RE: BMW: don't drive your M5, M6
Discussion
Limpet said:
The build quality of a current BMW is unrecognisable to anyone used to older models. I have an F30 320d as a company car, and in six months / 12k:
- FEM body control module went haywire causing issues with the Stop/Start system and the windscreen wipers. Took six weeks to get the part from Germany, and then two full days to fit and program.
- The nearside front indicator intermittently stops working and nobody knows why
- The headlamp levelling system throws intermittent "fault" messages on the i-Drive screen on start up.
- The front suspension is starting to clonk noticeably on uneven road surfaces
- The paint is appalling. If you don't get bird droppings off within 24 hours it leaves a visible mark. It also chips and scratches seemingly if you look at it the wrong way. Car looks very secondhand already, despite being well cared for, having never been near an automatic car wash, and being regularly washed and polished.
- Although the design of the interior is very attractive, some of the materials used are very cheap and nasty. The plastic on the sides of the centre console is hard and scratchy, and the plastic around the climate control and stereo controls wouldn't be out of place in an 80's Peugeot. As in, you push it with your finger, and the whole thing creaks and moves. The silver plastic "aluminium" trim around the gear lever and on the gearknob itself is also marked already.
- At 12,000 miles it has already lost its tight, "new" feel. There are various intermittent buzzes and squeaks from the trim.
- The turbo has started to whine audibly on cold oil. Incredibly, the car is still telling me it's got 10k to go until its first oil change (22k oil change intervals on a relatively high output diesel engine seems ludicrous to me).
It strikes me BMW have substituted good basic solid engineering for bells and whistles, and fleet appeasement with service intervals that simply don't make sense for longevity. It's also not as good to drive as the equivalent E90, whatever the reviews say. The steering is numb, and the body roll a joke without the Adaptive suspension. Also it feels markedly less substantial generally. My last E90 had 65k on it when it went back. Still looked, felt and drove like a brand new car. This doesn't at 12k.
That's a shame, I've done 50k in 16 months in my F10 520d and it's as tight as a drum, and I've had zero issues. - FEM body control module went haywire causing issues with the Stop/Start system and the windscreen wipers. Took six weeks to get the part from Germany, and then two full days to fit and program.
- The nearside front indicator intermittently stops working and nobody knows why
- The headlamp levelling system throws intermittent "fault" messages on the i-Drive screen on start up.
- The front suspension is starting to clonk noticeably on uneven road surfaces
- The paint is appalling. If you don't get bird droppings off within 24 hours it leaves a visible mark. It also chips and scratches seemingly if you look at it the wrong way. Car looks very secondhand already, despite being well cared for, having never been near an automatic car wash, and being regularly washed and polished.
- Although the design of the interior is very attractive, some of the materials used are very cheap and nasty. The plastic on the sides of the centre console is hard and scratchy, and the plastic around the climate control and stereo controls wouldn't be out of place in an 80's Peugeot. As in, you push it with your finger, and the whole thing creaks and moves. The silver plastic "aluminium" trim around the gear lever and on the gearknob itself is also marked already.
- At 12,000 miles it has already lost its tight, "new" feel. There are various intermittent buzzes and squeaks from the trim.
- The turbo has started to whine audibly on cold oil. Incredibly, the car is still telling me it's got 10k to go until its first oil change (22k oil change intervals on a relatively high output diesel engine seems ludicrous to me).
It strikes me BMW have substituted good basic solid engineering for bells and whistles, and fleet appeasement with service intervals that simply don't make sense for longevity. It's also not as good to drive as the equivalent E90, whatever the reviews say. The steering is numb, and the body roll a joke without the Adaptive suspension. Also it feels markedly less substantial generally. My last E90 had 65k on it when it went back. Still looked, felt and drove like a brand new car. This doesn't at 12k.
Edited by Limpet on Wednesday 26th September 10:17
Everything feels like it's hewn from rock and nappa leather covers most areas of the car and the plastics are, well as good as plastics get.
I have sat in a F30 and I was surprised at the difference in quality compared to the 5 series, I was thinking of a 330d for my next car but I think I'll stick with another 5!
Derek Chevalier said:
Bladedancer said:
Derek Chevalier said:
Bladedancer said:
HPFP on 335 and 535
It's a lot more than just HPFP. Shame really, cause 335 could have been such a brilliant car.
At the time of purchase I was wondering why my 330 was more expensive than quite a few 335i...
Bladedancer said:
Derek Chevalier said:
Bladedancer said:
Derek Chevalier said:
Bladedancer said:
HPFP on 335 and 535
It's a lot more than just HPFP. Shame really, cause 335 could have been such a brilliant car.
At the time of purchase I was wondering why my 330 was more expensive than quite a few 335i...
Both the major German brands, Mercedes and BMW twenty years ago made a determined and successful entry into the volume car sector. Very successful judging by their sheer numbers on UK roads. Certainly BMWs more numerous than Fords and Vauxhalls locally.
In so doing, is it mere coincidence that their previously held worthy quality and prestige status has suffered and been tarnished more than a tad in recent years?
I always pick the brains of my friendly MoT tester when i have my cars tested. During the past decade or so, some of the stuff my MoT tester has described about the quality of various German and Japanese cars I found surprising, no, astonishing when he first told me. Not now.
There again, there was a time when he had the mindset of "All Rovers do that"...
Two decades of testing my own and my family's cars has changed that mindset for a good few years now. You can teach an old dog new tricks...
In so doing, is it mere coincidence that their previously held worthy quality and prestige status has suffered and been tarnished more than a tad in recent years?
I always pick the brains of my friendly MoT tester when i have my cars tested. During the past decade or so, some of the stuff my MoT tester has described about the quality of various German and Japanese cars I found surprising, no, astonishing when he first told me. Not now.
There again, there was a time when he had the mindset of "All Rovers do that"...
Two decades of testing my own and my family's cars has changed that mindset for a good few years now. You can teach an old dog new tricks... Limpet said:
- Although the design of the interior is very attractive, some of the materials used are very cheap and nasty. The plastic on the sides of the centre console is hard and scratchy, and the plastic around the climate control and stereo controls wouldn't be out of place in an 80's Peugeot. As in, you push it with your finger, and the whole thing creaks and moves. The silver plastic "aluminium" trim around the gear lever and on the gearknob itself is also marked already.
- At 12,000 miles it has already lost its tight, "new" feel. There are various intermittent buzzes and squeaks from the trim.
This is most definately true. My place of work makes interior parts for OEM's, and some of that is for a Teir 1 supplier of BMW, the adherence to drawings is almost non existent now. If you can take cost out of the finished part the spec/drawing will be adjusted to suit.- At 12,000 miles it has already lost its tight, "new" feel. There are various intermittent buzzes and squeaks from the trim.
For the bigger OEM's there are numerous off the shelf systems from Dow, Huntsman etc.. that are sold on cost. More filler they can get in these systems the more margin there is for them.
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