Sold a car privately - COURT ACTION
Discussion
Likes Fast Cars said:
CubanPete said:
Caveat emptor.
You don't have anything to worry about. 15 year old cars often require routine maintenance!
Enjoy the day out and don't forget to remind her that she will be liable for your costs if she loses.
Yep You don't have anything to worry about. 15 year old cars often require routine maintenance!
Enjoy the day out and don't forget to remind her that she will be liable for your costs if she loses.
To do 4,000 miles in 4 weeks on a 134k, 15 year old car that's known to go through oil and tyres quickly and then claim you mis-sold them the car...is a tad idiotic on their part.
Guaranteed the bloke who bought it off you then passed it onto a friend/family member with zero mechanical sympathy who decided a trip to Marbella and back would be a perfect way to run the car in...
Edited by daveco on Thursday 8th June 14:06
muussaah said:
Hello chaps, mainly for peace of mind... looking to see your view point on the following...
I sold a car (BMW 330ci 2003 - 134k) late Jan, answered all questions truthfully, listing was as described, excellent condition and running perfectly, cat d bla bla bla, usual description of my ownership of several months, sold due to being a lil too juicy on fuel... I sold it to a guy who I felt like was in a rush and just wanted to buy and leave, didnt even test drive! I insisted and he still said no need however I still took him out for my own peace of mind, he was happy and just handed the cash over, didnt ask any questions on arrival, he did ask on the phone about the rocker cover gasket leak which I told him about and he was aware of this (common issue) and had me drop the price from 2400 to 2100. Purchased and left happy! or so I thought...
4 weeks later I get a phone call from a lady demanding full refund because its got some faults and accused me of lying about the car being serviced 3 days prior, I also found out it had driven over 4000 miles in 4 weeks and she was stating the tyres are in poor condition so I have misrepresented the condition and the garage shes taken it to have said it will cost £4000 to fix some engine leak or something. I not having sold many cars in my lifetime said leave it with me I need to see where I stand with this then later that day called her back and said sorry I cannot do anything as its sold as seen and I described it to the best I can. shes now taking me to court however I did NOT sell the car to her and never met her, she seems to be the sister of the chap I sold the car to so is this not a worthless case whereby I have never dealt with the claimant? furthermore I have read online re this caveat emptor and have proof where I serviced the car 3 days prior to her buying the car from a reputable garage, the car has been driven to what I think an excessive amount in a short period.
The previous letter/garage receipt I have received, I responded back to Mr M*** (claimant) stating I will NOT be refunding due to the following reasons:-
I have not sold the above car to the claimant named above (Doesn't even have the same surname as the chap who I sold the car to)
I am a private seller.
Vehicle purchased for £2100, NOT £2150. (see exhibit C)
Car details:- 2003 BMW 3 Series Reg:- ******* Mileage:- 134000
Vehicle was advertised & described to the best of my knowledge and was in full working order at the time of sale. (see exhibit A)
Serviced by a garage 2 days prior to selling. (see exhibit B)
Sold as seen receipt was signed by both parties. (see exhibit C)
MOT History confirms it was roadworthy at the time of sale. (See exhibit D)
Claimant (Mr ****) was not interested in a test drive on arrival and was happy to purchase without, So I insisted as I found this rather odd and wanted him to, for my own peace of mind, to be sure he was happy however I found him to be in a hurry to leave throughout.
I have found out the car has been driven nearly 4000 miles in 3 weeks. Compare exhibit A/B/C to Exhibit E (Sent from claimant).
I would like to point out that the nature of cars is such that faults can arise at any given time, he inspected the vehicle and I answered all of the questions he asked truthfully such as the rocker cover gasket was leaking oil and the car was pulling to one side, hence the drop in price. He then said “I've looked around and am happy to buy” to which I responded “lets go for a test drive” to which he replied “no I am happy to buy without, she seems fine”. I must say I was a little on edge and after insisting, he agreed and we went for a test drive.
I strongly believe the claimant to be committing fraudulent activity by buying a car privately for short period of time and once they've had their use they no longer require the car so have now made these false claims.
Can anyone shed any light please for peace of mind as I am stressing out about this as it seems completely unnecessary, shes even put a charge in where shes asking for £30 interest a day until the court date! I find this absurd!
This person who actually bought the car from you - was the V5C filled out in his name?I sold a car (BMW 330ci 2003 - 134k) late Jan, answered all questions truthfully, listing was as described, excellent condition and running perfectly, cat d bla bla bla, usual description of my ownership of several months, sold due to being a lil too juicy on fuel... I sold it to a guy who I felt like was in a rush and just wanted to buy and leave, didnt even test drive! I insisted and he still said no need however I still took him out for my own peace of mind, he was happy and just handed the cash over, didnt ask any questions on arrival, he did ask on the phone about the rocker cover gasket leak which I told him about and he was aware of this (common issue) and had me drop the price from 2400 to 2100. Purchased and left happy! or so I thought...
