RE: VW Golf R: Driven
Discussion
wormus said:
This is proving to be hard work, so let me try again, slowwwly.
1) I like the Golf R, it's a decent car, pretty swift and meets the needs of many punters who either choose or can only afford one car.
2) I am not a snob, how can I be driving around in an old Saab part of the time?
3) The Golf, in my opinion, is not a car people aspire to own, nor is it in any way a luxury product as it's accessible to the masses because of PCP.
4) I am one of the masses (as is everyone) and I don't aspire to own a Golf R, that's my choice.
5) I respect those that have chosen to drive a Golf R (on finance or otherwise) but they shouldn't look down on others because of points 3 & 4.
My comments about Neds, 4WD tumble dryers etc were for comedic affect mainly my own amusement. It made me laugh and that's all that matters.
I stick by what I said though - most Rs I've seen being driven on the road have been done so aggressively or with some point to prove, they should lighten up a little. Of course, I'm sure that's not everybody, just the ones I've seen.
See, if you had come out with that at the start things may have been a bit better on here. The only point I would contest really is point 3, as there are still many who aspire to have a Golf R and for whatever reason the do not have one. But then that leads me onto point 2, where I think the way you come across talking those who do lease or PCP seems to be with an air of superiority.1) I like the Golf R, it's a decent car, pretty swift and meets the needs of many punters who either choose or can only afford one car.
2) I am not a snob, how can I be driving around in an old Saab part of the time?
3) The Golf, in my opinion, is not a car people aspire to own, nor is it in any way a luxury product as it's accessible to the masses because of PCP.
4) I am one of the masses (as is everyone) and I don't aspire to own a Golf R, that's my choice.
5) I respect those that have chosen to drive a Golf R (on finance or otherwise) but they shouldn't look down on others because of points 3 & 4.
My comments about Neds, 4WD tumble dryers etc were for comedic affect mainly my own amusement. It made me laugh and that's all that matters.
I stick by what I said though - most Rs I've seen being driven on the road have been done so aggressively or with some point to prove, they should lighten up a little. Of course, I'm sure that's not everybody, just the ones I've seen.
wormus said:
Luxury is normally defined by scarcity. As soon as it's accessible to everyone, it becomes mainstream. Think iPhone etc.
Doesn't make it a bad product just not as desirable to those that have more choice. Discounting, short term leasing (as opposed to owning and retained value) and an economy built on credit is not not a good thing longer term. Just look at the retail industry for evidence - it's a race to the bottom, but I digress.
That's fair enough if that's your view of it. Doesn't make it a bad product just not as desirable to those that have more choice. Discounting, short term leasing (as opposed to owning and retained value) and an economy built on credit is not not a good thing longer term. Just look at the retail industry for evidence - it's a race to the bottom, but I digress.
Edited by wormus on Tuesday 25th April 15:28
I don't personally consider luxury as merely being defined by scarcity though. Any unnecessary indulgence can be considered a luxury irrelevant of it's availability and over the years I have know many folks go the extra mile to have a Golf over a cheaper and less desirable model of car, not because they needed it in any shape or form but because they desired it. That surely is the very definition of luxury?
I guess as with anything like this it's a matter on where your coming from on a financial level that sets your perspective. Not everyone can afford an iphone either.
wormus said:
Actually, you've had a pretty decent garage so I can see why. I'd like to learn more about the Reliant Kitten Estate.
Ooh, that was a good little car, we had a lot of fun with that. Thrashed the living daylights out of it, a light, revvy rear wheel drive Mini alternative which didn't break down every time it rained. Very direct steering, lovely snicky gear change, I had a bucket seat in to replace the inadequate driver's chair which kept breaking anyway - everybody took the piss, *everybody* who drove it came back with a broad grin on their face. 
Co-incidentally, I bought it from a mate who now owns a Golf R - or did, until thieves broke into his house for the keys and nicked it, not 2 weeks ago.
Said mate has an interesting little collection of cars but for him the lease prices meant an R was a no-brainer, considering what you got for the money. Another mate has had a succession of GTis - and we had GTis way back in the Mk 2 days (when we also had the Kitten, I think), and another motorsport mate has a Golf Bluemotion (with which he's not impressed with, but IIRC he got in the last scrappage scheme when he chopped in his Berlingo with mega-mileage on the clock).
Fwiw the my three pals with Golfs have been successful in life (we're all one side of 60 or t'other) - all this talk of 'aspiration' and 'masses' etc, they would just disregard as mugs talk, they wouldn't recognise what the hell such language is all about, I don't think. We laugh about such stuff down at the pub.
