Morgan / Peugeot whoopsie
Discussion
ThatGuyWhoDoesStuff said:
Mr GrimNasty said:
No there isn't, not at the crucial point - easily avoidable if paying attention, using any sort of anticipation, and a competent driver.
He was either fiddling with the radio/phone or froze through being doddery or inexperienced.
This has been done to death on the bad driving video thread.
I've swerved around people pulling out at much greater speed and with far less space available.
Still the Morgan's fault, but it was avoidable.
He was either fiddling with the radio/phone or froze through being doddery or inexperienced.
This has been done to death on the bad driving video thread.
I've swerved around people pulling out at much greater speed and with far less space available.
Still the Morgan's fault, but it was avoidable.
What are you smoking?
That photo is almost exactly 1 second before impact. Perhaps you're looking at the streetview images, which are historical and don't have the new island and single lane?
The Morgan driver is very obviously at fault but I'd agree with an argument that the Pug driver could have turned the wheel to avoid a crash and worried about the horn later.
It's time they redesigned this type of junction onto a dual carriageway or similar A road junction.
Its not often you get a gap in both streams so you get people 'going for it'
Instead of planting a bollard in it, why cant they use the right hand lane there as an acceleration slip lane for people turning right like the Moggie, then allow some merge in turn a while later?
Its not often you get a gap in both streams so you get people 'going for it'
Instead of planting a bollard in it, why cant they use the right hand lane there as an acceleration slip lane for people turning right like the Moggie, then allow some merge in turn a while later?
DonkeyApple said:
I'm not sure. Looks to be loads of space on the cross hatching to stick a little Pug into. Plus, the nose of the Pug doesn't appear to be dipped as if under ABS level of braking.
The Morgan driver is very obviously at fault but I'd agree with an argument that the Pug driver could have turned the wheel to avoid a crash and worried about the horn later.
Thing is, it's very easy to judge with hindsight. Watching the video back, I think it's between about the 8-9 second mark that it would have become absolutely obvious that the Morgan was not going to stop and continue into his path. Impact is pretty much dead on 12 seconds, so that's 3-4 seconds maximum to do anything about it. He looks like he passed the island at about 11 seconds, so that's only a 1 second window of opportunity in which he can realistically do anything other than stamp on the brakes and hope for the best. And given that at that point, he is still carrying a hell of a lot of speed (braking down from 60-70MPH I guess?), even if he did think about swerving to avoid the collision, perhaps he thought that it was preferable to rear end the Morgan rather than risk losing control by jinking out of the way?The Morgan driver is very obviously at fault but I'd agree with an argument that the Pug driver could have turned the wheel to avoid a crash and worried about the horn later.
Who knows. I'd say his biggest mistake is perhaps not slowing down enough to anticipate an utterly cretinous manoeuvre by the Morgan driver, rather than what he did when it was clear he was going to hit it. I've been in similar situations like this, where I can see another vehicle crossing to the central reservation to pull into my path and I always find myself backing off and covering the brake because I always fear exactly this sort of thing happening, and them not stopping to give way. Perhaps the Peugeot driver has a bit more faith in his fellow man and assumed the Morgan would stop and wait.
Edited by Conscript on Monday 17th April 15:03
Conscript said:
DonkeyApple said:
I'm not sure. Looks to be loads of space on the cross hatching to stick a little Pug into. Plus, the nose of the Pug doesn't appear to be dipped as if under ABS level of braking.
The Morgan driver is very obviously at fault but I'd agree with an argument that the Pug driver could have turned the wheel to avoid a crash and worried about the horn later.
Thing is, it's very easy to judge with hindsight. Watching the video back, I think it's between about the 8-9 second mark that it would have become absolutely obvious that the Morgan was not going to stop and continue into his path. Impact is pretty much dead on 12 seconds, so that's 3-4 seconds maximum to do anything about it. He looks like he passed the island at about 11 seconds, so that's only a 1 second window of opportunity in which he can realistically do anything other than stamp on the brakes and hope for the best. And given that at that point, he is still carrying a hell of a lot of speed (braking down from 60-70MPH I guess?), even if he did think about swerving to avoid the collision, perhaps he thought that it was preferable to rear end the Morgan rather than risk losing control by jinking out of the way?The Morgan driver is very obviously at fault but I'd agree with an argument that the Pug driver could have turned the wheel to avoid a crash and worried about the horn later.
