Flemke - Is this your McLaren? (Vol 5)

[Alfa numeric]

WCZ said:

vincegail said:

https://jalopnik.com/theres-a-paint-job-that-actua...

more of a rip off of the Maserati MC12 I'd of thought?

looks wonderful in that colour!

My initial reaction was it looks like a Veyron L'Or Blanc.

[trackdemon]

WCZ said:

vincegail said:

https://jalopnik.com/theres-a-paint-job-that-actua...

more of a rip off of the Maserati MC12 I'd of thought?

looks wonderful in that colour!

I think it looks terrible. Surely a car as purposeful as the Senna deserves battleship grey/black, not some gaudy art.

[flemke]

Swampy1982 said:

I see above you mention the Senna and say it's a great driving machine. How is your order progressing and did you settle on a colour as I know you were keen to challenge yourself to find the right colour in order to disguise some of the more prominent aero.

When you say its a great driving machine, are you able to share details about when you drove it, was it track or road etc. It's something I likely will never get a chance to do so as with most things you share, it would be lovely to hear about it.

I stated that based on what I have been told and have read. The company has not offered demo drives (or at least not to me!)
I don't know exactly when the car will be ready, but they told me Q3, which we are now in. They have a factory holiday coming up; I'd guess that it will be ready soon after they have returned to work.

[flemke]

vincegail said:

https://jalopnik.com/theres-a-paint-job-that-actua...

Not to my taste, but technically it seems good. I wouldn't have put the Interlagos trace on the bonnet, or the "1" on the wing end plates, but overall it's well done.

[flemke]

CanAm said:

flemke said:

I'm not sure I follow what you're saying. Any pics to illustrate?

Good looking car but I associate the name with with an old biplane.



Bristol Beaufighter. A name I associate with a great WW2 Fighter, but stuck on one of Bristol's most boring looking cars.

To my eye, both aeroplanes are more attractive than the cars named after them. Agreed that the Beaufighter (plane) is a slam dunk.

Cheers.

[flemke]

PAUL500 said:

flemke said:

PAUL500 said:

flemke said:

I have no idea. I have said before that it seems that the operating mentality is that if they make great products, how they handle the rest of the business will (kind of) take care of itself. I don't agree with that, but one gets that sense.
The concept of taking half-million pound, non-returnable deposits off people for something that not only will they not receive for three years but they won't even be allowed to see so much as a drawing of it until a couple of years after they have paid the non-returnable deposit seems dubious at best.

Well I guess for the elite few that have that chance then it is a no brainer, as so far its been guaranteed free money when the car arrives as is instantly worth far more than they paid for it!

Plus no doubt its also a sure fire way to end up on the next money go round list of elite buyers for the next car as well.

It's worked out that way in recent years, but trees don't grow to the sky.
At the same time, we'll have on sale something like 500 Chirons, 175 Valkyries, 275 Project Ones, 106 () Speedtails, the usual admixture of Paganis and K'eggs, and by then we'll probably have another over-hyped piece of crap from Ferrari as well. That's more than 1000 sports cars each costing in excess of £2m. Also, the Speedtail will not be road-legal in the US until at least the production run is complete, if not later. Yes, today one could sell a forward on a Speedtail for more than list (if one could get that past McLaren), but there is some risk in waiting for another couple of years until delivery.
The P15 Senna is a sure thing, largely because it is a great driving machine. The BP23 Speedtail is not a sure thing, because it is largely a showpiece.

I do not see these small runs of Mclarens going the way of the XJ220 though really, and at the end of the day its just rich guys making money from even richer guys when they sell them straight on, so no harm done in the end! :-)

Yes, but as with most things, the value of any "special" car is captive to the overall market. The XJ220 was sort of doomed when they made the short-sighted decision to go from a V12 to a turbo 6, but the broad decline in the classic car market (which definitely affected sales of F1s) made a bad situation irretrievable.
I think the P15 ("Senna") is extra special, and (for the time being at least) it occupies a unique place in the market, and that will help support the market for it, whereas the 650 - 675 LT - 720 are too similar (and too many in build numbers) to allow any of them the breathing room they need to hold value.

[flemke]

E65Ross said:

By the sounds of it Flemke you think the Senna is a good drive. Do you think it'd be quicker than the NEW Aventador SVJ around that green place?

It had better be!
(Although these lap-times are hugely dependent on tyre spec, and also how close to a true production car the car being tested is. People more familiar with the way that Lambo do things than I am have said the car that did 6:44 was not the same as what the stock car will be.)

[flemke]

trackdemon said:

E65Ross said:

Perhaps Flemke will loan his out to a pro driver?

Wouldn't be the first time

Have I?
I guess a few pros have driven my cars, but none has tried to set a 'Ring time (as far as I know, at least ).

[flemke]

cc8s said:

flemke said:

Peloton25 said:

Hammer111 said:

McLaren has been saying there will be 106 of these Speedtails built, same number as the F1. But that 106 for the F1 included destroyed prototypes and by my count 4 cars McLaren never sold. Are they following the same? Or will this be xxx/106 customer cars + X prototypes + Y crash tested vehicles + Z Cars Mclaren keeps + well we know what they've done recently.

Cheers!

There will be 106 production Speedtails sold and delivered to customers. From what I have been told, they have committed that they will not refurbish/resell the prototypes of BP23 as they have done in the past with cars like the P1. Time will tell if they stick to that plan, and also the suggestion that there will be no additional variants of BP23 forthcoming.

One should assume they would keep one of those prototype units for themselves, and that's okay because the F1's spare chassis often causes people to count the total number of F1s inaccurately at 107.

>8^)
ER

I'll trust them on this one after say a decade has passed since the official end of the production run.

In Flewitt's letter to depositers, he wrote that McLaren would not be building a spider version of the BP23 because certain engineering issues made that impossible.

What he did not say was, if McLaren's engineers were miraculously to solve those engineering issues, whether McLaren would then consider themselves at liberty to make a spider version - of course, purely in response to "customer demand", not because McLaren were interested in making a bunch of free money by spreading the fixed costs over more units.

Unless something has changed internally, I think the urge to make extra cars, along with the track record thus far, would lead us to expect extra cars. I think we would be naive to think otherwise.

On a tangent, I'm impressed with the number of Senna prototypes kicking about and will be interested to see how many are sold on.

Regarding the sale of prototypes, they never sell on the mules, as far as I can tell. But anything from late XPs onwards are fair game for selling, I believe. On that note, there are no Senna XPs.

Yes, as I think I wrote, I fully expect McLaren to sell more than 575 Senna and Senna GTR cars. My guess is that it will be a total of something like 600 units. I think the market is fully prepared for that.
If, however, they were to pump out 650, that would be a problem.

[flemke]

thegreenhell said:

SpeckledJim said:

The more livery poured over it, the less pants it looks.

It just needs full camo so we can't see it at all and it will be perfect.

That's the idea!

[trackdemon]

flemke said:

trackdemon said:

E65Ross said:

Perhaps Flemke will loan his out to a pro driver?

Wouldn't be the first time

Have I?
I guess a few pros have driven my cars, but none has tried to set a 'Ring time (as far as I know, at least ).

Dickie is a very good driver. The 'ring is a different set of poker stakes than Bedford though

[Swampy1982]

flemke said:

Swampy1982 said:

I see above you mention the Senna and say it's a great driving machine. How is your order progressing and did you settle on a colour as I know you were keen to challenge yourself to find the right colour in order to disguise some of the more prominent aero.

When you say its a great driving machine, are you able to share details about when you drove it, was it track or road etc. It's something I likely will never get a chance to do so as with most things you share, it would be lovely to hear about it.

I stated that based on what I have been told and have read. The company has not offered demo drives (or at least not to me!)
I don't know exactly when the car will be ready, but they told me Q3, which we are now in. They have a factory holiday coming up; I'd guess that it will be ready soon after they have returned to work.

Thanks for the answer, appreciated, look forward to seeing the colour scheme you went with, and your thoughts when you get a chance to drive it.

I'm aware you know your way round a circuit or two, but have prioritised other life choices over doing any track time recently. Do you think the P15 will change that for you, at least once, to enjoy the car for its intended purpose?

[flemke]

trackdemon said:

flemke said:

trackdemon said:

E65Ross said:

Perhaps Flemke will loan his out to a pro driver?

Wouldn't be the first time

Have I?
I guess a few pros have driven my cars, but none has tried to set a 'Ring time (as far as I know, at least ).

Dickie is a very good driver. The 'ring is a different set of poker stakes than Bedford though

I have a lot of time for Richard for a number of reasons and, as you say, he is an excellent driver. I was however thinking of current or former professional racing drivers.

[flemke]

Swampy1982 said:

flemke said:

Swampy1982 said:

I see above you mention the Senna and say it's a great driving machine. How is your order progressing and did you settle on a colour as I know you were keen to challenge yourself to find the right colour in order to disguise some of the more prominent aero.

When you say its a great driving machine, are you able to share details about when you drove it, was it track or road etc. It's something I likely will never get a chance to do so as with most things you share, it would be lovely to hear about it.