I 'get' the R, I feel I get it totally, as I do the GTi. Very quick point-to-point, over B roads and the like. It is a genuine criticism that the speed comes far too easily, but that's true of every performance car nowadays imo.
I do think that there will come a time when those who couldn't even afford the ridiculously low leases get their hands on them and I do think that in inner-city areas they might become a real pita chav-choice of car driven by people who see it as their life's task to be a major pita, but there we go.
heebeegeetee said:
I do think that there will come a time when those who couldn't even afford the ridiculously low leases get their hands on them and I do think that in inner-city areas they might become a real pita chav-choice of car driven by people who see it as their life's task to be a major pita, but there we go.
That said we seem to live in an era where getting a new car be it on lease or PCP can be a cheaper option than purchasing a two or three year old car. I do recall the outrage of a £30k+ Golf when it was announced. As a used car it is still a bloody expensive Golf!heebeegeetee said:
I do think that there will come a time when those who couldn't even afford the ridiculously low leases get their hands on them and I do think that in inner-city areas they might become a real pita chav-choice of car driven by people who see it as their life's task to be a major pita, but there we go.
I think you're right that it has the capacity to attract the wrong sort. Again, not the fault of the car. I was reading about the poor sod who was murdered at the weekend by thieves who stole his S3. Not the sort of thing I'd want parked on my drive. I had the tow bar nicked off my Disco a few weeks back and that was bad enough.
Edited by anonymous-user on Tuesday 25th April 18:59
Been trying to buy one of these for a few weeks now. Was told the Performance Pack and Akrapovic were available to order from week 18, this week, as were going into manufacture from week 22.
Dealer came back to me today, Akrapovic now on the SLI (what ever that is) but not the Performance Pack. Just had this back;
Roll on August.
Dealer came back to me today, Akrapovic now on the SLI (what ever that is) but not the Performance Pack. Just had this back;
VW Main Dealer said:
The Hub has been updated on bulletin VW0301-17 with the below information.
The Golf R performance pack will now build from week 35/late August 2017, so please manage customer expectations on lead times. The performance exhaust will still launch in week 22 2017, as planned.
Saw both of these on the car in Geneva a couple of months ago now. Frustrating that it's still not available. Does show on Drive the Deal's website, but so does Tech Pack, which isn't available on the 7.5..The Golf R performance pack will now build from week 35/late August 2017, so please manage customer expectations on lead times. The performance exhaust will still launch in week 22 2017, as planned.
Roll on August.
wormus said:
But it's not a Q car as most people know what it is and the young, scruffy driver has almost certainly rented it. It doesn't speak softly with silly, excessively farty exhausts, nor does it carry a big stick as it's not that quick either.
My £500 Saab with an £80 remap and exhaust would give it a run for its money.
I'm sorry to say this but you are dreaming my friend My £500 Saab with an £80 remap and exhaust would give it a run for its money.
Edited by wormus on Thursday 13th April 20:09
I have the more powerful 2004 SAAB 9-5 AERO (B235R) engine with a Stage 1 "NOOBTUNE" tweek = 275 BHP to your 2.0T and as much as I adore my 9-5 AERO there is no chance even that would bother a well driven GOLF "R" in a straight line... or otherwise. I say this as also an owner of a 2018 MK7.5 Golf R DSG who's driven both of these back to back 
FYI... I still love the old Swede 
Hackney said:
Having gone to the R from a Saab I have to disagree.
My Saab was worth considerably more than £500 though.
9-3 Turbo X with JZW Stage 1 (320bhp and pretty epic torque)
No doubt you could take a £500 Saab to a higher performance than the Golf but it'd be so fragile as to be a pain in the arse.
The Saab had character and would put a smile on my face (especially acceleration in 3rd) but performance, space, reliability and modernity the VW wins every time.
a £500 Saab with an £80 remap? No chance.
Yep My Saab was worth considerably more than £500 though.
9-3 Turbo X with JZW Stage 1 (320bhp and pretty epic torque)
No doubt you could take a £500 Saab to a higher performance than the Golf but it'd be so fragile as to be a pain in the arse.
The Saab had character and would put a smile on my face (especially acceleration in 3rd) but performance, space, reliability and modernity the VW wins every time.
a £500 Saab with an £80 remap? No chance.
spot on... BTW 9-3 Turbo X That's one rare & epic SAAB ... Congrats Team Muttley said:
dieselgrunt said:
What Saab is it ? Might have to get me one of these Golf R killers for just a monkey.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Saab-93-9-3-2-8T-Turbo-...
