
Bad PAS feels dreadful, good PAS feels good.
I'm trying to think of a car with non-assisted steering that felt bad, but I don't think I've driven anything with dreadful steering that wasn't PAS (yes Chevy Impala, I'm looking at you).
I've driven a few FWD hatchbacks and saloons without power steering which I found horrible for feedback. They weren't numb, as such, but they were full of useless information drowning out the stuff I wanted to feel. 1996 Kadett 140iS was awful. Citigolfs were OK, nothing special. They were accurate, at least. 205 also wasn't too bad but still a long way off the best RWD unassisted setups I have experienced. 1989ish Honda Ballade 150i was quite nice, I think that was unassisted, but in general the best feeling FWD systems I have driven all had PAS, and the 306 was the best of my experience.
In principle I'd support the suggestion that an unassisted rack and RWD together give the potential for the best unassisted steering, but it's never black and white like that. The 1996 Kadett also had some models available with PAS, which was much better because the unassisted rack felt full of compromises. The 306 used PAS well, so did the Focus Mk 1. On RWD, the Sapphire didn't give a lot of feedback but was still pleasant and precise and gave enough to let you know what was happening, while the E36 BMWs (with PAS) were IMO awful.
Lotus Esprits in the '90s were rated to have been improved by the addition of PAS by Mark Hales, who at the time tended to be the journalist arguably most vocal about the benefits and pleasures of good steering feel and feedback. Later on he felt that PAS improved the Diablo as well. Sometimes the forces just get too heavy, and the unassisted setup just gets too compromised to cope and the potential advantages are lost in the essential compromises.
So no, I just don't think the generalisation that lack of PAS will be best holds true. I've driven examples where unassisted and PAS have both been available and the PAS was better, and I've read about examples too.
EDIT: Also to add, steering feel is very subjective. We can all agree on a car that offers nothing, but when it comes to what feels good and what feels bad one person's meat is another's poison I would think.
Edited by Alfanatic on Monday 10th September 14:32
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