RE: Chris Harris video: 911 Turbo vs McLaren 12C

[AndyBrew]

Love these video's long may they continue, whilst I have no real desire to own either I can't help but think with a £100K difference in price the performance difference was hardly massive, especially considering the Mac jumped the start and the Porsche still took the win up to 120mph, forgive me but the last time I checked that pretty much wraps all daily driving real world experiences!!

The Mac did look nicer, but then it was Yellow and all the best looking cars are yellow

[jmcc500]

Is it just me or does the McLaren in Spider form (as tested) not have a hint of old school Ferrari with the flying buttresses? Brought to mind the 250LM for some reason. Lovely.

I was lucky enough to work on 12C development a couple of years ago. Amazing thing, truly astonishing performance and great ride. Just far too fast for the driver (me)!

[DMC2]

Let's not forget the turbo has four seats which puts it in a different league when it comes to usability.

[jp-sr71]

R35 GTR Cd = 0.27
991 TTS Cd = 0.29
MP4-12C Cd = 0.36

Those figures surprise me looking at the cars, but clearly they're not enough to enable 560hp to out-run 620hp, although it did look to me as if the Porsche had pegged the gap in the latter stages of the drag?

Optical illusion?

[GALLARDOGUY]

APOLO1 said:

Chris Great Vid,

Why did you not use launch control on both cars. Also was the TTS in sport plus mode, missive diff not just in torque but throttle map....I have done this test and if all the tts assets are used, its faster to 120.....Along with the 12C-SP as tested in that Colour is listed at 243k if it has CCBDs, the TTS as tested is 142k.....100k Diff......

Edited by APOLO1 on Wednesday 27th November 20:51

The excuses begin...

I'm afraid Mr Harris, your time as a motoring journalist is at an end, for you have contradicted the man who is beyond reproach and is most respected poster in the history of PH and perhaps the Internet.

APOLO1 is never wrong.

[redroadster]

Or buy a tuned nissan gtr and destroy them both ?

[Matt UK]

GRBF430F1 said:

1 - 0 to England. Porsche is a very good sports car but its not a supercar IMHO

Maybe Posrche are priming a GT2 with 2wd, carbon weight saving, even more extreme styling, 600bhp+ and £170k? Now that would be a supercar.

[anonymous-user]

I just want to live in a world where either of these cars is within reach.

In the meantime thanks to vids like this I can dream with more clarity

[Urban Sports]

Did Charris say which one he preferred? Can't remember.

[toppstuff]

redroadster said:

Or buy a tuned nissan gtr and destroy them both ?

A stock one would still run them close. Maybe still beat the 911.

It's too close to really matter though.

[redroadster]

Its not too close to matter on price, spend 35 grand with litchfield imports 8oo bhp plus gtr around 100 grand all in would destroy prob anything,why has no one tested against these super cars ?

[Carnnoisseur]

Thoroughly enjoyed that. I'm a Porsche man through and through, but on this occasion, I'd have to opt for the 12C, just not in that colour....

[NomduJour]

jp-sr71 said:

R35 GTR Cd = 0.27
991 TTS Cd = 0.29
MP4-12C Cd = 0.36

Those figures surprise me

CdA is more relevant - 911s have always had smallish frontal area hence accelerating quickly at higher speeds.

[EdM]

am a Porker fan through and through though a little less love for the turbo highly accomplished that it is ..have seen a few 12c's around now and whilst initially unsure about the purity of design particularly vs. Italian exotica, in the flesh they are properly epic machines just standing still. Saw one coming out of the city a few weeks back - it was giving it the beans over London Bridge and it made me smile as it still does now when I think about it ..essentially sticking two fingers up at... well most of the day to day mundane then most recently in Guildford parked smack bang in the middle of the town centre which is no stranger to various exotica parked up on a Saturday...the owner could have done the right thing and discreetly driven off with full cred intact but aware instead of a good many envious eyes, was enthusiastic with the loud pedal - epic noise and an omnipotent road presence and at 46 years old and I was 18 again just for a minute...proper cars still manage to do that..

[BMCG]

Shame there were no lap times....a drag race seems a rather limited, nae facile/uni-dimensional, appraisal....

[mrjohnnunney]

Great video again Mr Harris :-) Amazing to think that McLaren with a history of only 2 road cars can be on a level with Porsche!

[kambites]

NomduJour said:

CdA is more relevant - 911s have always had smallish frontal area hence accelerating quickly at higher speeds.

I'd imagine the Mclaren's is smaller. It may be marginally wider, but it's a fair bit lower.

[jp-sr71]

NomDeJour said:

CdA is more relevant

Sure, top speed is a function of Cd*A but in assessing the efficacy of the respective designs, Cd is the important figure.

If those figures are correct, its another testimony to the cleverness of the GTR design.

It would be good to line up a Nismo GTR against these cars.

Edited by jp-sr71 on Wednesday 27th November 22:23

[kambites]

jp-sr71 said:

Sure, top speed is a function of Cd*A but in assessing the efficacy of the respective designs, Cd is the important figure.

That depends rather on how you define "efficiency", I suppose. One could argue that achieving a small frontal area is just as much a part of clever design as achieving a low coefficient of drag.

[leeson660]

Dblue said:

APOLO1 said:

Chris Great Vid,

Why did you not use launch control on both cars. Also was the TTS in sport plus mode, missive diff not just in torque but throttle map....I have done this test and if all the tts assets are used, its faster to 120.....Along with the 12C-SP as tested in that Colour is listed at 243k if it has CCBDs, the TTS as tested is 142k.....100k Diff......

Edited by APOLO1 on Wednesday 27th November 20:51

Mate, they are both in max attack mode and the slowest Mac is just faster than the fastest Porsche (Until the 918 arrives) it really is.Did you not just watch it ??

The Turbo is a fine car but its not as quick as the 12C. And yes, the 12C costs a lot more but the Turbo is a lot of money for a car that looks not entirely unlike a £45k Boxster. And I say that as a lover of all things 911.

997 GT2rs?

You may still be correct but I'd imagine the RS would give it a real good run for its money in a drag race.

I still think the MP4c looks and sounds so so dull for such an expensive car. Leaves me completely cold.