Internal combustion engine days are numbered.
Discussion
https://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201617...
"The Government is committed to almost all cars and vans being zero emission by 2050 and will publish an updated strategy on support for the transition to zero emission road transport by March 2018."
I'll be off the road by then, but that's not as far away as it seems.
"The Government is committed to almost all cars and vans being zero emission by 2050 and will publish an updated strategy on support for the transition to zero emission road transport by March 2018."
I'll be off the road by then, but that's not as far away as it seems.
As long as it's only almost all. 
I can only see this as a good thing because almost all cars are bought by people with no interest in cars beyond their ability to get them from A to B with the minimum of fuss... the sooner those people are buying EVs, the less likely the government will see a need to ban ICEs for those of us who enjoy cars for other reasons.
The sooner I become enough of a minority to be so insignificant that the government ignores me the better.
I can only see this as a good thing because almost all cars are bought by people with no interest in cars beyond their ability to get them from A to B with the minimum of fuss... the sooner those people are buying EVs, the less likely the government will see a need to ban ICEs for those of us who enjoy cars for other reasons.
The sooner I become enough of a minority to be so insignificant that the government ignores me the better.
Edited by kambites on Friday 28th April 13:35
LHRFlightman said:
"The Government is committed to almost all cars and vans being zero emission by 2050..(
I think they needs to be edited to say ""The Government is committed to almost all new cars and vans being zero emission by 2050" because I am sure that is what they really mean.kambites said:
As long as it's only almost all.
I can only see this as a good thing because almost all cars are bought by people with no interest in cars beyond their ability to get them from A to B with the minimum of fuss... the sooner those people are buying EVs, the less likely the government will see a need to ban ICEs for those of us who enjoy cars for other reasons.
The sooner I become enough of a minority to be so insignificant that the government ignores me the better.
i quite like your logic but if/when ICE becomes very niche it will make it very expensive with very few options available. Ongoing development and improvements will also be extremely limited as there will be tiny engineering budgets. I can only see this as a good thing because almost all cars are bought by people with no interest in cars beyond their ability to get them from A to B with the minimum of fuss... the sooner those people are buying EVs, the less likely the government will see a need to ban ICEs for those of us who enjoy cars for other reasons.
The sooner I become enough of a minority to be so insignificant that the government ignores me the better.
Edited by kambites on Friday 28th April 13:35
Jag_NE said:
i quite like your logic but if/when ICE becomes very niche it will make it very expensive with very few options available. Ongoing development and improvements will also be extremely limited as there will be tiny engineering budgets.
True, but personally I have no interest in modern ICE powered cars anyway. 
Jag_NE said:
kambites said:
As long as it's only almost all.
I can only see this as a good thing because almost all cars are bought by people with no interest in cars beyond their ability to get them from A to B with the minimum of fuss... the sooner those people are buying EVs, the less likely the government will see a need to ban ICEs for those of us who enjoy cars for other reasons.
The sooner I become enough of a minority to be so insignificant that the government ignores me the better.
i quite like your logic but if/when ICE becomes very niche it will make it very expensive with very few options available. I can only see this as a good thing because almost all cars are bought by people with no interest in cars beyond their ability to get them from A to B with the minimum of fuss... the sooner those people are buying EVs, the less likely the government will see a need to ban ICEs for those of us who enjoy cars for other reasons.
The sooner I become enough of a minority to be so insignificant that the government ignores me the better.
Edited by kambites on Friday 28th April 13:35
I feel sorry for the young petrolhead around today as they will see the end.
I'll be almost 90 in 2050, so may not even be around to see it happen.
DoubleD said:
If they want zero emission cars then they will need to get rid of coal fired powerstations then.
Much sooner than 2050 https://www.carbonbrief.org/uk-plans-to-close-last...I think it is inevitable that ICE will start declining but we are a long way off from a scrappage scheme for all ICE vehicles so don't sell up just yet.
As for manufacturing producing CO2 well it will do initially but moving towards 0% carbon emissions for electricity production will eat into the CO2 footprint of that as well.
We need to separate our experiences and preferences from what is good as transport, most want safety, economy, quietness, comfort, image and enough performance so it isnt annoying, noise, ultimate handling and overkill performance are really, not partof it, and rightly so, even though EV's seem to be, in their relative infancy, not lacking performance.
We need to remember that really, we are statistically insignificant in terms of transport and, by 2050, a fair proportion of us wont be here anyway, if I live until then, I will be knocking 80, my lifespan pretty much done, this is more about people being born now.
The IC engine is a wonderful thing, but its pretty flawed and not a patch on an electric motor if you remove the energy storage from the equation, like many things, the IC engine is what could be made to work, it got developed way more than it should have, it seems pretty archaic burning fossil fuel int hat way even though we love it, its like other things that were realistically a bit crap that got developed until something better became viable and then it got dropped like a bag of s
t when a dog owner thinks nobody is looking.