Who knows. I'd say his biggest mistake is perhaps not slowing down enough to anticipate an utterly cretinous manoeuvre by the Morgan driver, rather than what he did when it was clear he was going to hit it. I've been in similar situations like this, where I can see another vehicle crossing to the central reservation to pull into my path and I always find myself backing and covering the brake because I always fear exactly this sort of thing happening, and them not stopping to give way. Perhaps the Peugeot driver has a bit more faith in his fellow man and assumed the Morgan would stop and wait.
Edited by Conscript on Monday 17th April 15:02
Conscript said:
DonkeyApple said:
I'm not sure. Looks to be loads of space on the cross hatching to stick a little Pug into. Plus, the nose of the Pug doesn't appear to be dipped as if under ABS level of braking.
The Morgan driver is very obviously at fault but I'd agree with an argument that the Pug driver could have turned the wheel to avoid a crash and worried about the horn later.
Thing is, it's very easy to judge with hindsight. Watching the video back, I think it's between about the 8-9 second mark that it would have become absolutely obvious that the Morgan was not going to stop and continue into his path. Impact is pretty much dead on 12 seconds, so that's 3-4 seconds maximum to do anything about it. He looks like he passed the island at about 11 seconds, so that's only a 1 second window of opportunity in which he can realistically do anything other than stamp on the brakes and hope for the best. And given that at that point, he is still carrying a hell of a lot of speed (braking down from 60-70MPH I guess?), even if he did think about swerving to avoid the collision, perhaps he thought that it was preferable to rear end the Morgan rather than risk losing control by jinking out of the way?The Morgan driver is very obviously at fault but I'd agree with an argument that the Pug driver could have turned the wheel to avoid a crash and worried about the horn later.
Who knows. I'd say his biggest mistake is perhaps not slowing down enough to anticipate an utterly cretinous manoeuvre by the Morgan driver, rather than what he did when it was clear he was going to hit it. I've been in similar situations like this, where I can see another vehicle crossing to the central reservation to pull into my path and I always find myself backing off and covering the brake because I always fear exactly this sort of thing happening, and them not stopping to give way. Perhaps the Peugeot driver has a bit more faith in his fellow man and assumed the Morgan would stop and wait.
Edited by Conscript on Monday 17th April 15:03
There's a thread about this that started yesterday. Perhaps the mods could merge Them?
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
DonkeyApple said:
ThatGuyWhoDoesStuff said:
Mr GrimNasty said:
No there isn't, not at the crucial point - easily avoidable if paying attention, using any sort of anticipation, and a competent driver.
He was either fiddling with the radio/phone or froze through being doddery or inexperienced.
This has been done to death on the bad driving video thread.
I've swerved around people pulling out at much greater speed and with far less space available.
Still the Morgan's fault, but it was avoidable.
He was either fiddling with the radio/phone or froze through being doddery or inexperienced.
This has been done to death on the bad driving video thread.
I've swerved around people pulling out at much greater speed and with far less space available.
Still the Morgan's fault, but it was avoidable.
What are you smoking?
That photo is almost exactly 1 second before impact. Perhaps you're looking at the streetview images, which are historical and don't have the new island and single lane?
The Morgan driver is very obviously at fault but I'd agree with an argument that the Pug driver could have turned the wheel to avoid a crash and worried about the horn later.
Still doesnt excuse the Morgan pulling out though…
Morgan driver is a grade A ahole. Deep down I see it as karma, no sympathy for the Morgan driver but total sympathy for the Peugeot driver. If you're going to fail in the basic act of observation and pull out infront of another vehicle, I have no sympathy if they smash into you.
Hopefully it'll make the Morgan driver think twice next time.
Hopefully it'll make the Morgan driver think twice next time.
Warby80 said:
That stands out to me too, there doesnt really appear to be anywhere near enough braking from the Peugeot, no dipped nose or scrabbling of tyres?
Still doesnt excuse the Morgan pulling out though…
Yup. I can't think of any sane way to excuse the Moggie driver. Still doesnt excuse the Morgan pulling out though…
I wonder if he thought it was a 307 that was just further away?
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