I stated that based on what I have been told and have read. The company has not offered demo drives (or at least not to me!)
I don't know exactly when the car will be ready, but they told me Q3, which we are now in. They have a factory holiday coming up; I'd guess that it will be ready soon after they have returned to work.

Thanks for the answer, appreciated, look forward to seeing the colour scheme you went with, and your thoughts when you get a chance to drive it.

I'm aware you know your way round a circuit or two, but have prioritised other life choices over doing any track time recently. Do you think the P15 will change that for you, at least once, to enjoy the car for its intended purpose?

No. I got it as a road car, actually. Whether it will be any good as a road car we shall see.

[Caddyshack]

Flemke himself is a very good track driver and I know that Mr Cooke and Trevor Reeves really know how to pedal and Mr Cooke has done more ring miles than many.

[SpeckledJim]

flemke said:

Swampy1982 said:

flemke said:

Swampy1982 said:

I see above you mention the Senna and say it's a great driving machine. How is your order progressing and did you settle on a colour as I know you were keen to challenge yourself to find the right colour in order to disguise some of the more prominent aero.

When you say its a great driving machine, are you able to share details about when you drove it, was it track or road etc. It's something I likely will never get a chance to do so as with most things you share, it would be lovely to hear about it.

I stated that based on what I have been told and have read. The company has not offered demo drives (or at least not to me!)
I don't know exactly when the car will be ready, but they told me Q3, which we are now in. They have a factory holiday coming up; I'd guess that it will be ready soon after they have returned to work.

Thanks for the answer, appreciated, look forward to seeing the colour scheme you went with, and your thoughts when you get a chance to drive it.

I'm aware you know your way round a circuit or two, but have prioritised other life choices over doing any track time recently. Do you think the P15 will change that for you, at least once, to enjoy the car for its intended purpose?

No. I got it as a road car, actually. Whether it will be any good as a road car we shall see.

I’m interested in your verdict, but I’d be very surprised if the answer is anything other than “ no, it’s miles too stiff, and nothing comes alive until you’re doing 100mph”.

Either it’s a terrific road car or it’s a terrific race car. Surely there’s no space for a blend?

[flemke]

SpeckledJim said:

flemke said:

Swampy1982 said:

flemke said:

Swampy1982 said:

I see above you mention the Senna and say it's a great driving machine. How is your order progressing and did you settle on a colour as I know you were keen to challenge yourself to find the right colour in order to disguise some of the more prominent aero.

When you say its a great driving machine, are you able to share details about when you drove it, was it track or road etc. It's something I likely will never get a chance to do so as with most things you share, it would be lovely to hear about it.

I stated that based on what I have been told and have read. The company has not offered demo drives (or at least not to me!)
I don't know exactly when the car will be ready, but they told me Q3, which we are now in. They have a factory holiday coming up; I'd guess that it will be ready soon after they have returned to work.

Thanks for the answer, appreciated, look forward to seeing the colour scheme you went with, and your thoughts when you get a chance to drive it.

I'm aware you know your way round a circuit or two, but have prioritised other life choices over doing any track time recently. Do you think the P15 will change that for you, at least once, to enjoy the car for its intended purpose?

No. I got it as a road car, actually. Whether it will be any good as a road car we shall see.

I’m interested in your verdict, but I’d be very surprised if the answer is anything other than “ no, it’s miles too stiff, and nothing comes alive until you’re doing 100mph”.

Either it’s a terrific road car or it’s a terrific race car. Surely there’s no space for a blend?

I've done plenty of miles in stiff cars (400 in a day in a 993 RS Clubsport, 400 in a Rocket, which isn't stiff but still not the comfiest for spending a day behind the wheel, 950 is a very stiffly-sprung GT3), but I suspect that, because of the needs of the P15 suspension to accommodate all that downforce, the car will be another notch if not more above really stiff but non-downforce road cars. At least it will have air-con!

[trackdemon]

Road drive around the North Coast 500 in this months EVO, they seem suitably impressed with it's road abilities....

[Dr Gitlin]

flemke said:

Yes, but as with most things, the value of any "special" car is captive to the overall market. The XJ220 was sort of doomed when they made the short-sighted decision to go from a V12 to a turbo 6,

I don't know that "short-sighted" is entirely fair; if they'd kept the V12 (and AWD) the car would have been even bigger than it ended up being.

[vincegail]

This month's EVO and Top Gear on their Facebook page both drive a Senna, both with numberplate Y1 OOV, albeit the Senna in EVO is red, and the one driven by Top Gear is blue? Why and how is that?

EVO is absolutely smitten by the Senna, haven't watched the Top Gear clip yet, but expect similar findings.