CRT's - dissapeared in ten years from the LCD screen becoming mainstream
Vinyl - Replaced by CD's (and it did, really apart from the audiophiles and blokes with "decks" in the living room, "because DJ")
CD's - replaced by solid state storage which in turn has been replaced by spotify etc,
VHS - DVD - Blueray
DVD/Blueray - Streaming
The EV will be mainstream by 2050, of that i have no doubt, there will be challenges on the way, I dont think hybrids will be around that long, remember those VHS videos with a DVD slot ? ok they are a bi more useful but equally, seems like a bodge until the battery tech is up to par.
People are cottoning on to EV's now, and not just early adopters and eco folk, Teslas are genuinely desirable and do the job very well, they will improve as well, tot he point we will wonder why we bothered with IC engines, and we will become the equivalents of Audiophiles rattling on about warmth and tone of Vinyl, the case for EV's will be as strong as Spotify is over carrying a gramophone and 1000 records round for a little bit of a perceived benefit in sound quality.
In 100 years, people will look back at photos of us in front of a current car like we look on a bloke in a top hat in front of a traction engine.
We will lose things, the joy of driving as things become automated, but we really only care about it as we have had to, someone born today probably wont even have to learn. There will always be IC engined cars but I think we will see them all banned from cities eventually and they will become a bit like owning a horse, cant really go anywhere on it, but quite like them all the same.
We need to remember that really, we are statistically insignificant in terms of transport and, by 2050, a fair proportion of us wont be here anyway, if I live until then, I will be knocking 80, my lifespan pretty much done, this is more about people being born now.
The IC engine is a wonderful thing, but its pretty flawed and not a patch on an electric motor if you remove the energy storage from the equation, like many things, the IC engine is what could be made to work, it got developed way more than it should have, it seems pretty archaic burning fossil fuel int hat way even though we love it, its like other things that were realistically a bit crap that got developed until something better became viable and then it got dropped like a bag of s
t when a dog owner thinks nobody is looking.CRT's - dissapeared in ten years from the LCD screen becoming mainstream
Vinyl - Replaced by CD's (and it did, really apart from the audiophiles and blokes with "decks" in the living room, "because DJ")
CD's - replaced by solid state storage which in turn has been replaced by spotify etc,
VHS - DVD - Blueray
DVD/Blueray - Streaming
The EV will be mainstream by 2050, of that i have no doubt, there will be challenges on the way, I dont think hybrids will be around that long, remember those VHS videos with a DVD slot ? ok they are a bi more useful but equally, seems like a bodge until the battery tech is up to par.
People are cottoning on to EV's now, and not just early adopters and eco folk, Teslas are genuinely desirable and do the job very well, they will improve as well, tot he point we will wonder why we bothered with IC engines, and we will become the equivalents of Audiophiles rattling on about warmth and tone of Vinyl, the case for EV's will be as strong as Spotify is over carrying a gramophone and 1000 records round for a little bit of a perceived benefit in sound quality.
In 100 years, people will look back at photos of us in front of a current car like we look on a bloke in a top hat in front of a traction engine.
We will lose things, the joy of driving as things become automated, but we really only care about it as we have had to, someone born today probably wont even have to learn. There will always be IC engined cars but I think we will see them all banned from cities eventually and they will become a bit like owning a horse, cant really go anywhere on it, but quite like them all the same.
FourWheelDrift said:
I think the recent fashion for people to put wood burners in their homes is also to blame for inner city pollution
It's not just cars.
Most big cities are "smoke control areas" so wood burners are banned unless they can meet very strict emission criteria. Must like the proposed ULEZ for cars, I suppose, although I suspect stove manufactures have less tendency to install "cheat devices" to falsify test results. It's not just cars.
LHRFlightman said:
https://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201617...
"The Government is committed to almost all cars and vans being zero emission by 2050 and will publish an updated strategy on support for the transition to zero emission road transport by March 2018."
I'll be off the road by then, but that's not as far away as it seems.
A political declaration is hardly a scientific fact now is it ffs "The Government is committed to almost all cars and vans being zero emission by 2050 and will publish an updated strategy on support for the transition to zero emission road transport by March 2018."
I'll be off the road by then, but that's not as far away as it seems.
Firstly, there is no such thing as the planet United Kingdom. So whatever happens here, does not automatically mean it will happen in other parts of the globe.
Second. How many other things have been committed to... getting rid of poverty maybe, world piece, crime, certain diseases.
Basically believe it when it happens.
Let alone the fact 2050 is actually a long way away. And chances are few or none of the people involved today will be in 2050.
And not too mention the definition of 'zero emissions' is likely not set in stone either. Even electric vehicles produce some kind of emissions, just not from an exhaust pipe.
kambites said:
Jag_NE said:
i quite like your logic but if/when ICE becomes very niche it will make it very expensive with very few options available. Ongoing development and improvements will also be extremely limited as there will be tiny engineering budgets.
True, but personally I have no interest in modern ICE powered cars anyway. As for the thread, I don't care. I'll be 77 then and won't give a toss.
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