4 weeks later I get a phone call from a lady demanding full refund because its got some faults and accused me of lying about the car being serviced 3 days prior, I also found out it had driven over 4000 miles in 4 weeks and she was stating the tyres are in poor condition so I have misrepresented the condition and the garage shes taken it to have said it will cost £4000 to fix some engine leak or something. I not having sold many cars in my lifetime said leave it with me I need to see where I stand with this then later that day called her back and said sorry I cannot do anything as its sold as seen and I described it to the best I can. shes now taking me to court however I did NOT sell the car to her and never met her, she seems to be the sister of the chap I sold the car to so is this not a worthless case whereby I have never dealt with the claimant? furthermore I have read online re this caveat emptor and have proof where I serviced the car 3 days prior to her buying the car from a reputable garage, the car has been driven to what I think an excessive amount in a short period.
The previous letter/garage receipt I have received, I responded back to Mr M*** (claimant) stating I will NOT be refunding due to the following reasons:-
I have not sold the above car to the claimant named above (Doesn't even have the same surname as the chap who I sold the car to)
I am a private seller.
Vehicle purchased for £2100, NOT £2150. (see exhibit C)
Car details:- 2003 BMW 3 Series Reg:- ******* Mileage:- 134000
Vehicle was advertised & described to the best of my knowledge and was in full working order at the time of sale. (see exhibit A)
Serviced by a garage 2 days prior to selling. (see exhibit B)
Sold as seen receipt was signed by both parties. (see exhibit C)
MOT History confirms it was roadworthy at the time of sale. (See exhibit D)
Claimant (Mr ****) was not interested in a test drive on arrival and was happy to purchase without, So I insisted as I found this rather odd and wanted him to, for my own peace of mind, to be sure he was happy however I found him to be in a hurry to leave throughout.
I have found out the car has been driven nearly 4000 miles in 3 weeks. Compare exhibit A/B/C to Exhibit E (Sent from claimant).
I would like to point out that the nature of cars is such that faults can arise at any given time, he inspected the vehicle and I answered all of the questions he asked truthfully such as the rocker cover gasket was leaking oil and the car was pulling to one side, hence the drop in price. He then said “I've looked around and am happy to buy” to which I responded “lets go for a test drive” to which he replied “no I am happy to buy without, she seems fine”. I must say I was a little on edge and after insisting, he agreed and we went for a test drive.
I strongly believe the claimant to be committing fraudulent activity by buying a car privately for short period of time and once they've had their use they no longer require the car so have now made these false claims.
Can anyone shed any light please for peace of mind as I am stressing out about this as it seems completely unnecessary, shes even put a charge in where shes asking for £30 interest a day until the court date! I find this absurd!
I suspect hes a trader who she has sent to buy the car for her and has taken the extra £50 plus whatever she has paid him for his trouble.
Even if it really is "her brother", then you sold the car to him, not her.
Have you received paperwork from the Court?
If you have, have you responded outlining your position?
regarding above, you can have the case transferred to your nearest court as you are the defendant.
But....As others have said, if a genuine private sale with an advert that wasn't deceptive they haven't got a leg to stand on.
If you have, have you responded outlining your position?
regarding above, you can have the case transferred to your nearest court as you are the defendant.
But....As others have said, if a genuine private sale with an advert that wasn't deceptive they haven't got a leg to stand on.
My 2p's worth although I'm not a lawyer so it's probably worthless:
- If the name and address on the receipt is not hers then she has no claim against you surely? Did you complete and return the V5 document with his details on it? I always do this and you can even do it online.
- Can you counter-claim for any costs such as loss of earnings for attending court?
- My understanding of caveat emptor is that her only basis for suing you would be misrepresentation which she would have to prove
48Valves said:
A lesson to others when selling a car.
Do not put anything that can be taken objectively in an advert. Stick to facts.
One mans drives perfectly in another mand bag pf spanners.
I understand where you're coming from however if you write drives perfectly and someone drives away on the day and breaks down that in reality is luck and I wouldn't dare contact the seller because I would have carried out all my check and researched about that particular car and to know what I need to look out for in advance, in my ownership the car drove flawlessly now if shes contacted me 4 weeks later racked up 4k miles its likely she was going to have to change tyres and problems can arise at anytime.Do not put anything that can be taken objectively in an advert. Stick to facts.
One mans drives perfectly in another mand bag pf spanners.
MadProfessor said:
My 2p's worth although I'm not a lawyer so it's probably worthless:
- If the name and address on the receipt is not hers then she has no claim against you surely? Did you complete and return the V5 document with his details on it? I always do this and you can even do it online.
- Can you counter-claim for any costs such as loss of earnings for attending court?
- My understanding of caveat emptor is that her only basis for suing you would be misrepresentation which she would have to prove
Yes, the v5 was all filled out correctly in the chaps name and both sold as seen receipts were also signed by he himself.- If the name and address on the receipt is not hers then she has no claim against you surely? Did you complete and return the V5 document with his details on it? I always do this and you can even do it online.
- Can you counter-claim for any costs such as loss of earnings for attending court?
- My understanding of caveat emptor is that her only basis for suing you would be misrepresentation which she would have to prove
I guess the counter claim will now be submitted as and when I am in court.
daveco said:
+1
To do 4,000 miles in 4 weeks on a 134k, 15 year old car that's known to go through oil and tyres quickly and then claim you mis-sold them the car...is a tad idiotic on their part.
Guaranteed the bloke who bought it off you then passed it onto a friend/family member with zero mechanical sympathy who decided a trip to Marbella and back would be a perfect way to run the car in...
I just hope the judge sees the truth and doesn't buy into her lies and discrepencies which to me are loud and clear... but that last part of your post made me chuckle :LTo do 4,000 miles in 4 weeks on a 134k, 15 year old car that's known to go through oil and tyres quickly and then claim you mis-sold them the car...is a tad idiotic on their part.
Guaranteed the bloke who bought it off you then passed it onto a friend/family member with zero mechanical sympathy who decided a trip to Marbella and back would be a perfect way to run the car in...
Edited by daveco on Thursday 8th June 14:06
muussaah said:
MadProfessor said:
My 2p's worth although I'm not a lawyer so it's probably worthless:
- If the name and address on the receipt is not hers then she has no claim against you surely? Did you complete and return the V5 document with his details on it? I always do this and you can even do it online.
- Can you counter-claim for any costs such as loss of earnings for attending court?
- My understanding of caveat emptor is that her only basis for suing you would be misrepresentation which she would have to prove
Yes, the v5 was all filled out correctly in the chaps name and both sold as seen receipts were also signed by he himself.- If the name and address on the receipt is not hers then she has no claim against you surely? Did you complete and return the V5 document with his details on it? I always do this and you can even do it online.
- Can you counter-claim for any costs such as loss of earnings for attending court?
- My understanding of caveat emptor is that her only basis for suing you would be misrepresentation which she would have to prove
I guess the counter claim will now be submitted as and when I am in court.
You've all the paperwork to prove it.
She needs to take it up with the person she subsequently bought it off - family member or not.
muussaah said:
I just hope the judge sees the truth and doesn't buy into her lies and discrepencies which to me are loud and clear... but that last part of your post made me chuckle :L
Given she didnt buy the car off you and all the paperwork supports that, then its going to be hard NOT to see through it.daemon said:
You didnt sell her the car. End of.
You've all the paperwork to prove it.
She needs to take it up with the person she subsequently bought it off - family member or not.
What if she is representing him? surely it still needs to be him as the claimant and myself as the defendant correct?You've all the paperwork to prove it.
She needs to take it up with the person she subsequently bought it off - family member or not.
I guess there are a lot of what ifs and I will find out in due course what action (if any) she will take...
Likes Fast Cars said:
IANAL but it seems to me like you're on firm ground. I am assuming the brother sold it to her??? Hence her interest in it??? So she should sue him.
Can you check the ownership / registered owner details online? May be worth doing to get a clearer picture of the ownership.
I recall there is a schedule or rule for interest calculations (on the court website somewhere) which is nothing like £30 per day interest - total b
ks and I would think the judge will throw that out.
I have a feeling she is representing him, don't know why, he seemed to know what he was talking about when viewing the car but anyhow I am feeling a lil better seeing as others agree the interest shes added is completely stupid!Can you check the ownership / registered owner details online? May be worth doing to get a clearer picture of the ownership.
I recall there is a schedule or rule for interest calculations (on the court website somewhere) which is nothing like £30 per day interest - total b
ks and I would think the judge will throw that out.MK1RS Bruce said:
Seriously are you actually worried?? Anything that was written in the advert is completely subjective anyway.
I'm not worried as such its just something which is on my mind if you know what I mean... It's not nice knowing that I am having to fill out court forms and waste time on something as stupid as this, it's like if you wanted warranty, go to a trader or a dealership.Exactly, that was MY viewpoint on how the car has been for me, when I stated your welcome to bring an rac inspection he replied, no I have had a few of these cars before so no need. but as said before I think the biggest point so far is this woman appears to be the claimant whereby I have never met or dealt with her ever.
IANAL, however off the top of my head...
1) You did not sell the vehicle to the claimant, therefore no contract exists between the claimant and defendant, the claim must fail
2) Alternatively, the vehicle was sold "as seen" privately and no warranty given or implied
3) Alternatively, any claim for misrepresentation is denied
1) You did not sell the vehicle to the claimant, therefore no contract exists between the claimant and defendant, the claim must fail
2) Alternatively, the vehicle was sold "as seen" privately and no warranty given or implied
3) Alternatively, any claim for misrepresentation is denied
janesmith1950 said:
IANAL, however off the top of my head...
1) You did not sell the vehicle to the claimant, therefore no contract exists between the claimant and defendant, the claim must fail
2) Alternatively, the vehicle was sold "as seen" privately and no warranty given or implied
3) Alternatively, any claim for misrepresentation is denied
Hi could you elaborate on your 3rd point? Misrepresentation is what shes claiming for...1) You did not sell the vehicle to the claimant, therefore no contract exists between the claimant and defendant, the claim must fail
2) Alternatively, the vehicle was sold "as seen" privately and no warranty given or implied
3) Alternatively, any claim for misrepresentation is denied
Thanks
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