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Saab-9-3-2-8-V6-Aero-Sp...
Olivera said:
The Golf R suffers a bit due to its Lease-R reputation
You're not wrong https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfv9UgTo2-Aor my favorite https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pzyuU8rTzw
Edited by anonymous-user on Sunday 29th July 14:32
Olivera said:
The Golf R suffers a bit due to its Lease-R reputation
It only "suffers" if you give a s
t about what other people think. And, frankly, to the average motorist, there is no reputation anyway - it's just another Golf to them. Especially if you have removed the front and rear "R" badges like I have.
Olivera said:
The Golf R suffers a bit due to its Lease-R reputati.
I have to agree, I have been a Cupra owner for 11 years, I am getting rid of mine tomorrow after 4 years of ownership. Used to attend VAG shows with the SEAT groups but noticed last year or so its just been overtaken with people who lease Cupra's cheap, don't really care for them then send them back. Imagine the Golf R scene is very similar. wormus said:
or my favorite https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8pzyuU8rTzw
That's one of the worst vids I've seen for driving on British roads. Madness.Edited by wormus on Sunday 29th July 14:32
Coolbanana said:
I've had my "Nedmobile" (
) Golf R for a little while now; nearly 2 years and, even though I've only covered 6700 miles in it owing to frequent trips abroad, I know it well enough to compare it favourably to my previous 911, remapped 335i, Z4M etc as well as more exotic metal that I've had the pleasure of driving.
I didn't know about the lease deals when I bought mine otherwise I may have taken advantage of one rather than purchasing. I'm perfectly ok with financing and leasing; no snobbery there and I like that the Golf is a Family-mobile first and not a Track demon.
I've also experienced a particular neighbour thinking I'm getting poorer somehow having gone from a Porsche 911 to a "little Golf" as he called it. He enjoyed telling me his new-ish Audi was paid for. That's nice, I thought, my UK home is paid for and worth a lot more than his and my other home is nearly paid for and worth more than my UK home. All going well, I'll be emigrated and retired or semi-retired before the age of 49 later this year. But the penalty will be I won't be able to afford an expensive car. Which may mean some people will believe my car choice demonstrates I'm not a 'car enthusiast'. Maybe preferring my home and laid-back Lifestyle in a place with an average of 300 days of Sunshine does indicate a lack of love for cars.
I do like cars though and not just to look at.
The Golf R has been a joy to own and drive. It has been a pleasure on long trips to mainland Europe and I think it is the best car I've had for Suburbia; Town and City use.
It isn't a Sports car like a Porsche Boxster or a 911 is. It isn't as Track-focussed as some other 'Hot Hatches' are. It isn't even the fastest 'Hot Hatch'. So is it the car equivalent of "white goods" as some Posters here like to denigrate it as?
Not in my opinion. It is a car that can fulfil the small Family-vehicle role very well but it is more than that; it does evoke the spirit of the 'Hot Hatch' even if it isn't the sharpest, fastest or most characterful. It is, simply, very capable at doing everything. It doesn't need to be best at any one thing or everything - albeit it can be argued that it is the best at being good at everything. And that is where it sells itself; it is what many - including myself - prefer.
It isn't 'shouty' it isn't brash. It is a car that can go from A-B without drama, looking sensible and good while also appearing nondescript and yet able to produce a turn of speed and driveability to bring a smile when the opportunity arises.
For some, its lack of a distinct character or racy looks - or even an appearance to stand out from the crowd of other Golf's and small cars - leaves them cold. Some can't get their jollies in anything that doesn't have 1000bhp and scrapes their bottoms on the tarmac or cause heads to turn as they glide by with a massive whale-tail stuck to their rear. Some need attention. I get that. But it is precisely the qualities the Golf does and doesn't have that endears it to others, like me. I can have fun in this car while not causing a stir. It is, after all, a quick 296bhp car. And the best small car at being good at everything.
) Golf R for a little while now; nearly 2 years and, even though I've only covered 6700 miles in it owing to frequent trips abroad, I know it well enough to compare it favourably to my previous 911, remapped 335i, Z4M etc as well as more exotic metal that I've had the pleasure of driving. I didn't know about the lease deals when I bought mine otherwise I may have taken advantage of one rather than purchasing. I'm perfectly ok with financing and leasing; no snobbery there and I like that the Golf is a Family-mobile first and not a Track demon.
I've also experienced a particular neighbour thinking I'm getting poorer somehow having gone from a Porsche 911 to a "little Golf" as he called it. He enjoyed telling me his new-ish Audi was paid for. That's nice, I thought, my UK home is paid for and worth a lot more than his and my other home is nearly paid for and worth more than my UK home. All going well, I'll be emigrated and retired or semi-retired before the age of 49 later this year. But the penalty will be I won't be able to afford an expensive car. Which may mean some people will believe my car choice demonstrates I'm not a 'car enthusiast'. Maybe preferring my home and laid-back Lifestyle in a place with an average of 300 days of Sunshine does indicate a lack of love for cars.
I do like cars though and not just to look at.
The Golf R has been a joy to own and drive. It has been a pleasure on long trips to mainland Europe and I think it is the best car I've had for Suburbia; Town and City use.
It isn't a Sports car like a Porsche Boxster or a 911 is. It isn't as Track-focussed as some other 'Hot Hatches' are. It isn't even the fastest 'Hot Hatch'. So is it the car equivalent of "white goods" as some Posters here like to denigrate it as?
Not in my opinion. It is a car that can fulfil the small Family-vehicle role very well but it is more than that; it does evoke the spirit of the 'Hot Hatch' even if it isn't the sharpest, fastest or most characterful. It is, simply, very capable at doing everything. It doesn't need to be best at any one thing or everything - albeit it can be argued that it is the best at being good at everything. And that is where it sells itself; it is what many - including myself - prefer.
It isn't 'shouty' it isn't brash. It is a car that can go from A-B without drama, looking sensible and good while also appearing nondescript and yet able to produce a turn of speed and driveability to bring a smile when the opportunity arises.
For some, its lack of a distinct character or racy looks - or even an appearance to stand out from the crowd of other Golf's and small cars - leaves them cold. Some can't get their jollies in anything that doesn't have 1000bhp and scrapes their bottoms on the tarmac or cause heads to turn as they glide by with a massive whale-tail stuck to their rear. Some need attention. I get that. But it is precisely the qualities the Golf does and doesn't have that endears it to others, like me. I can have fun in this car while not causing a stir. It is, after all, a quick 296bhp car. And the best small car at being good at everything.
Eloquently summarised Sir 
Olivera said:
The Golf R suffers a bit due to its Lease-R reputation, but an old Saab 9-3 is pure junk in comparison, with a chassis regarded as dogst 15 years ago.
The chassis that was "Dogst 15 years ago.t" was the earlier 9-3. not the SS like this model which was well received, I had a remapped 2.0 Aero and it handled really quite well, it wasnt huge fun and the ride was horrible, but it was effective, night and day better than the earlier model.That said, the Golf R is leagues ahead in every area, but then its several times more expensive.
Coolbanana said:
For some, its lack of a distinct character or racy looks - or even an appearance to stand out from the crowd of other Golf's and small cars - leaves them cold. Some can't get their jollies in anything that doesn't have 1000bhp and scrapes their bottoms on the tarmac or cause heads to turn as they glide by with a massive whale-tail stuck to their rear. Some need attention. I get that. But it is precisely the qualities the Golf does and doesn't have that endears it to others, like me. I can have fun in this car while not causing a stir. It is, after all, a quick 296bhp car. And the best small car at being good at everything.
Indeed. Some people want a "look at me" car, whilst others want something a little more subtle that blends in with the other traffic and doesn't attract attention to itself, and which is a good all-rounder and an Everyman. The Golf R is such a car. wormus said:
Here are a couple of examples that would do the trick:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Saab-93-9-3-2-8T-Turbo-...
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Saab-9-3-2-8-V6-Aero-Sp...
Sorry fella but anything with over 300 BHP on these old 9-3 (GM) chassis will just torque steer (with loose traction) well into 3th gear by which time the Yobbo Golf R would be a mile up the road. My 9-5 AERO torque steers with only 275 BHP. This is why SAAB themselves have always kept the power well under 300 BHP. I would imagine the Limited Edition 9-3 Turbo X with it's Heldex XWD (very similar to what the Golf R has) could potentially apply a bit over 300 BHP to the road unlike the earlier FWD 9-3s. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Saab-93-9-3-2-8T-Turbo-...
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Saab-9-3-2-8-V6-Aero-Sp...
Edited by Team Muttley on Sunday 29th July 23:17
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff